FullTilt151 Posted May 15, 2013 Share Posted May 15, 2013 Hello everyone, I'm having some issues with my front end that's bothering me and I'm looking for advice. So, last summer I noticed the front end wobbling around 55mph. I'd basically let go of the handlebars and I could feel it wobbling in my hands. I replaced the wheel bearings and it seemed to fix the issue. Then, on the ride in this morning I noticed it happening really bad around 35mph. Any ideas? Could it be something as simple at the wheel out of balance? It only happens around the 35mph mark. This is my first 'sport' bike so I really dont' have the background, but the front end over all just feels mushy. If that makes sense. Thanks dudes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer huntinggunns Posted May 15, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 15, 2013 Put the bike on the center stand. Jack up the front of the bike under the headers. Check the steering stem bearings for any binding. If they are smooth proceed from there checking for a tire being cupped, out of round, so on and so on. Sent from my crazy hand held thingy using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Dutchy Posted May 15, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 15, 2013 at the risk of stating the obvious... tire pressures front and back ok? On my 4th gen I can let go off my handlebars from 60mph all the way to 1mph w/o a single wobble.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Posted May 15, 2013 Share Posted May 15, 2013 Also check for cupping on your front tire. Such can sometimes cause moderate speed handlebar wagging..... Had it happen with my bike back when I had Duncrap 207s on it that cupped so badly after so little miles..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullTilt151 Posted May 15, 2013 Author Share Posted May 15, 2013 I've done some googling on cupped tires. I'll check it when I get home, but thinking about it, I'm probably due for a new tire anyways. Pressure looks good. Back when I changed the bearings, I got some stem bearings as well. She turns lock to lock smoothly. Would it hurt to change the bearing as well? I figure if I've got the tire off, I may as well..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer huntinggunns Posted May 15, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 15, 2013 Sometimes it is hard to feel. If they have any notchy feeling I would change them. Sent from my crazy hand held thingy using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Havagan Posted May 15, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 15, 2013 On my 2002 I could NEVER take my hands off the bars without a wobble. I was jealous of my buddy on his 5th gen who would cruise for a bit and stretch his throttle hand. - Tire pressures were good. - Tires were not cupped. - Wheel bearings were fine. - Steering head bearings were fine. The fix: have Jamie Daugherty do my suspension for my weight. I can now take my hands off the bars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer MaxSwell Posted May 15, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 15, 2013 Having two '01 s with similar issues twice, replacing steering head bearings with All Balls tapered roller bearings cured the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer YoshiHNS Posted May 15, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 15, 2013 What tire pressure do you have in the front? What tire and how many miles are on it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoothsailin Posted May 15, 2013 Share Posted May 15, 2013 Do you sense any pulsing under braking? If so, one (or more) of the rotors could be warped. Consider spinning the front wheel after placing the bike on the centerstand and using a jack under the front of the engine to raise the wheel off the ground. If one or both rotors are warped you'll probably hear and feel the rotors rub against the brake pads at a certain point, or points as the wheel spins freely. Also check the wheel for runout and other signs of it having been bent or dented. Also, a defective tire, or one that's otherwise not in balance can also lead to this. If the the wheel has no balancing weights applied it may have been replaced w/o being balanced, or if there's a significant amount of weight attached the tire could be defective. Wobbles and tire imbalance issues can be really irritating and hard to cure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullTilt151 Posted May 15, 2013 Author Share Posted May 15, 2013 Actually I forgot I put a new tire on it last season. Dunlop Q2. Pressure is 36psi on the money. I'm gonna go ahead and replace the stem bearings just because I have them. I'm going to take the tire and have the balance checked while it's off. Off topic question; I need to tig the bottom left side subframe mount. It's broke on the main frame. Can you tig weld aluminum without frying your electrics? I know AC puts current in your frame. Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beck Posted May 15, 2013 Share Posted May 15, 2013 Interesting question....I wonder if you at least need to disconnect all the grounds on the bike......but then, some electrical components might be grounded directly to the frame with their housings..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NakedViffer Posted May 15, 2013 Share Posted May 15, 2013 Yeah, you'll need to disconnect your battery in order to weld on the frame. I would probably strip and remove the subframe from the bike, might be a little more work, but its the right way to do it, you'd have a hell of a time wrapping a bead all the around the tube with it installed. Not to mention your gonna want to strip the paint in the area and respray it to keep it from rusting, and then you don't have to worry about taping things up or overspray. Also, be prepared to install the bearings, its not just a drop in affair, you're gonna need to pound out the old seats, and press/pound in the new ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Cogswell Posted May 16, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 16, 2013 In my case tires can affect wobble. I have a spare set of wheels, one has PR2's and the other PR3's. Each have about 4,500 miles on them. Wheels are both perfectly straight and bearings are under 10,000 miles on each. The PR3's produce the 35 mph headshake, switching back to the PR2's and the wobble is gone. The 3's show more scalloping than the 2's, that's