Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
TimC

Bike vs. car in the twisties

Recommended Posts

This probably isn't the post you were expecting from the thread title.  I'm wondering how many of you have sports (or sporty) cars you've whipped around the same twisties as your motorcycle.  I have a favorite route about an hour from home, not really technical, but some very nice curves (2nd and 3rd gear) and sweepers.  I've ridden this route probably 5-10 times the last few years.  Takes me 3-4 hours door-to-door, and the ride totals 150-170 miles depending on the exact route that day.  I don't have the turns memorized, but I'm pretty comfortable on this route.  Also, it helps the pavement is very good and there isn't much traffic.

 

This past Sunday afternoon I finally took my 2018 Miata GT on that route and had an absolute blast.  I've been wanting to do this since I bought the car a couple years ago, and this was the first time I've taken the car on any decent roads like that, other than a few good corners closer to home.  I've never been on a track with the bike or car, and this was my first time getting a car into some decent curves.

 

So my question is this, are you more comfortable in the same twisties on your bike or in your car, especially when you're pushing it a bit?  Much like being on the bike, it took me a little while to get comfortable cornering the car kind of hard, as 1) I'm not that fast, 2) I don't know the car's limits all that well, and 3) I definitely didn't want to crash it!  I'll add that my Miata is wearing summer performance tires and the temps were in the low 60s, so I was hesitant to put too much faith in tire grip.  While it's hard to say for sure after just one drive like this, I don't know that I'll ever be as comfortable in the twisties in my car as I am on my bike.  Maybe it's because I have a much more seat time on good roads on the bike, gained over the last dozen years, but I just feel like I have more control on the smaller and more agile machine.

 

Anyway, thoughts from the VFRD crowd?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 I have a vfr1200 and also had a Miata.  Was much faster through the corners with the VFR.  It is not that the car couldn't corner, it handled quite well actually.  I believe it was the fact that the car would sling you from side to side in the seat where the bike is nice and smooth through the corners.  Also, my passenger did not like going fast in the Miata but loves cornering on the bike.  That probably didn't help the situation any.

 

However, during the summer, it was nice when we got back from a hot ride to dump all of the riding gear, put on shorts, flops and a t shirt and head out for a jaunt with the top down.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On normal roads, the bike always until about 110mph, then I'm usually happier in the car. But bike on track at any speed. There was a test done a few years ago, with a sports car & bike, even on a continuous circle test the bike was just a little quicker. But in most performance car V bike race track tests the cars are always significantly quicker in the corners, but lose out on acceleration, so the bike usually wins, by a nose, having slowed the cars in the corners by using its acceleration to get to every next corner first.  But the cars are true super cars & 10K for a bike comapred to 150-200K+ for the car, on that basis alone the bike wins.

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I take my cage on my twisties runs and the weak point is not so much the speed (but it is. haha ) or tyre grip, for mine it is the brakes..

 

There is a loop of pure corners that's approx 40 klms and as I came to the end, which the last say 5-10k are down hill, a plume of brake smoke passed me by as I came to a stop.

 

So for the twisties I'd say brakes, tyres, handling/suspension and then performance are the order for cages. 

 

Ymmv

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cages are fast into a corner due to their wide tires and slow to accelerate out of the corner due to their weight... So when I pass a Porsche or a Corvette and the race is on in the bendy bits I slow them way down going into the corner then squirt out of the corner and leave them dead... he he he... that can really frustrate them...

 

 

MrRC45TahoeCloseUpJPG.JPG

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suppose it really depends on what bike vs what car.......

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also which rider vs which driver ?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, boOZZIE said:

I take my cage on my twisties runs and the weak point is not so much the speed (but it is. haha ) or tyre grip, for mine it is the brakes..

This is why so many sports cars now have upgraded brake options.  My Miata is stock, of course, but I was conscious of brake fade just in case.  But I wasn't driving *that* hard, plus I used some engine braking at times, and even trail braking, like I would on the bike.  Plus this route wasn't like NC Route 28 or the Dragon, as there are enough straights between decent curves that the brakes would never overheat.

55 minutes ago, mello dude said:

I suppose it really depends on what bike vs what car.......

Well, stock Miatas aren't exactly fast., lol.  That car's beauty is carrying speed through the corners, not bolting out of them!  My 6th gen. VFR blows my car out of the water off the line and out of corners.

47 minutes ago, Philois1984 said:

Also which rider vs which driver ?

