timmythecop Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Some background info: 2000 VFR New battery 18 months ago Never a hiccup with charging or starting Installed a voltmeter (old on from bottom of tool box) Bike used almost every day, then bike sits for almost 3 weeks: First ride after sitting, it started with no problem. After about 15 mins into ride, the voltage read 10.3 at speed. Parked the bike, returned, and it wouldn't start. Clock reset, too. Bump started and rode home. For first 20 mins, the gauge read 12.3 steady, then rose to 14.3 at speed and 12.3 at idle. Parked over night, and the next day, started right up and went straight to 14.3 at high idle. My questions are: can the volt meter be wrong? (it DID read low before the battery died)? Can a weird, faulty or miss-wired meter be causing this? are these voltages swinging so far in each direction a sign of something? Is my plan of taking the meter off and seeing what happens a good plan? I ask because I have had ZERO electrical problems in 40,000 miles, I put a meter in, and WHAM....problem. Please help. (took bike off classifieds because I can sell it with a mystery problem.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer KevCarver Posted November 17, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 17, 2011 Take a look at the R/R wires. Sounds like the behavior my PC800 was exhibiting last year. Found some meltage in the connector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer KevCarver Posted November 17, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 17, 2011 Test the stator while you're at it. Easiest test is check for continuity between the stator plug and ground. Should be none. Zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Rice Posted November 17, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 17, 2011 Voltage jumps aren't normal. Since the only thing that changed recently was the voltmeter of dubious lineage, I suggest removing the voltmeter and then testing the charging voltage with a good multimeter. It should be above 14V - Closer to 15 at idle with low lights on and it shouldn't deviate much with RPM. If all's OK, close it back up and call it good. If not, you will need to do some investigation. As Kevin suggested, do a visual inspection of RR to Stator plug as well as other plugs on the bike and check continuity of the stator wires as step 1. There are also resistance checks to be done if further investigation is needed. Check Tinyminds' write-up in electric section - That's what I used to pinpoint my recent issue and beef up my system. Good luck! D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer 2thdr Posted November 17, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 17, 2011 Welcome to the fold of the electrically challenged...sorry for it actually. Hope it was just a loose connection to the voltmeter or something easy. If not, Tightwad is your friend in need...good luck Officer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrelman Posted November 17, 2011 Share Posted November 17, 2011 Gotta check the condition of the plug going to the starter relay also whenever there's a charging problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Oh6PearlVFR Posted November 17, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 17, 2011 They say that when you fix the electrical problem in one place it moves to the next....I fixed my bike and now it's on yours.....j/k hope it's just the voltmeter going bad or having a loose connection. However, the bike dying on you I would assume there is a problem somewhere. Check the battery first - may just be bad or lack of charge - if it's not the battery, your bike could be running without a charge from the stator. Let us know - there are a slew of electrically challenged people that can help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmythecop Posted November 17, 2011 Author Share Posted November 17, 2011 Today, started right up, 14.3 at fast idle. During 30 min ride, 14.3 at speed and 11.9 at idle. weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer kaldek Posted November 17, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 17, 2011 Today, started right up, 14.3 at fast idle. During 30 min ride, 14.3 at speed and 11.9 at idle. weird. Your stator is on the way out mate. They work fine when cold, and get worse when hot. Same thing happened to mine. Basically as the stator heats up it starts to short between the wires within one of the phases - remember the stator windings are insulated from themselves and it's the length of winding which allows it to generate power. If you suddenly shorten the length of wire, then it produces less power. Why is this happening? Because the insulation on the stator windings has deteriorated and cracked due to age and heat. Here's what you can do to test it - get the fairing off and test the AC voltage across the three stator output wires when the engine is cold - you should see between 18 and 21 volts on all phases (and they should all be within 1.5 volts of each other). Then, plug the stator back in, let the bike idle until it gets nice and hot, then repeat the AC voltage test. Bet your ass one of your stator phases will be producing about 13 volts or less. Oh, the reason the voltages are fine at speed is that even a weak stator can produce enough volts at higher rpms for the regulator to get enough input power to regulate it down to 14.3 volts DC. It's only when the bike is at idle that the stator isn't producing enough power for the regulator to hit 14.3 volts DC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmythecop Posted November 17, 2011 Author Share Posted November 17, 2011 fark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer kaldek Posted November 18, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 18, 2011 Fark as in "too hard" or as in "damn I hoped it wasn't the stator"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Rice Posted November 18, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 18, 2011 She just doesn't want you to sell her. Is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer 2thdr Posted November 18, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 