all I can figure it could be. If you need new tires anyway, maybe try that first and see what happens before changing something else - that way you can eliminate things one at a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lorne Posted May 16, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 16, 2013 The short answer is: Keep your hands on the bars. For more check out Kevin Cameron's book 'Sportbike Performance Handbook': 'Riders often encounter [wobble] when accelerating or decelerating through thespeed range of 35-45 miles per hour, with their hands off the bars or in lightcontact. Wobble occurs in this speed range because wheel rotation frequencycomes into step with wobble here, allowing any imbalance or out-of-round to get the oscillation going. The damping force of your hands on the bars is usuallyenough to prevent it.' He adds that loading the rear of the bike, tire wear, tire pressure, tirechoice, and general looseness of the suspension/steering bearings can allcontribute. Unless it's really bad, take comfort that your next new set oftires, properly balanced, will eliminate this problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 16, 2013 Share Posted May 16, 2013 here is one way you can tell if it's the tire or the neck bearings.was a service writer for a h-d dealer for 11 years and this was 99% accurate. over inflate the front tire to about 75 psi. try letting go of the bars at 45 or 50 and see if the wobble is gone. if it's gone, it's the tire. if it persists, it's the neck bearings. my 96 vfr had this wobble and neck bearings were the culprit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullTilt151 Posted May 16, 2013 Author Share Posted May 16, 2013 Thanks for all the info guys. The tire is a Dunlop Sportmax Q2, with only 1 season worth of miles. To me, it 'feels' ok. I'm going to change the neck bearings since I already have a brand new set. I'll report back on what I find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaper7767 Posted May 16, 2013 Share Posted May 16, 2013 the list for front end wobble is a little long but I'll give it a shot 1. wheel bearings 2. wheel/ tire balance 3. tire wear 4. tire pressure (motorcycles are really picky on this one) 5. fork/ shock preload miss adjusted 6. leaking forks 7. stem bearings 8. mistorqued stem bearings 9. bent forks 10. modified ride height.... well that's all that i can think of atm. Some of those are a stretch but still possibilities Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullTilt151 Posted May 19, 2013 Author Share Posted May 19, 2013 Welp, it was the neck bearings! Crazy thing, the front end felt fine, lock to lock, but once I got the everything off, I could really tell the bearings were gone. It felt lumpy with the forks out. They were way over tightened. Typical MO: All Ballz bearings. Put the races in the freezer before I started disassembly. Honda gave us recesses at 12 and 6 to pound the old races out. Used a block of wood and a hammer to start the races in the neck, then used the old races and the same block of wood to seat them. Used the old race to seat the bottom bearing on the stem. Factoring in the beer run: about 3 hours tops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyZ Posted May 19, 2013 Share Posted May 19, 2013 Glad you got it sorted out. The only time I had a wobble it was tire related. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullTilt151 Posted May 22, 2013 Author Share Posted May 22, 2013 Well. I spoke too soon. It's happening at 25mph now. It's driving me mad and I'm not sure what to do next. Any advice is greatly appreciated! What I've done so far: 1. New front tire last season. 2. Replace wheel bearings 3. Replace stem bearings 4. Went for a ride, it felt good at first but the more I moved up and down through the speedo, I noticed it again. 5. Measured from the top of the top triple tree to top of the fork on both sides and it's at the stock setting 39mm. 6. Jacked up the front end and loosened the bottom pinch bolts, kinda shook the handlebars side to side, then retighened the torque specs 37ft-lbs (I think). 7. Preloads are set to stock, 3 rings, per the manual. So now I'm sitting here pissed, not knowing what to do. The front end just feels mushy all over and it was like that before the wobble.It's not confidence encouraging at all. At this point, I'm going to take wheel and go have it checked for balance. I'll also check to see if it's bent. I have no idea about the springs or fork oil. Part of me wants to buy progressive springs. Should I just have them rebuild/revalved? My thinking was just new springs and fresh fork oil. What do you guys think? Thanks dudes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer JETS Posted May 22, 2013 Member Contributer Share Posted May 22, 2013 Have you serviced the forks? If the suspension is way off (like depleted oil or broken spring, head shake may occur. The valving is pretty good on VFR's but the stock springs are soft. Go with single wind, not progressives, though, if you upgrade. RaceTech has a calculator for your weight, often comes out to about .90 springs. Make sure oil is to spec and even a slight overfill is ok (10mm) to reduce dive and to firm up the last part of compression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullTilt151 Posted May 22, 2013 Author Share Posted May 22, 2013 Yea? Why not progressives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NakedViffer Posted May 22, 2013 Share Posted May 22, 2013 Because progressive springs are more of a band-aid to road going machines because the manufacturer wants it to apply to a wide array of people. Or you're a Harley/Touring guy and want a mushy spring that won't bottom out badly. It makes a good all around spring that several people of different weights can ride with OK results..But if you want a bike at the top of its game and setup to handle its best with your specific weight, then you buy a specific weight straight rate spring(s) for it. Yes, they sell them for sport applications, I don't know why.. Profit potential I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullTilt151 Posted May 23, 2013 Author Share Posted May 23, 2013 Thanks for the lesson. I've always ASSumed progressives were somehow better, without having any info on the subject. You got any preference on manufacturers? Any brands to stay away from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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