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Trying To Revive A 1993 Vfr 750, Incomplete... And Flooded!


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I am considering buying tools to change the bearings by myself. I am thinking about a Motion Pro bearing remover set and also the driver set. This is good investment I think. So I could do the front wheel and the swingarm pivot.

But I am worried about the bearings that need an hydraulic press (rear hub and sprocket carrier). We can find cheap hydraulic presses here via Amazon but they are from China (what a surprise!) and quality does not seems to be always there (according to reviews). I had this or that in mind. Also I did not have in mind to start a repair shop (and I live in an appartment, so limited space/storage).

Once on forums, I found an interesting Mc Gyver option, see here:

roulementPresse.jpg.dcb72705397c2b5ee3ed60f6589d8ea0.jpg

All you need is a bottle jack and 2 solid walls. Extracting old bearing seems feasible but inserting new one would additional care to be sure the whole installation is in line. Anyone has already done that? What would be the pressure needed for such a move?

Thanks a lot in advance for your feedback.

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Yup ! Left it is. 

RC36Rider's pic is a little misleading, because the wire he circled looks like it is going the wrong way.  It goes down, directly to the neutral switch on the lower engine casing.  There is no missing

Clutch received and mounted last week-end:     I let clutch plates in fresh oil to wet them:     Now, engine is back in the garage. It left my balcony after alm

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I am considering buying tools to change the bearings by myself. I am thinking about a Motion Pro bearing remover set and also the driver set. This is good investment I think. So I could do the front wheel and the swingarm pivot.

But I am worried about the bearings that need an hydraulic press (rear hub and sprocket carrier). We can find cheap hydraulic presses here via Amazon but they are from China (what a surprise!) and quality does not seems to be always there (according to reviews). I had this or that in mind. Also I did not have in mind to start a repair shop (and I live in an appartment, so limited space/storage).

If you do not plan on using the tools again, go to a local shop and pay them to press the bearings. It will be simpler and probably cheaper than dealing with buying and then owning large tools, which you will probably not need again.

If you do decide to buy the press, do not worry about it being made in China. It isn't good enough for a professional daily use, but for home mechanic, they are perfect - Cheap and get the job done. Especially simple tools, like a press. I own "that" and have been happily using it for a while now.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi,

A little bit of an update for those who are following this thread 😉

Since the last post, I did not do much on the VFR, mainly cleaning some stuff like swingarm, chain cover and slider chain (damn those slider chain bolts were hard to remove) and evaluating the list of bearing references I need to order (thanks to JZH for sharing his information). I also spent some time searching on the Internet the technique(s) to remove the old steering bearings (and their cage) and put in place the new ones (without damaging the lower one). Sounds like I'm gonna have some fun.

In the meantime, I performed basic maintenance on my wife car. I also purchased a bearing removal set (like this) and started using it for rebuilding the rear suspension linkage of my Bandit 400. It helped me removing the 2 middle needle bearings. I'll use it to remove the front wheel bearings and the swingarm radial bearings (of the VFR).

In parallel, at work, I requested to my management to enter the PMP certification preparation program and I got enrolled, just knew that when I was back from X-mas holidays. To keep it simple, I work in a pretty big IT company and PMP is an external certification for Project Managers (recognised in various industries, not only IT). If I can get it, that's an important achievement for me and my career. The counterpart is that's an exam to pass that requires personal work: around 100 to 150 hours of personal work between now and beggining of July 2016. So look what is on my nightstand:

WP_20160127_001_1024.jpg.6d0789de1d6879a836a224fe956ce871.jpg

The Haynes just arrived today, but my concern is on the left side, that's like 560 pages... Hopefully, I already started stydying.

My point is the VFR restoration will suffer (a lot) until I complete the program but will keep it to clear my head when needed. I'll keep posting my progress(es) here and let you know how things are going (and of course keep reading the forum).

Thanks for reading 😉

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Gotta do what you gotta do to earn your checks. More income means more money for your project some day hopefully ;)

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Gotta do what you gotta do to earn your checks. More income means more money for your project some day hopefully ;)

Sure ;-) It means more money at some point in the future (just don't know when exactly yet). And when I'm done (mid July this year), then definitely more time to spend in the garage!!!