I'm not fast on the bike or the car, but like I said in my initial post, I'm more comfortable on the bike.  Maybe if I do this type of driving more often I'll get more comfortable doing it.  And that's a great goal, except at one point four riders on sportbikes (or sporty bikes) passed me going the other way, and for a moment I was really jealous.  I think if the weather is good enough for a fast drive in the twisties, I'd rather be on the bike.

 

Thanks for the comments, everyone!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Philois1984 said:

Also which rider vs which driver ?

I learned that the hard way at a track session on my 6th gen.  I thought I was doing really well,  peg feeler occasionally touching in the tightest corners, getting a bit full of myself, thinking I must be some kind of hot stuff running the bike near its limit - that is until one of the instructors on another 6th gen went around me and left me behind.  WTF???   :blink:    I never met him,  but he put a real whooping on me.  I felt about 6 inches tall after that - very humbling.  It was what really hammered home to me that it's not the bike,  but rider skill that's important.  Chuck Yeager once said "The airplane knows when it's in competent hands."  The same is true for bikes.  

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I took my wife's Prius fully occupied seats up The Snake in Malibu. The family loved it and when we got to the Ranch up top we were headed to I had used up all the battery power driving out of the turns as hard as I could. 

Ok. I realize it's a clown car and not a sport car but we all got a good chuckle out of it. 

56 years old now. Almost due for a sportscar.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, VFR Capt.Bob said:

 

56 years old now. Almost due for an RC51

Fixed that for you :tongue:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, VFR Capt.Bob said:

56 years old now. Almost due for a sportscar.

I turned 50 last summer, just 4 weeks before I bought that new Miata.  But while some people would see it as a midlife crisis car, the story is deeper than that.

 

I'd never really wanted a convertible or a roadster, so while I thought the Miata was kind of cool, it was never on my shopping list.  Plus, from 1997 to 2017 or so, I had dependent children and so I needed a car with a backseat.  Once the kids had their own car, however, that freed me up to get pretty much anything I wanted.  When the ND Miata came out I thought they looked very sharp.  And since I didn't need a backseat anymore, I checked one out.  Still too small, I thought, but I kept thinking about it even after I bought another small sedan a few years ago.

 

Fast forward to summer 2018, and my wife's aunt came very close to dying from sepsis, which resulted from an infection caused by a kidney stone.  Seriously, she was *this* close to dying.  Thankfully, she is fully recovered!  Anyway, I started thinking, "Ya know, I don't want to be 60-70 years old or on my deathbed wishing I'd bought that sweet little sports car when I could have, and when I was still young enough to enjoy it - and limber enough to get in and out of it!"  Got a killer deal on the car and I absolutely love it.  Out of the dozen or so cars I've owned and/or daily driven, this is hands-down my very favorite.  Zero regrets.

 

So my advice is don't wait too long.  I've been thinking the same thing lately about a couple Ducatis for sale locally...  😉 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice story TimC. I think the Miata in Australia is the Mazda MX5 am I right? It's a beautiful looking little sports car. In 2018 I came very close to buying one in the Machine Grey colour, garage space was my problem. Glad you're loving the Miata. Enjoy.

Cheers.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I used to do the sports car thing quite awhile back and had a garage with both -  nice sports car(s) and a bike(s).

But I began to notice that on the fantastically sunny perfect days, that I would take a bike out a and the sports car would sit. 

Well day umm. I eventually discovered that while I like the cars, I am a true bike guy to the core. And then I decided to sell the car(s)

and buy more bikes! 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At the pinnacle - F1 vs MotoGP, F1 wins and it's not even close.  That being said, IMO, it takes more skill to ride a bike fast than drive a car fast... 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, TimC said:

I turned 50 last summer, just 4 weeks before I bought that new Miata.  But while some people would see it as a midlife crisis car, the story is deeper than that.

 

I'd never really wanted a convertible or a roadster, so while I thought the Miata was kind of cool, it was never on my shopping list.  Plus, from 1997 to 2017 or so, I had dependent children and so I needed a car with a backseat.  Once the kids had their own car, however, that freed me up to get pretty much anything I wanted.  When the ND Miata came out I thought they looked very sharp.  And since I didn't need a backseat anymore, I checked one out.  Still too small, I thought, but I kept thinking about it even after I bought another small sedan a few years ago.

