elfreako Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 https://youtu.be/VPnUdUAUO40 According to this guy I was at fault, regardless that he moved into my lane forcing me over, and when I moved back into my right wheel track he took my mirror off. He refuses to pay and referred me to his insurance company, and the cost of following it thru (price and no claims cost of insurance) do not justify it. Was I in the wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted February 27, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 27, 2016 I would count myself lucky seeing that 5 sec past the mirror incident you pass a double motorbike accident!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Switchblade Posted February 27, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 27, 2016 He clearly hits you . The pizza delivery guy is all over the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chanmenie Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Well you have his registration number, you could give It to your insurance co, but I reckon insurance companies would say 50 / 50 The road is quite narrow for two vehicles and you are in the middle of the lanes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Bent Posted February 27, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 27, 2016 He hit your vehicle. Period. Or did your mirror come off all by itself? My 2 cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lshark Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 you're both on the wrong side of the road !!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V4 Rosso Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Was I in the wrong? I think so, on several occasions. First ,there was plenty of room for you to move over so the cager could also pass the vehicle turning right. We want those cagers to give us some space so we can filter, this works both ways. At the time where the both of you collide, you are moving from your line into his. It is not clear where exactly he was at that time, beside you or behind you. If he was indeed behind you he should/could have stayed behind. And finally you see there is an accident with a rider down in the center of the street and you pass the car on the left obstructing the car from moving over to keep a safe distance from the downed rider. Was that really necessary? Just my opinion after watching that video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Well you have his registration number, you could give It to your insurance co, but I reckon insurance companies would say 50 / 50 The road is quite narrow for two vehicles and you are in the middle of the lanes. This van driver got behind someone making a turn and then ended up behind the motorcycle accident. He is concerned with not running over people in front of him, and very well may swerve over occasionally to avoid them. You know that, even if swerving over is not legal and he is supposed to wait for clearance. On one hand I would say you absolutely cannot be immediately next to this guy. If you were in a car he would respect you because he doesn't want to scrape the entire side of his van. But you are on a motorcycle and he is implicitly okay with running you over and killing you because he can wash the skin marks off his truck with no big deal. But on the other hand the traffic in both lanes stops then speeds up constantly, so it was impossible for you to keep yourself in front/left of him where he would always see you. But knowing all of that, and if those indeed are two lanes, you are smack dab in the middle of them. He is in his lane when he takes out your mirror. You appear to be defending your position, or getting a good view of traffic maybe, but you cannot defend that spot against large heavy vehicles that make bugs out of humans, especially knowing the above, that he may need to swerve over. I am assuming those are two lanes. Yes I think I would let this one go and take it as a hard lesson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checksix Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Buy a new mirror and be happy you're not the guy laying in the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Mohawk Posted February 27, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 27, 2016 Looks 50/50 to me, as stated above there was room for both of you, you can't give space then take it back. No real damage done, a mirror is cheaper than insurance excess. Live & learn. Alternately just keep an ice pick on your bike for those mad moments when someone refuses to stop or badly cuts you up, follow to next light, pick hole in roof above drivers head then ride off. That's what a courier I knew in London used to do, but he was mad as a box of frogs :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Switchblade Posted February 27, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 27, 2016 Looks 50/50 to me, as stated above there was room for both of you, you can't give space then take it back. No real damage done, a mirror is cheaper than insurance excess. Live & learn. Alternately just keep an ice pick on your bike for those mad moments when someone refuses to stop or badly cuts you up, follow to next light, pick hole in roof above drivers head then ride off. That's what a courier I knew in London used to do, but he was mad as a box of frogs :) I thought it was much more less confrontational over there . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marsman99 Posted February 27, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 27, 2016 I'd chalk it up as collateral damage and be happy you and you're bike remained upright and you only need to replace a mirror. Poor chap on the ground there has bigger issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotardMenace Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 From what I saw it was his fault period. You had the lane, he needed to wait before merging and he obviously knew you were there as well. I say he needs to pay for the mirror. I'm not sure what people are thinking saying your at fault or 50/50. He filters right into your bike and it appears to be a company truck. Call the company and see what they tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elfreako Posted February 27, 2016 Author Share Posted February 27, 2016 I ran this video thru a number of people at work, and just like here the opinions on who's at fault vary. I can partially understand those who say 50/50, but I still don't see it being my fault completely when he had to merge behind me when passing the car turning right and the road goes from two lanes to one. I guess we can agree to disagree there. I did call his company, they looked at the video and obviously sided with him. They won't budge, and I'm guess their calling bluff, telling me to have this dealt with their insurance company, as they know it will cause me more pain than them. ....I was wondering how many people were going to comment on the guy just past the lights. Poor chap, at least that wasn't me. I'm not sure about anyone else, but I have been taught (and believe) to own my road. If there are two lanes going the same way, then stay on the right wheel track closer to the other lane (or the opposite way for those backward countries :P ). I do this to prevent people coming into my lane, and giving me enough space to move over if someone did try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I'm not sure about anyone else, but I have been taught (and believe) to own my road. If there are two lanes going the same way, then stay on the right wheel track closer to the other lane (or the opposite way for those backward countries :P ). I do this to prevent people coming into my lane, and giving me enough space to move over if someone did try. You cannot defend yourself against cars and trucks, they will run you over! You don't own your space. Anyone who pulls over and flattens you owns the space. If you are right up against them, you have no time nor space to dodge them when they come over, and you are assuring this event, or worse, will happen again. Your point of view assumes that everyone around you will abide by your ownership. They won't. Even if 99.99999% of them do, when you meet the 1 that doesn't, it's curtains for you my friend! With this extremely slim road the tenet of left lane/middle lane/right lane is somewhat of a nuance, so that makes the "what should I do in this situation" difficult to answer. On the freeway when vehicles pull up behind me I immediately pull to the opposite side of the lane, and make sure I am in their view. This gives me lots of time and space to move if they should encroach. On this very narrow road, it is somewhat different when the space across the lane is so slim. Face it, there is not a lot of space to select from. However I still think you are setting yourself up to be run over by the next person who is on their cell phone. If you want to pursue this, the only authority of fault is the police. I do not think there is any harm in showing this to them. If they side with you, you may fill out an affidavit and they will issue a citation. Of course I am not sure how things work where you are, so it may be different. But if you can solicit a citation, now you can go right to insurance. And you will know that the company is going to pay higher premiums and such, all because they did not want to do the right thing and pay for the damage. If you want to make a stand I think that effort would be worth it. It would at least be a good exercise in figuring out how the system works and seeing if it works on your behalf. What else do you have to do on a Saturday anyways? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Switchblade Posted February 27, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 27, 2016 To me it's a slam dunk the guy in the van clip you on purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotardMenace Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I'm not sure of your laws on that side of the pond but I can tell you here in Arizona he would be issued a citation for moving left not in safety. I was a motor officer for 10 years and had I seen that video I would have written him the ticket! Just my 2 cents and I would push the issue if it was me, but its your time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chanmenie Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Elfreako as annoying as it is, the van driver was an arse, but just let it go, the police won't want to know and your insurance company won't pursue it Just chalk it down to bad luck. Knight is absolutely right don't play with cars, vans and trucks in the traffic, you will come off worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V4 Rosso Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I'm not sure about anyone else, but I have been taught (and believe) to own my road.Me too. But it is either that or lane sharing, not changing modes every other second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
750 Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I'll be brutally honest here, you fucked around and it cost you your mirror. Why sit behind traffic when you can filter. I'd have taken that gap at 26 seconds and been off, doing the obvious shoulder check to ensure he saw me...then a polite nod to say thanks. However, he took a tight right overtake, in the eyes of the law - you were filtering and therefore you owned that bit of road, he would be seen as at fault. He had to move over left to avoid the central island, another case of him being at fault. I filter in much, much worse traffic than that and have done for years, so far I've only come a-cropper once, a car decided to change lanes and took my back wheel with him. 8mph and two broken ribs, a broken knuckle and an 8 hour hospital stay later, I vowed never to hang around between cars again. Move or get squashed. Filtering is THE safest way to use a motorbike, no matter what any uneducated twonk might tell you, don't be afraid to get stuck into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFR4Lee Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 Next time do like the rider that passed you on the left. Mirrors can be expensive, but even so it's not worth pursuing when you have no real chance of getting paid for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer JZH Posted February 28, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 28, 2016 Regardless of fault, did he stop and exchange details with you? Not doing so is an offense under s.170 RTA 1988. If details were not exchanged at the scene, each driver, including you, is required to report the incident to the police. The police will not prosecute in most cases, but will send out a s.172 notice to the van's registered keeper, which should eventually identify the driver, to allow the incident to be resolved by the respective insurers. Speaking of which, your insurer may require you to report the incident to them regardless of whether you make a claim. Your policy will state the exact requirements applying to you. However, most insurance companies will ask upon renewal if there have been any incidents, regardless of fault, and you would be committing fraud if you failed to disclose... (Yes, that means your premium may increase, even if you do not make a claim against anyone...) Ciao, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Switchblade Posted February 28, 2016 Member Contributer Share Posted February 28, 2016 Now you have some free legal advice, what a great site . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elfreako Posted February 28, 2016 Author Share Posted February 28, 2016 Regardless of fault, did he stop and exchange details with you? Not doing so is an offense under s.170 RTA 1988. If details were not exchanged at the scene, each driver, including you, is required to report the incident to the police. The police will not prosecute in most cases, but will send out a s.172 notice to the van's registered keeper, which should eventually identify the driver, to allow the incident to be resolved by the respective insurers. Speaking of which, your insurer may require you to report the incident to them regardless of whether you make a claim. Your policy will state the exact requirements applying to you. However, most insurance companies will ask upon renewal if there have been any incidents, regardless of fault, and you would be committing fraud if you failed to disclose... (Yes, that means your premium may increase, even if you do not make a claim against anyone...) Ciao, Thanks for the advice. He didn't actually stop to exchange details, I had to pull up next to him and tell him to pull over, and was reluctant at first, but eventually did. I kept my camera rolling for the entire time talking to him, just in case, as you never know how some people in London will react. I also called my insurer, and they said I don't have to report it if I don't want to make a claim, regardless if it was my fault or not. But then I fall into the trap of my premium going up and all that too. Hmmmmm.... I wonder when it comes time to renew my cover and they ask the question have I ever been in an accident in the last 12 months, will they have kept a record of me calling up and asking about how the claiming system works when someone took my mirror off..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volfy Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 Not sure how traffic laws are in UK, but here in the States, this is how I would see it: 1. You were up front and therefore had the right of way of the entire width of your lane - and there was ONLY one lane at the time of collision. You were at the center of the lane. The fact that you move slightly side to side in your lane does NOT mean you lost the right of way. A motorcyclist may choose to ride to one side of his/her lane for a multitude of safety reasons. Any other vehicle that intrudes into the width of your lane is violating your right of way. 2. The car was behind you and clipped your mirror as he was trying to pass you. The collision was a result of passing with insufficient space to do so. Here in the States, passing is explicitly allowed when a vehicle can safely do so. In your case, the other driver clearly did not meet that criteria. If I were you, I would not get your own insurance co involved. File a claim with the other guy's insurance and use your cam recording as proof of their insured's negligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.