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So I spent 2 hours this Saturday in the garage. First, I was able to remove pretty easily the old lower inner bearing race from the steering stem (to install tapered roller bearing instead).

Then I tried my bearing removal set. I was able to remove the 2 roller bearings off the front wheel and guess what... there was still some water inside the wheel 😞 Both bearings were dead, one was barely able to rotate (from let say 10 degrees max), the other was completely blocked. I also removed the 2 ball bearings from the right side of the swingarm, also both were dead, not able to turn at all (but they had no mark of rust or anything else).

Here is a pic of the front wheel spacer that goes between the 2 bearings:

DSC_0293_1024.JPG.12ef72590be2086276f64fb43df9a811.JPG

The metal is corroded, and I believe sanding it (with proper sand paper) will not be enough, I'd rather replace it.

Then, I was not able to remove the needle bearing on the left side of swingarm. The manual states you need to insert a driver from the other side and press it out but you can barely touch the back of the bearing due to the shape of the recess behind the bearing. Does anyone have an idea of the shape of the needed driver? Maybe I see with the dealer close to me if he can arrange to remove it.

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Ben,

I think I had a shop replace my bike's swing arm bearings, but I have since acquired some Facom bearing pullers, for use with a slide hammer.

The internal bearing pullers look a bit like this set off eBay:

$_57.JPG

Of course, a friendly dealer would be the easiest option! Probably cost just a few euros, if you just bring in the swing arm--not attached to to bike!

Ciao,

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  • 3 months later...

Guess what, I am not dead :-) I just keep on working to prepare my exam in June. 

 

Since my last post, I sourced some rear bearings and let my mechanic handle those I would never be able to handle myself (without an hydraulic press). I meant especially the rear hub (2 bearings), the rear sprocket (1 bearing). Also, I was not able to remove myself the needle bearing from the swingarm and I asked him if he could put an insert for the frame thread I broke when I removed the side stand.

 

20160312_092153_1024.jpeg.5e298ee7a131cdc35d86fda1f0e3f2d8.jpeg

 

For the rear hub, I went for the original needle bearing (with integrated inner seal) but I replaced the ball one (a double 12mm thickness bearing that you can not find anywhere else than at your Honda dealer) with 2 12mm ones (16€ each). For the rear sprocket, I also went for replacement Japanese quality bearing (20€)

 

On that picture, you can see the state of old bearings, none of them is functional...

 

20160516_112844_1024.jpeg.30ffca55e23a26a17ba06527556acb46.jpeg

 

Note that when removing the swingarm needle bearing, the mechanic broke his (professional) bearing puller 😞

Even with the new one, check what's left from the bearing... The swingarm also exhibits some traces of heat near the bearing location.

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Great to hear you are alive :) . I enjoy reading the rebuild threads, great work so far!

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  • 1 month later...

Back to business ? PMP exam was last Saturday, results will come later this month or early next month. 

So I took the opportunity of our National Day here in France to try to open this engine that has been sitting on my balcony since at least last Christmas. This has been  bothering me for too long now...

So I removed the cylinder head covers and the cams but got stuck when I tried to remove the cylinder head bolts... My 12 mm (pretty standard Facom) socket is too thick to reach any of the bolts. Same story for the 2 10 mm bolts. Anyone has an idea of what kind of socket I would need for that? 

I'll post some pictures tomorrow or on Saturday. 

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Sounds like you sleep on it and you find the answer ;-)

My Facom ratchet uses a 1/2 square (which is pretty standard, at least in my mind). It comes from my grandpa who was a mechanic ;-) I also have 1/4 which is too weak for that. I just realized that I probably need a solid 3/8 extender and 3/8 square sockets (both in 10 and 12mm). 

 

Edited by bdouvill
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A few pics from yesterday, I know you guys enjoy a lot 😉

 

This is exactly where I can not insert my 1/2 12mm sockets to untighten the cylinder head 😞

 

20160714_141153_1024.jpg.ce4c35a84cd515979923c151b2288f6c.jpg

 

20160714_144406_1024.jpg.1aa4903ce1948bebdaaa24402340b780.jpg

 

20160714_144538_1024.jpg.cefdac42f81c7572b22fc8ffc16ceda8.jpg

 

I removed the clutch plates to clean them. I am not experts but all friction plates look like the pictures below and seemed pretty toasted to me... Also, the bearing in the middle does not rotate freely and is probably dead as well... I need to figure out how to separate it from its axle.