 

Fast forward to summer 2018, and my wife's aunt came very close to dying from sepsis, which resulted from a common urinary tract infection.  Seriously, she was *this* close to dying.  Thankfully, she is fully recovered!  Anyway, I started thinking, "Ya know, I don't want to be 60-70 years old or on my deathbed wishing I'd bought that sweet little sports car when I could have, and when I was still young enough to enjoy it - and limber enough to get in and out of it!"  Got a killer deal on the car and I absolutely love it.  Out of the dozen or so cars I've owned and/or daily driven, this is hands-down my very favorite.  Zero regrets.

 

So my advice is don't wait too long.  I've been thinking the same thing lately about a couple Ducatis for sale locally...  😉 

Hi Tim, my wife always wanted an MX5 and in 2001 I was extremely generous and bought her one with her very own money. That’s just the sort of guy I am. We still have it and she still loves it. What surprised me when we bought it was just how much I enjoyed driving it. The balance and steering are perfect. I would like about double the power but it is such a fun car to drive. She has 90,000km on the clock now and still looks and runs great. The soft top roof is still in great condition, no leaks. I just armour all it every month. I’m not very graceful getting in and out though.

09EF7332-51D6-48E5-ADED-C45F0B017B50.jpeg

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow, looks sensational, what a generous fella, of course using her cash! Bloody hell if only I could talk my lady into the same deal:blink:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Samuelx said:

At the pinnacle - F1 vs MotoGP, F1 wins and it's not even close.  That being said, IMO, it takes more skill to ride a bike fast than drive a car fast... 

At Silverstone the F1 lap record is  1 m 27.39 sec while the MotoGP lap record is 1m 59.993 sec. You can’t beat downforce through corners.25EFAD04-3613-451B-8A4E-2C0474E701DA.thumb.png.a0973f2954ca9f4281bf753e1850a36e.png489F375B-ECD4-46B7-8641-EAC29507499D.thumb.png.dc5f9cc13a3ba4aace4ce2a8af56678f.png

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Grum -- Yes, the car is technically known as the MX-5 everywhere, but here in the US if you say MX-5 to non-car people they'll just look at you funny.  Most people here know it as the Miata.

 

Philois -- Beautiful color on that car, and a great wheel combination (which looks like stock).  Mine is the Machine Gray Metallic.  Not as terrific looking as Mazda's Soul Red, but classy looking IMHO.  The pic below was taken just after a recent wash.

 

The weather for this weekend looks very good for Saturday.  Thinking about an all day ride on the VFR.  It's been a stressful week, and I could really use some seat time.

 

MX5 pic.jpg

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great choice Tim, my Accord is basically the same color!  🙂

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm stuck in the 80's so cars were not fast, but lots of fun. My motorcycles will always be faster, but fun is equal among them. Lots of times a good handling slower car can be a blast, you learn to carry momentum.  I live an hour from Shady Valley and lots of good roads, so they all get to have fun.

IMG_20140413_112305.jpg

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A reasonably modern sports car will demolish even the fastest bikes on twisty public roads. 

 

I put this theory to the test constantly in the hills above Napa...R1s, 1199s etc are dispatched with absolute ease, especially with the car's electronic nannies turned on. Same went for the MR2 Spyder I used to drive - the safety net is just so much bigger in a car, so you're more willing to push. Bikes only race ahead on the straights.

 

It's about 60 miles for the "loop," and I'd guess I'm 10 minutes slower on a bike (ease of passing aside). It's a route I've ridden and driven hundreds of times and have every corner memorized.

IMG_6276.JPG

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, SamW said:

I'm stuck in the 80's so cars were not fast, but lots of fun. My motorcycles will always be faster, but fun is equal among them. Lots of times a good handling slower car can be a blast, you learn to carry momentum.  I live an hour from Shady Valley and lots of good roads, so they all get to have fun.

IMG_20140413_112305.jpg

I can't remember the last time I saw a 944.  Great cars.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, mello dude said:

I used to do the sports car thing quite awhile back and had a garage with both -  nice sports car(s) and a bike(s).

But I began to notice that on the fantastically sunny perfect days, that I would take a bike out a and the sports car would sit. 

Well day umm. I eventually discovered that while I like the cars, I am a true bike guy to the core. And then I decided to sell the car(s)

and buy more bikes! 

If I were going to have a sports car,  it would be an S2000.  Any car that can turn 8,000+  rpm and has a manual gear box has got to be a blast to drive.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm stuck in the 80's cars too....

20150212_174655.jpg

20150212_174641.jpg

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy.