New Vfr800's Not Selling Very Well

[Mattie660]

It is theory at the moment !

But the picture in reply #133 you can see the big 50 litre roll bag on the back of the CBR, that is straightforward.

The basis for the whole thing is a Hepco & Becker Sportrack. You remove the passenger seat, and replace it with the Sportrack, that is bike model specific. It provides an aluminium rack, with some slots to tie or loop bungee hooks through. It covers the plastics, and is nicely shaped to fit the specific model of bike.

Onto the Hepco & Becker Sportrack, add an extension plate - this widens the surface area, and is ideal for securing a big roll bag (I used Cable Zip Ties !).

For the camping trips (as opposed to hotel/guest house trips) the plan is to use the Sportrack and Autokicker Cargo Tailbag 50 litre. Onto this you have attachment points for securing a lightweight Ortlieb bag, that will contain the tent and mattress etc.

This is all going to be made possible by reducing the pack load, returning to things learnt in my bicycle touring days. The nice big tent has been sold, and the big Trangia cook set and plates will stay behind. Camping equipment will be:

• Hilleberg Enan tent - weighs 1 kilo, packs very small, yet very capable.
• Vango Compact Gas Stove, and Hard Anodised Cook set (into which the little gas stove and little gas canister fit) tiny thing, and only a few $$.
• PH Design Minimim sleeping bag - down sleeping bag - does not even have a zip. Packs tiny, much smaller than a US size football
• Thermarest mattress - inflatable.

They are the items that take up the most room. The tent is the most expensive item on the list, but I just sold my other one, which will cover 2/3 of the cost of the replacement.

The next most expensive thing is the PH Design sleeping bag. I have the Minim already but it is not enough on its own for spring and Autumn/Late Summer - so will have to consider buying another the same, and taking two, or upgrade. You can design your own sleeping bag, according to your requirements, but it gets expensive. Might be better to take two, as they are so small. If hot, use one, if cold, use two.

Warm clothing can be bulky, but can be covered by Marino Wool base layers. Change of clothes, and a few bits and pieces, and that is it. Should be possible on a CBR.

[dogman]

Half your rotten luck to be able to hop on your bike and tour around Europe like that.

Also on one of my trips in Oz I was "outback" and struck a 50KpH head wind and had to drop back to 5th to maintain 120 KpH comfortably.

That was on a 6th gen.so I understand you wanting something larger in terms of capacity.

After that I sold it and bought a CBR1100xx, but didnt keep that long either, great on the straights but a boat in the tight stuff.

Back to VFRs now, a tried and trusted allrounder but everyone is different.

Personally I wouldn't mind trying an Aprillia Tuono next, but I am only dreaming.

[Rectaltronics]

^^ Dustin^^ It sounds great riding in the US, riding across endless expanses of the US West - but I think continental European riding is different - not better or worse, but different. For continental touring bigger motors seem to be the best option, and my bikes have got progressively bigger over the years.

This is what it is all about - loading some camping gear and heading off to France and beyond. And this is what the bike looks like, and will have to cope with German Autobahns, on the way to Austria, and on the way up to Scandinavia, across Holland and France, the Alps and the Pyrennes.

You may also want to ride to a race meeting in France or Holland, or Germany, over a long weekend. So you will want to get a move on to get there and back in good time - this is the sort of thing I want to be doing.

This is normal luggage for a camping trip.

Personally, for what I am doing, and however good the VFR is, it is not in the same league as this - the CBR would sit between these two, which is where I am at ! - and the direction I seem to be heading in :)

I do not want to talk the Viffer down, and I will always speak highly of it, but my motorcycling life was not going to stop there :-)

Ride safe y'all :-)

Meh.

That's what my RZ-350 looked like when I went cross-country with it here, with one saddlebag largely dedicated to holding a container of Yamalube.

[dogman]

^^ Dustin^^ It sounds great riding in the US, riding across endless expanses of the US West - but I think continental European riding is different - not better or worse, but different. For continental touring bigger motors seem to be the best option, and my bikes have got progressively bigger over the years.

This is what it is all about - loading some camping gear and heading off to France and beyond. And this is what the bike looks like, and will have to cope with German Autobahns, on the way to Austria, and on the way up to Scandinavia, across Holland and France, the Alps and the Pyrennes.

You may also want to ride to a race meeting in France or Holland, or Germany, over a long weekend. So you will want to get a move on to get there and back in good time - this is the sort of thing I want to be doing.

This is normal luggage for a camping trip.

Personally, for what I am doing, and however good the VFR is, it is not in the same league as this - the CBR would sit between these two, which is where I am at ! - and the direction I seem to be heading in :)

I do not want to talk the Viffer down, and I will always speak highly of it, but my motorcycling life was not going to stop there :-)

Ride safe y'all :-)

Meh.

That's what my RZ-350 looked like when I went cross-country with it here, with one saddlebag largely dedicated to holding a container of Yamalube.

So we can blame you for global warming then :)

[Rectaltronics]

Meh.

That's what my RZ-350 looked like when I went cross-country with it here, with one saddlebag largely dedicated to holding a container of Yamalube.

So we can blame you for global warming then :)

It had a catalytic converter.

Although when people tailgated me I sometimes reached down and gave the oil pump control cable a good yank.

I kinda' miss that.

And I had no issues ring-ding-a-dinging along at triple-digits speeds, laden.

Need is often subjective.

[jimpanzer07]

I finally got my pearl white standard vfr after my local dealer and friend has not sold 1 in over a year. He still has the red deluxe model and not selling any time soon. I am really digging the bike after having a 2011 Ninja 1000, 2014 aprilia tuono and 2014 ducati monster 1200 that I still have. The VFR is slower and heavier than the 3 bikes before it but and this is huge - the quality is much higher! Ninja 1000 - got it new, worst shifting bike I have ever owned and I have owned many also vibrated a lot, had bad fueling - pings under light load and a very heavy clutch pull - sold it less than a year. Aprilia tuono v4, awesome, gear driven secondary cams, smooth engine, great shifting except for finding neutral, handled great and sounds like a wild beast at full throttle - blazing fast bike. The bad - runs very hot!, gets around 23mpg when driven hard, nut buster gas tank and passanger seat is not good and real threat to drivers license! Sold it to get the much hyped ducati monster 1200s which I still have. The ducati is a love hate relationship, great power, handles great, sounds even better, comy back seat for wife - this is big. The bad - VIBRATION, engine vibrates very much and creeps thru bars seat and pegs, another very poor shifting bike - lots of false nuetrals from 4-5 and 5-6 gears. Had dealer look at poor shifting and he said ''they all do that, you really have to boot the shifter like you mean it'' and a bitch to find neutral - hot or cold. Debating on selling it soon as quality seams poor but it looks cool as hell. So after these 3 bikes before my 2014 VFR, it is a pleasure to ride such a well made do it all bike and it looks great too! If the dealers had demo days for VFR they would sell a lot more of them, a bit more power and less weight in the future will really help as well. Happy riding and a happy VFR owner - Jim

[dogman]

Good to read your feed back on the other bikes and hear that you rate the VFR well against them. Its easy to lose perspective on just how good the VFR is in the real world.

[chinook]

I finally got my pearl white standard vfr after my local dealer and friend has not sold 1 in over a year. He still has the red deluxe model and not selling any time soon. I am really digging the bike after having a 2011 Ninja 1000, 2014 aprilia tuono and 2014 ducati monster 1200 that I still have. The VFR is slower and heavier than the 3 bikes before it but and this is huge - the quality is much higher! Ninja 1000 - got it new, worst shifting bike I have ever owned and I have owned many also vibrated a lot, had bad fueling - pings under light load and a very heavy clutch pull - sold it less than a year. Aprilia tuono v4, awesome, gear driven secondary cams, smooth engine, great shifting except for finding neutral, handled great and sounds like a wild beast at full throttle - blazing fast bike. The bad - runs very hot!, gets around 23mpg when driven hard, nut buster gas tank and passanger seat is not good and real threat to drivers license! Sold it to get the much hyped ducati monster 1200s which I still have. The ducati is a love hate relationship, great power, handles great, sounds even better, comy back seat for wife - this is big. The bad - VIBRATION, engine vibrates very much and creeps thru bars seat and pegs, another very poor shifting bike - lots of false nuetrals from 4-5 and 5-6 gears. Had dealer look at poor shifting and he said ''they all do that, you really have to boot the shifter like you mean it'' and a bitch to find neutral - hot or cold. Debating on selling it soon as quality seams poor but it looks cool as hell. So after these 3 bikes before my 2014 VFR, it is a pleasure to ride such a well made do it all bike and it looks great too! If the dealers had demo days for VFR they would sell a lot more of them, a bit more power and less weight in the future will really help as well. Happy riding and a happy VFR owner - Jim

Helpful to read this, was thinking of the tuono 1100 V4 as my possible next possible bike. Given me some food for thought.

[Cogswell]

I finally got my pearl white standard vfr after my local dealer and friend has not sold 1 in over a year. He still has the red deluxe model and not selling any time soon. I am really digging the bike after having a 2011 Ninja 1000, 2014 aprilia tuono and 2014 ducati monster 1200 that I still have. The VFR is slower and heavier than the 3 bikes before it but and this is huge - the quality is much higher! Ninja 1000 - got it new, worst shifting bike I have ever owned and I have owned many also vibrated a lot, had bad fueling - pings under light load and a very heavy clutch pull - sold it less than a year. Aprilia tuono v4, awesome, gear driven secondary cams, smooth engine, great shifting except for finding neutral, handled great and sounds like a wild beast at full throttle - blazing fast bike. The bad - runs very hot!, gets around 23mpg when driven hard, nut buster gas tank and passanger seat is not good and real threat to drivers license! Sold it to get the much hyped ducati monster 1200s which I still have. The ducati is a love hate relationship, great power, handles great, sounds even better, comy back seat for wife - this is big. The bad - VIBRATION, engine vibrates very much and creeps thru bars seat and pegs, another very poor shifting bike - lots of false nuetrals from 4-5 and 5-6 gears. Had dealer look at poor shifting and he said ''they all do that, you really have to boot the shifter like you mean it'' and a bitch to find neutral - hot or cold. Debating on selling it soon as quality seams poor but it looks cool as hell. So after these 3 bikes before my 2014 VFR, it is a pleasure to ride such a well made do it all bike and it looks great too! If the dealers had demo days for VFR they would sell a lot more of them, a bit more power and less weight in the future will really help as well. Happy riding and a happy VFR owner - Jim

Great perspective. Makes me appreciate my Hondas all the more!

[Knight]

Jimpanzer , on the monster, does rev-matching or slowing down the shifting help? Or is it just clunky under all conditions?

Regarding sales: Looking at charts of US car sales, we are something like five million in the hole. The economy has not made up for the dramatic losses from the recession, and there is no hint that it ever will. There was just a major long-term loss. Bikes are a luxury and are going to lag these car sales. The VFR yes is probably the worst case because you are either a VFR person or you are not.

Jimpanzer what does your friend say about overall sales?

May I ask what did the new/leftover bike cost you? Is this a $9500 sale?

[jimpanzer07]

Hey Knight, monster 1200 is just a clunky shifter no matter what I try. My local dealer says small is big - ninja 300, cbr 300, cbr 500, and ninja 650 all sell very well . Maybe $9,500 before tax and fees $11,000 OTD for vfr - a good deal for a great bike. Happy riding

[windyrun]

Was at the honda (multi-brand actually) dealer today for a safety inspection on my triumph---sat on a new 2014 vfr800 std they had there since the beginning. In red. Looked and felt fantastic.

Honda really needs to be more generous/encouraging with test rides of this bike (like at all). And stock deluxe models instead of standards in the US. They would definitely sell if people were encouraged to ride them. Kinda made me a little angry that it is such a hassle to get a test ride for something that has been in the showroom for over a year.

Its frustrating since I go to a triumph / bmw dealer for service and they stuff you with food just to get you to come in and ride the things --- like any of them. First thing out of a salesman's mouth when they see you looking at a bike is "want to take it for a test ride? Like now?" And from what I can see they definitely are selling their bikes.

