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Trying To Revive A 1993 Vfr 750, Incomplete... And Flooded!


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20160722_194303_1024.jpg?raw=1&key=c312c

 

Are they spinning freely?  They should be....

 

Mine came out "clean" so that dark brown is mud/water for sure..

 

after a little degreaser...

 

IMAG5404.jpg

 

As I was not consulting the manual much in my disassembly for scrap, I did wack one with a rubber mallet as it was not coming out. I missed that one little bolt...  :-)

So now I have one that really spins very very freely, the other one not so much...

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Yup ! Left it is. 

RC36Rider's pic is a little misleading, because the wire he circled looks like it is going the wrong way.  It goes down, directly to the neutral switch on the lower engine casing.  There is no missing

Clutch received and mounted last week-end:     I let clutch plates in fresh oil to wet them:     Now, engine is back in the garage. It left my balcony after alm

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Thanks a lot guys for all your feedback and support.

 

8 hours ago, Forbes said:

Bdouvill, only joined VFRD recently, so only reading this thread now.
Well done, amazing work and you're sticking to it.
I'm only going to make one negative or reflective comment....since you have found mud and water in pretty much every hole, and mud in the belly pan, I would be pulling the bearings caps off the crankshaft and checking there, also what about the oil pump?
You're doing all the right things by your bike and if you crank it over with dirt in it, all efforts wasted.
Glad I got to catch the tail end of this. Awesome...
Craig

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I understand your concern but I am not so worried. When I drained the oil from the engine, it has been contaminated by water but everything came out. All the walls inside the engine have a very thin layer of very old oil, as you can see on the cam gears. I did my best to degrease everything that I could. 

 

On the contrary, the bottom of the belly pan had something I would call a skin of old oil (like cream forming on top of milk or sometimes in paint containers that have been used before, you can find the same kind of layer of paint on top that became more or less solid). I believe basically this is because no one ever removed the belly pan since 1993. Hopefully, this was not sucked by the oil pump so I expect that no "solidified" oil went into the oil galleries (to lubricate the crankshaft and the gearbox shafts). Checking that would mean splitting the case in two which is a lot of work (and troubles). For example, I have no idea where to find the socket to remove the clutch gasket. But I take the advice and will check on the oil pump as soon as I can. Depending on what I find inside, I'll advise.

 

@Dutchy

Thanks again for the proposal (for the oil pump) ;-)

21 minutes ago, Dutchy said:

20160722_194303_1024.jpg?raw=1&key=c312c

 

Are they spinning freely?  They should be....

 

Mine came out "clean" so that dark brown is mud/water for sure..

 

after a little degreaser...

 

IMAG5404.jpg

 

As I was not consulting the manual much in my disassembly for scrap, I did wack one with a rubber mallet as it was not coming out. I missed that one little bolt...  :-)

So now I have one that really spins very very freely, the other one not so much...

 

For the cam gears, I got them clean with brake degreaser. One of them was not rotating freely, but some WD40 and some fresh oil later, works great again. I rotated the crankshaft like at least 2 times 720 degrees, works without efforts and camshafts are properly synchronized, no worries about that :-)

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

As promised, I checked the oil pump. I opened the oil pan again and removed all the pipes. I did not remove the pump since removing the bolt on the gear that is driving the pump means removing the main clutch gasket. There's definitely nothing to worry about but that was a good idea. I found a little bit of contaminated oil in the small pipes and water trapped into the oil filter :-( I cleaned everything and put a new oil filter.

 

Some pics

 

20161120_153728_1024.jpg.2965c39b99b03f68d48fa8bd67c34f0e.jpg

 

20161120_153712_1024.jpg.d55438283dc8268e31876171ac3e6698.jpg

 

Clutch kit is on its way. I should be able to mount it next week-end :-)

Edited by bdouvill
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  • 2 weeks later...

Clutch received and mounted last week-end:

 

20161126_113150_1024.jpg.b50aed9bacbe32234cf345f4df11e2c5.jpg

 

I let clutch plates in fresh oil to wet them:

 

20161126_113201_1024.jpg.718567c1aae63e11d5c2912925d50d5d.jpg

 

Now, engine is back in the garage. It left my balcony after almost one year :-)

 

Re-assembly started almost at the same time.

New stem bearing (thanks to @JZH again for all the info about the bearings): 

 

20161119_123529_1024.jpg.5edc73eb80fddc63957829b160c838fd.jpg

 

 

20161120_114725_1024.jpg.e106e959c8ba5a790daeabe68e166c9b.jpg

 

Already assembled frame, swingarm and rear suspension:

 

20161130_193703_1024.jpg.6640e73f0468087440863b06e3d810b5.jpg20161130_201032_1024.jpg.db190d47155f37c4c1797388453e8f5e.jpg20161130_201050_1024.jpg.e4b908c1382115872af50e53ef46133a.jpg

 

I could not resist in putting back the rear wheel (it's sooooo beautiful):

 

20161130_201756_1024.jpg.218a22540bf2ca3dba4e4ef77504010c.jpg20161130_201830_1024.jpg.1c255cb17eeb40296d84722eaec90ddf.jpg

 

Next step is putting back the engine in the frame. I hope to do that next Saturday 😉

Edited by bdouvill
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She's going to be better than new. :fing02:

I hope so thanks
Time will tell...