 

20160714_150139_1024.jpg.c52a39d7853bd8334f6148c4a0ce1e26.jpg

Edited by bdouvill
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Clutch friction plates look a bit fried. I replaced mine with a Barnett kevlar clutch and the bike felt like it had picked up a few hp.

 

I think a 3/8" drive socket might do the job for the cylinder head bolts.

 

Great work so far!

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I think i have that clutch baring at home, will check on saturday if you have not alraeady sourced it (or it cannot be sourced in France)

 

Clutch friction plates have a minimum tolerance, check the manual.

 

 

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I separated gently the bearing from its axle. It is a pretty standard Koyo 16003 (35x17x8), only 9€ at a bearing specialist (I still have other to sources).

@Dutchy Thanks for the offer anyway ;-)

 

For the clutch plates, they are within tolerances according to Haynes manual (around 3mm when service limit is 2.5mm). Spring are within the tolerance as well (all are around 4.32mm long when service limit is 4.12mm). EBC clutch plate kit (CK1206) can be found at 55€ on the net and clutch spring kit (CSK028) at around 10€ only. On the other side, Barnett clutch kit seems attractive but for the moment, I only found it from the US at around 135$ (delivery to France + custom charges will increase that a lot). I will think about it.

 

To remove the clutch center nut, there's a special tool required. I looked like the one use to remove the swing arm nut but obviously, this does not work. That would have been a good opportunity to check on the needle bearing behind the drum :-(

 

For the cylinder head, I ordered some Facom 3/8 long sockets;

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While waiting for my special 3/8 sockets to arrive, I decided to clean up the swingarm a little bit. A few month ago, it was like this, remember?

 

WP_20151225_023_1024.jpg.dcbcb9b69ff9d383a7067f77a64c038d.jpg

 

Now that all parts are removed and that I cleaned it up, I found some strange marks that makes me think the swingarm is originally painted and some chain cleaner has been sprayed and ate the paint, what do you think?

 

20160721_202447_1024.jpg.26f09da7dfb6124c9a7fe45160c33991.jpg

 

20160721_202453_1024.jpg.7436f0c51406cc5f1527770e7b38781e.jpg

 

20160721_202458_1024.jpg.53bc427f12220448b232c9b8a3027e3d.jpg

 

Should I try to clean more and spray it? I Don't really want to go for full professional quality sandblasting and painting. Any tip to do something clean?

Thanks a lot in advance for your feedback 😉

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Something may have etched into the aluminium--I don't think the swing arm is painted or laquered, but I suppose it could be. 

 

Some of my bikes are Datatagged in ridiculous places like that...Grrrrrr.  Makes me angry every time I see it.  What were they thinking?

 

Ciao,

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So I received the Facom 3/8 sockets and the 1/2 to 3/8 adapter. Here is what I used to untighten the rear cylinder head:

 

20160722_192139_1024.jpg.487a98c0c21c3a27086d6094daf0480c.jpg

 

I used the socket in the middle for the 8 12mm bolts. I was able to remove the 2 10mm bolts with a 1/2 10mm socket with 1/2 extender because there is more space around the cam gears. I also used a vacum cleaner pipe to increase the lever 😉

 

Here is the inside of the 2 rear cylinders:

 

20160722_192034_1024.jpg.cd706ea3ff010abbca944cc07452781a.jpg

 

The picture is not really good.

Against what I thought, there was no mud inside, only carbon deposit on the top of the cylinders. The sides were really clean, no marks, except carbon deposit on the top, from the top position of the cylinder to the head (like 2-3mm). After I cleaned just a little with soft tissue/kitchen towell, it gave me this:

 

20160722_194320_1024.jpg.0439379515a0e695f45b48bf7e6b78cf.jpg

 

The thing is I now think it was not really needed to open it and I will not open the other side. It will take definitely more time to clean the surface on both side to put a new cylinder head gasket than it took to clean the inside of the cylinders. But I had to see it, now I know. I will order one cylinder gasket and 2 gasket head covers.

 

I also remove the cam gear (you got it between the 2 pictures above).