[Rectaltronics]

Was at the honda (multi-brand actually) dealer today for a safety inspection on my triumph---sat on a new 2014 vfr800 std they had there since the beginning. In red. Looked and felt fantastic.

Honda really needs to be more generous/encouraging with test rides of this bike (like at all). And stock deluxe models instead of standards in the US. They would definitely sell if people were encouraged to ride them. Kinda made me a little angry that it is such a hassle to get a test ride for something that has been in the showroom for over a year.

Its frustrating since I go to a triumph / bmw dealer for service and they stuff you with food just to get you to come in and ride the things --- like any of them. First thing out of a salesman's mouth when they see you looking at a bike is "want to take it for a test ride? Like now?" And from what I can see they definitely are selling their bikes.

BMW of Manhattan, crappy as they are, allows certain models to be test-ridden for an entire weekend.

And yes, the number of people ordering deluxe model VFRs while the standards gather dust on the showroom floor is somewhat absurd.

[fatshoutybloke]

If that's the case I wonder how they identified a requirement for a basic model in the US only?

[Darrenk]

If that's the case I wonder how they identified a requirement for a basic model in the US only?

I guess we Americans aren't as price conscious as Honda thought...

[fatshoutybloke]

It certainly seems they didn't do their research properly.

[fink]

Never ever understood that about the bikes supplied in the States either.

[emil]

US market is also not getting the NC700S, and none of the NC750s. While Germany did not get white RC79s until this year. Honda has some strange policies in that regard.

I also wonder why you have this ugly bicycle side reflector at the front wheel. First thing I'd do is rip it off.

[windyrun]

Maybe because it is a safety feature? Doesn't bother me ... can't see it when I'm riding anyway :)

[Rectaltronics]

US market is also not getting the NC700S, and none of the NC750s. While Germany did not get white RC79s until this year. Honda has some strange policies in that regard.

I also wonder why you have this ugly bicycle side reflector at the front wheel. First thing I'd do is rip it off.

Those yellow side reflectors on the forks and the red ones flanking the license plate out back are U.S. DOT mandatory safety equipment and as far as I know, every state and substantial municipality in the union has laws which incorporate those requirements by reference if not explicitly.

Folks here can and do get ticketed for removing those reflectors.

Folks also get ticketed for installing sh, er, crappy "tail tidy" kits which fail to include a rear reflector and/or license plate lighting, and/or employ turn signals which are nothing more than marker lamps and fail to meet DOT requirements.

[Jochem]

Is it still possible in the US to ride bikes without indicators and without wearing helmets?

But the reflectors are mandatory?

That is a bit weird isn't it?

[Shinigami]

It's certainly not the case in my state, which only calls out a "red reflector on the rear" with no reference as to size, etc.

[Jochem]

Cool, Shinigami.

But what about helmets and indicators then?

[Rectaltronics]

It's certainly not the case in my state, which only calls out a "red reflector on the rear" with no reference as to size, etc.

NRS 486.291  Reflectors.

1.  Every motorcycle or moped shall carry on the rear at least one reflector, which shall be mounted at a height not less than 20 inches nor more than 60 inches from the ground as measured from the center of the reflector to the level ground upon which such motorcycle or moped stands without a load.

2.  Each such reflector shall be of a size and character and so mounted as to be visible at night from all distances within 300 feet when directly in front of lawful lower beams of head lamps.

[MadScientist]

I don't know about reflectors, but all new motorcycles in the US must comply with Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards. This includes specifics for mandatory positioning and lighting capabilities for ALL lights on a bike. All new motorcycles are required to have turn signals and the positioning, housings, and brightness all must be certified. Most states include a statement in the legal code which forbids changing the vehicle from the pre approved standards for that particular model and year.

That said, enforcement is the issue. Most LEOs in the US have much higher priorities than making sure the vehicle lighting is up to spec. They will still stop vehicles with blatantly illegal modifications (like red/blue forward facing lights) or with potentially dangerous conditions (like no brake lights).

On the topic of this thread: A local dealer had a brand new, 0 mile, 2015 VFR800, non-Deluxe, for $7950. I considered it briefly, but another VFR is not really what I'm looking for right now.