Envoyé de mon SM-A510F en utilisant Tapatalk

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On 11/30/2016 at 9:53 PM, bdouvill said:

Next step is putting back the engine in the frame. I hope to do that next Saturday 😉

 

And this is done!!!!

 

20161204_171309_1024.jpg.b6e50c17a6c6beef5ae48bd6a7f47d26.jpg

 

I have to warmly thank Josh for his time and patience on Saturday and Sunday. On Saturday, we tried, every piece found its place except for the upper front right bolt, engine and frame were absolutely not in line. After reading carefully the Haynes manual, we gave it a shot on Sunday, fought a little bit but came out victorious!

 

I still have plenty of stuff before hearing it rev again. To be continued 😉

 

 

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Updates from last week:
- Cleaned and put back front sprocket
- Cleaned lower triple clamp rust marks on fork tubes and put them back on the bike together with the front axle
- Put back the oil radiator after I cleaned it
- Put back the gauges
- Put back the tail frame

 

Here are a few pics:

 

20161210_140507_1024.jpg.ebc476902d59b72d29ace403645f347b.jpg

 

20161210_141130_1024.jpg.9da37d5f22b40d51755c0e00f240e968.jpg20161210_161151_1024.jpg.05212ac646f643e5a805940875c2e12b.jpg20161210_161227_1024.jpg.f7eeebf1fa1c97b67f13d6f91bacb526.jpg

 

Concerning the front fork, I put it back knowing that I'll remove it later. Fork seals clips are completely rusted and need to be changed. I'll take the opportunity to change the oil seals as well and the dust seals, and the inner bushings. The oil is probably from 1993 according to the V shape of the front tyre. And I plan to go for Racetech compression valve... and maybe all of that on a VTR fork if I can find one at a decent price. 

 

I also carefully inspected the wheels. Hopefully, they have no dents, only a few scraches to the original paint (like on the picture below, see on the left).

 

20161210_133603_1024.jpg.031bcfa4dc23e1ddebc8b9bfe1a73150.jpg

 

That gives me 3 options:
1/ Get them epoxyed
2/ Get them painted 
3/ Paint them myself (paper sand, wheel spray and lots of time/effort)

I'll ask for some quotes as soon as I find a decent car/motorcycle painter and an epoxy professional in my area. That can wait until I figure if the engine can run. I am not concerned with the engine now, more with the electrical magic I'll find...

 

On the bad side, I found that cooling radiator is slightly leaking apparently on the left side. I need to check carefully as well...

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How good does it feel bringing something back to life! Keep it up, enjoyment around the corner.

Sent from my HTC_PN071 using Tapatalk

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The last 3 week-ends brought visible changes. It starts to look like a bike after one year completely torn apart. Feels good :cool:

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1 hour ago, bdouvill said:

And I plan to go for Racetech compression valve.

 

Your forks have old style Showa 3 port pistons which are fairly similar to RT's Type 1 Gold Valves.

 

If you want stiffer compression damping, get some extra .15 x 17 mm shims. Much cheaper than a GV kit. 

 

1 hour ago, bdouvill said:

That gives me 3 options:
1/ Get them epoxyed
2/ Get them painted 
3/ Paint them myself (paper sand, wheel spray and lots of time/effort)

 

AFAIK, getting them professionally epoxied costs about 80 € including sand blasting.

 

The very cheapest DIY paint job will likely run you 30 € in materials and quite a few hours of tedium for a result that might not be as good or durable. 

 

Unless you actually highly value doing it yourself, it's just not worth it IMO.

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5 minutes ago, RC36Rider said:

 

Your forks have old style Showa 3 port pistons which are fairly similar to RT's Type 1 Gold Valves.

 

If you want stiffer compression damping, get some extra .15 x 17 mm shims. Much cheaper than a GV kit. 

 

 

Got it! I have read gold valve installation multiple times, including yours. Any idea where I can get extra shims online? 

 

Also, I have a spare pair of 0.85kg/mm Racetech front fork springs. Bought them for my Bandit 400 according to Racetech online calculator. It turned it was way (waaayyyyyy) too stiff so I switched to 0.80 which was at the time the lightest available and are ok to live with. I think that 0.75 would be perfect, they are available from Racetech now. 

 

Good thing is they are compatible with 3rd gen. Racetech calculator tells me to go for closest to 0.93 kg/mm for my 3rd gen so with my experience, I'll give my 0.85kg/mm a try and determine if I need to go to 0.90kg/mm or not.

 

AFAIK, getting them professionally epoxied costs about 80 € including sand blasting.

 

The very cheapest DIY paint job will likely run you 30 € in materials and quite a few hours of tedium for a result that might not be as good or durable. 

 

Unless you actually highly value doing it yourself, it's just not worth it IMO.