 

20160722_194303_1024.jpg.31789ff6417673fcdf4f212374c44e99.jpg

 

You can see on the right that I started to clean it. That is really strange: I don't know if this comes from the mud that mixed with the old oil of from 23 years of poor service... Anyway, I'll try to open other covers to try to clean the most of this crap.

 

To be continued...

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 3 months later...

Hey guys,

 

It's been a long time since I gave some news here. In September, I was on holidays for 2 weeks but I decided to focus mainly on the maintenance of my Bandit. It took many many days, I changed the cooling hoses for some silicone hoses, changed the cylinder head cover gasket to cure some oil leaks, changed the carb seals and checked the valve tolerance. Since I dismantled the cards, I had a lot of troubles when I put them back, the bike started at no less than 4000 RPM... Anyway, I cured all my problems and went back on the VFR which is the point here 😉

 

Since my last update, my wife convinced me that since I had the engine out of the bike, I should open the second half and check the combustion chambers. So I ordered a second cylinder head gasket and open the other part. Found no more mud than inside the other side. But all in all, that was a good idea. Here are some pics:

 

Cylinder head gaskets. Did not order the 2nd one from CMS since shipping was killing it for only one part. Anyway, both seems original parts (or equivalent):

 

20160902_162513_1024.jpg.ac9e3e99f92da19aec08001bfc29ea54.jpg

 

Front cylinders after cleaning:

 

20160902_162528_1024.jpg.7c4ba3b02c891c3e4b85455bebf2b8bb.jpg

 

20160902_162536_1024.jpg.d6d05fda4d35ba8f886034bd4ee3bed6.jpg

 

After I put the camshaft back. I oiled a lot the cams and especially the part where they rotate.

 

20161101_111129_1024.jpg.d5ce138c833d860335b9cc80786219e7.jpg

 

Hopefully, I turned the crankshaft and checked because I put the intake rear camshaft in a wrong position (was shifted about one teeth) so I put in back into the correct position.

 

I also opened the rest and changed the paper seals. Look at all the crap that was at the bottom of the engine. I started to doubt about the amount of care this bike received before me.

20161029_115726_1024.jpg.16d674d0cbb4f0ab0fe2b4e21a28a187.jpg20161029_115739_1024.jpg.12a979bcb1c52933a65bcf5303dd2524.jpg

 

Then after cleaning:

20161029_124956_1024.jpg.9c44e527dadc975fbdf6617dfd971c73.jpg

 

Engine is now almost ready to go back to work (at least for a try). I am only waiting for a new clutch kit. I ordered an EBC SRC-003 kit.

 

In parallel, I finished preparing the swingarm. I put almost everything back and did my best to reduce those marks on the side.

20160828_141711_1024.jpg.eb4c2bc05d0a3abe71575089b22d7669.jpg

 

20160828_141801.jpg.8437c528ea300c588e37a91d4b189120.jpg

 

In the coming days, I will try to re-assemble the chassis, the swingarm, the fork and the wheels. I just sourced the missing bearings for the steering stem (both tapered bearings), the front wheel (with new dust seals) and for the clutch plate.

 

The engine has been on my balcony since December last year so almost a year. It's time to see if we can rev it a little bit. My plan for the coming weeks it to assemble it in the chassis, rebuild the carbs (I already have the Liteon kit) and try to fire it up (even without the pump and the tank - I have an auxiliary one). Then, I'll be first very happy and proud of myself, and second, I'll see what I do for the fork, rear shock and brakes.

 

See you later 😉

 

 

Edited by bdouvill
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Thanks for the update.  It looks like things are coming along nicely - everything looks great.  Nice job!

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Bdouvill, only joined VFRD recently, so only reading this thread now.
Well done, amazing work and you're sticking to it.
I'm only going to make one negative or reflective comment....since you have found mud and water in pretty much every hole, and mud in the belly pan, I would be pulling the bearings caps off the crankshaft and checking there, also what about the oil pump?
You're doing all the right things by your bike and if you crank it over with dirt in it, all efforts wasted.
Glad I got to catch the tail end of this. Awesome...
Craig

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I can send you an (free) oil pump if you like, the one from redslut (RC36-2 1994-97)

 

IMAG5891.jpg

 

 

Not sure of it would fit/is identical....

 

Capture1.JPG

 

 

Capture.JPG

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