18, 2011 Timmy if I can change a stator, I know a guy like you can. The most painful part is buying the parts...I went ahead a did my R/R at the same time, but Kaldek can probably tell you how to test it so you may not have to if yours isn't borked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmythecop Posted November 18, 2011 Author Share Posted November 18, 2011 Fark as in "too hard" or as in "damn I hoped it wasn't the stator"? the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Cogswell Posted November 18, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 18, 2011 Don't feel too bad - my 5th gen has a lot less mileage and the stator is well on its way to being cooked and has already had a dead R/R. I've resigned myself to viewing stators and R/R's as being wear items that will need periodic replacement. It's a bugger tho when it happens while it's listed for sale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer kaldek Posted November 18, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 18, 2011 Fark as in "too hard" or as in "damn I hoped it wasn't the stator"? the latter. Don't stress too much - stator replacement is easy - especially on the 5th-gen as it doesn't have to cross through the "V" of the motor. You will need the following: A sixpack of beer 8mm socket Either allen key or torx bits (can't remember the size) to get the stator out of the stator cover An impact screwdriver (can possibly get away without it) A new gasket A new stator The 8mm socket is used to remove the stator cover. The impact screwdriver is used to shock loose the bolts that hold the stator. If you don't use it you can strip the heads of the bolts if they're really tight. 6th-gens are notorious for this because those bolts use red thread locker. All you need is a strong bench and someone to hold the stator while you give the impact driver a sharp tap. The rest is pretty much the reverse of removal. Pretty easy job. Stators are $145 from tightwad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timmythecop Posted November 18, 2011 Author Share Posted November 18, 2011 Yes it isnt that bad, I just really like saying "46,000 miles and NO failures". But as in all higher reving motors, these things should really be considered consumables. My bro says at his shop, he is doing 4 or 5 R/R a week on GSXRs, ZXs, and R1s, because they live at stoopid revs and the rectifiers just cannot dump all that juice but for so long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer KevCarver Posted November 18, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 18, 2011 Could be that the battery didn't like the 3 week break... But check out the stator. Like I said, the continuity check is the easiest and you can do it at the same time you check out the R/R plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer kaldek Posted November 18, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 18, 2011 My bro says at his shop, he is doing 4 or 5 R/R a week on GSXRs, ZXs, and R1s, because they live at stoopid revs and the rectifiers just cannot dump all that juice but for so long. That's why he should be selling Compu-Fire regulators. Oh wait, that would mean he wouldn't get repeat business. Hmmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer gll429 Posted November 19, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 19, 2011 My bro says at his shop, he is doing 4 or 5 R/R a week on GSXRs, ZXs, and R1s, because they live at stoopid revs and the rectifiers just cannot dump all that juice but for so long. That's why he should be selling Compu-Fire regulators. Oh wait, that would mean he wouldn't get repeat business. Hmmm. yes he will. by doing a good job.. they will come back when the transmission blows..or the head or both... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer kaldek Posted November 19, 2011 Member Contributer Share Posted November 19, 2011 My bro says at his shop, he is doing 4 or 5 R/R a week on GSXRs, ZXs, and R1s, because they live at stoopid revs and the rectifiers just cannot dump all that juice but for so long. That's why he should be selling Compu-Fire regulators. Oh wait, that would mean he wouldn't get repeat business. Hmmm. yes he will. by doing a good job.. they will come back when the transmission blows..or the head or both... LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NakedViffer Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Fark as in "too hard" or as in "damn I hoped it wasn't the stator"? the latter. Don't stress too much - stator replacement is easy - especially on the 5th-gen as it doesn't have to cross through the "V" of the motor. You will need the following: A sixpack of beer 8mm socket Either allen key or torx bits (can't remember the size) to get the stator out of the stator cover An impact screwdriver (can possibly get away without it) A new gasket A new stator The 8mm socket is used to remove the stator cover. The impact screwdriver is used to shock loose the bolts that hold the stator. If you don't use it you can strip the heads of the bolts if they're really tight. 6th-gens are notorious for this because those bolts use red thread locker. All you need is a strong bench and someone to hold the stator while you give the impact driver a sharp tap. The rest is pretty much the reverse of removal. Pretty easy job. Stators are $145 from tightwad. Forgot the fastener for the retaining clip on the stator wire to the case cover. I wanna say its phillips, but its more than likely allen head, been a while since I've had one open. Sorry, gotta bust chops when I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 29, 2011 Share Posted November 29, 2011 Are aftermarket stators more durable than stock? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 29, 2011 Share Posted November 29, 2011 Especially with a Compufire RR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spud786 Posted November 29, 2011 Share Posted November 29, 2011 Since your clock reset, it means you lost battery power, Id say you have a bad connection or the battery is begining to fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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