 

If this is less than 100 € per wheel, I won't bother doing it myself. Thanks for the info.

 

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3 hours ago, bdouvill said:

If this is less than 100 € per wheel, I won't bother doing it myself. Thanks for the info.

 

What I have heard is about 80 € for both wheels. Might have been quite a few years ago, though.

 

Worth getting a quote at any rate. 

 

3 hours ago, bdouvill said:

Any idea where I can get extra shims online? 

 

They are not overly easy to source in small quantities. RT sell packs of 10 for $16 or so but I think they charge quite a lot for shipping. :huh:

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25 minutes ago, RC36Rider said:

They are not overly easy to source in small quantities. RT sell packs of 10 for $16 or so but I think they charge quite a lot for shipping. :huh:

 

So it depends on how many of those packs I might need to adjust compression and rebound stack. 

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Found interesting stuff reading this post again (@RC36Rider this is the one I mentioned as "your post", thought it was you who created it).

Just in case I found a way to source those shims, can anyone indicate me what is the inner diameter of those shims for 3rd gen fork - both for compression and rebound? According to the pics in this post, I would say 6mm...

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Yup ! 6 mm ID, 17 mm OD for the face shims on both comp and rebound. 

 

I might have jumped the gun a bit. You need smaller OD shims to build a tapered stack which you apparently don't have in the stock forks.

 

44 minutes ago, bdouvill said:

Just in case I found a way to source those shims

 

Do share, please. :smile:

 

I have been looking (on and off) for a cheap and easy online source for us in Old Europe but couldn't find one. :wacko:

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5 minutes ago, RC36Rider said:

Yup ! 6 mm ID, 17 mm OD for the face shims on both comp and rebound. 

 

I might have jumped the gun a bit. You need smaller OD shims to build a tapered stack which you apparently don't have in the stock forks.

 

 

Do share, please. :smile:

 

I have been looking (on and off) for a cheap and easy online source for us in Old Europe but couldn't find one. :wacko:

 

For sure I will :wink:

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Regarding the number of shims required, you can download the RT instruction sheets right here on VFRD:

 

Compression

Rebound

 

I gather that you are not looking for a rock hard setup so I'd say you won't be needing anything beyond C35 / rH19 at most. 

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On 13/12/2016 at 11:05 AM, bdouvill said:

For sure I will :wink:

 

Not that I'm in a hurry but... 

 

For some reason, I never until now searched for French Websites. Silly me. :wacko:

 

I found these two so far: 

 

Motoshop-online.com

Motostand.com

 

Any other address to share ?

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17 hours ago, RC36Rider said:

 

Not that I'm in a hurry but... 

 

For some reason, I never until now searched for French Websites. Silly me. :wacko:

 

I found these two so far: 

 

Motoshop-online.com

Motostand.com

 

Any other address to share ?

@RC36Rider I completely understand, my first reflex is always to ask Google in english :wink:

So far, I spent little time on that but only bookmarked US and Australian providers... Thanks a lot for sharing those links :cheerleader:

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Quick question for the experts concerning my (coolant) radiator:

Will a 4th gen model fit my 3rd gen? I can found some on Craigslist here at reasonable price but I am not sure it will fit. Honda's reference is different between 1993 (19010MT4003) and 1994 (19010MZ7003). Would the rest (like fan brackets, coolant lines,...) fit?

 

Thanks a lot.

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The only difference i know of is that the overflow pipe, just below the filler cap, is facing forward instead of backward on the RC36-II.

That is why i want a RC36-I one for a cleaner look on a naked RC36-II.

 

for other options: http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/index.php?/forums/topic/84635-any-other-rads-fit-the-4th-gen/

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They look the same to me, and I've just bought an alloy replacement radiator for my 3rd gen that is supposed to fit all of the RC36 models (a "Worley", just like the one shown in the thread linked to by koekum), but as I have a 3rd gen, I never noticed the position of the overflow tube (it is the same as my OEM!)

 

Ciao,

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Thanks to @koekum and @JZH for those clear inputs. The super cheap I found (less than 40 euros) is for a 4th gen with the overflow pipe going forward when it goes backward like the main coolant pipe on my 3rd gen.

I will try to check for leaks again and eventually try to fix it (will give LOCTITE EA 3455 a try). If that does not work, will start to chase for a spare one or a new Chinese one. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi there,

 

Some news. I tested again my radiator and found no leaks... I put the lines on and filled them with water to add some pressure. Seemed good to me.

 

20161227_121833_1024.jpg.35d073bf27549e6d0297314364e9044a.jpg

 

Now I put back the wiring harness (what a mess...) and found that I had a tiny part missing. Could anyone give me the Honda reference for that part going from the neutral switch to the main harness? I took me some time to understand that this was missing and caused the starter not to start. Look at my McGyver option here 😉

 

20161227_172246_1024.jpg.43255b655861feb3e5293e5b16614cc5.jpg

 

With that, then starter went back to life but the battery went in smoke right after... Need to get a new one.

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