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The version 3 optimization build


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This is going to be my effort at getting as much weight as is feasible off of my V3 as I'm going to call it. Sounds better than G3 and more like the rocket the Germans didn't get to. I have plans for suspension too. Boy is this thing soft. Really nice to ride and soaks up the bumps, but when you touch the brakes this thing thinks it's a submarine and  Dive, Dive, Dive is sounding off the intercom. Just springs will do a world of good. Here's the bike...and as you can see I have the heavy center stand on the bike and I will not do without that. I plan on looking at removing as much weight out of the cast iron support which is where most the weight is.

 

IMG_0079.thumb.JPG.06a05fae033f8a24c5ef23e3567baa9e.JPG IMG_0078.thumb.JPG.06b3b540b96972e3c8f1c5bee629bde1.JPG

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I'm not near up to speed on getting the text where I want it and pictures as well. Here's my birthday and Christmas haul on titanium and aluminum goodies...Can't wait.IMG_0083.thumb.JPG.fb491863ef2fa53eec4305f687563564.JPG

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Since I won't be hauling anyone I removed everything off the rt. rear footpeg that wasn't needed to hold the muffler. Saved .42 pounds.IMG_0082.thumb.JPG.dac7878089b0a8f10d4fea47a9c725e3.JPG

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The first thing I did was remove the stock turn signals and moved them to where Honda should have put them. 1.63 lbs. saved.

I bought some 5/8 by 058 aluminum tubing and had my machinist friend make up a new lighter grab rail bar and replaced all the steel bolts with aluminum. Saved .33 pounds.IMG_0089.thumb.JPG.50babbb5a3bf50e5640392a36b558c65.JPG

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Aluminum bolts on anything other than cosmetic stuff?  Asking for trouble.  Titanium is what you want...

 

Ciao,

 

JZH

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Even then, you want the higher-strength Ti 6al/4v stuff.

In general, aluminium bolts have 1/3rd strength of steel and Ti has 1/2 strength of steel in same size.
You can adjust those ratios somewhat with different alloys.

A lot of Ti from Chinese may be inexpensive, but are low-strength CP-commercially pure or weaker 3al/2.5v alloy.

 

Yeah, as JZH says, be careful about structural fasteners.

 

Replacing anything solid cast-iron with hollow chromoly (4130) would net quite a lot of weight-savings for same strength.

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8 hours ago, JZH said:

Aluminum bolts on anything other than cosmetic stuff?  Asking for trouble.  Titanium is what you want...

 

Ciao,

 

JZH

I have been using aluminum bolts since the mid 90's with nothing untoward happening. You have to have a good idea where they can be used and where something else would be required. My ZRX has close to 57,000 miles on it with aluminum bolts anywhere I saw fit. I started out with Poggipolini stuff until the distributor bit the dust. Hated to see that as I thought their stuff was about the best there was.

Most of my engine bolts in my other bikes are 4130 chromoly tubing in sae sizes to take up the manufacturing tolerances. Stuff from Coast Fabrication also and then their flanged nuts to turn the tubing into bolts. It was amazing what that did to my Vision racebike for vibration and handling and the weight reduction was nice too.

 

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The front reflectors are gone now which amounted to .18 of a pound and a much cleaner look. I have some Scotch or 3m reflective tape like they use on trucks that I will cut a strip and apply to the fender. I just have to find it or get some more. All the fork and triple clamp bolts were replaced along with some smaller 6mm stuff which named .43 of a pound. My plan is to use the brake fluid tube in the picture instead of the stock reservoir behind the bodywork. It's a Honda part, but it doesn't fit the VFR master cyl. as they used a larger size so I will have to use a small piece of the stock hose with a reducer to the smaller hose.IMG_0087.thumb.JPG.82db40e9da18ce1e4f460ec8c65d0093.JPG

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If that's the "HRC" kit, note that you can sometimes fit different plastic fittings to the master cylinder.  Various NISSIN OEM masters had the reservoir hose pointing in different directions and some of those had different ODs for the hose nipples.  I have swapped them around in the past.  Look at the pics on eBay.

 

The hose is polyurethane, IIRC, aka Tygon.  Everything else will sweat or discolor in contact with brake fluid.

 

Ciao,

 

JZH

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On 1/9/2021 at 3:15 PM, jefferson said:

The front reflectors are gone now which amounted to .18 of a pound and a much cleaner look. I have some Scotch or 3m reflective tape like they use on trucks that I will cut a strip and apply to the fender. I just have to find it or get some more. All the fork and triple clamp bolts were replaced along with some smaller 6mm stuff which named .43 of a pound. My plan is to use the brake fluid tube in the picture instead of the stock reservoir behind the bodywork. It's a Honda part, but it doesn't fit the VFR master cyl. as they used a larger size so I will have to use a small piece of the stock hose with a reducer to the smaller hose.IMG_0087.thumb.JPG.82db40e9da18ce1e4f460ec8c65d0093.JPG

 

 

Just get some appropriately sized Tygon, available from McMaster Carr.  I wouldn't use a reducer or shim, I would use a hose that is the appropriate size.  JMO

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It is the HRC kit and I have noticed the screw to remove the plastic end cap with the nipple. I was going to use a section of the stock hose with a reducer in that. The cleanest solution would be to get an end cap with the right size nipple on it. Have to see if I can match something up.

 

Just as a note, The HRC tube has to be bought from a Honda car dealer and the cap can be had from a Honda M/C dealer. The parts guy at the car dealer was a bike guy and was all excited as it was a first time for an HRC part to go through them. It makes not sense why they do it that way.

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can you share your mods in spreadsheet? Perhaps on Google Drive? Would love to see your progress!

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In a word, no. Computers are not my forte. If you read above I can't figure out how to get all the pictures and text where I want it and have to keep hitting reply and posting more. This is the first forum I have ever posted pictures to so there is some progress.

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2 hours ago, jefferson said:

It is the HRC kit and I have noticed the screw to remove the plastic end cap with the nipple. I was going to use a section of the stock hose with a reducer in that. The cleanest solution would be to get an end cap with the right size nipple on it. Have to see if I can match something up.

 

Just as a note, The HRC tube has to be bought from a Honda car dealer and the cap can be had from a Honda M/C dealer. The parts guy at the car dealer was a bike guy and was all excited as it was a first time for an HRC part to go through them. It makes not sense why they do it that way.

I have bought these parts at various places online, never had to use a auto parts dealer.  

Here is an example:

http://tyga-performance.com/product_info.php?products_id=459

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I wasn't buying the parts from tyga. I had the part numbers that I picked up off videos, but when I went to the Honda dealer which would be logical, they told me they couldn't get the hose and they told me I had to get it from a Honda car dealership. It took a bit of detective work in order to figure that out. The parts guy actually had to call Honda to find out why an HRC part could not be purchased through them.

Edited by jefferson
Thought of something to clarify
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Honda has weird distribution channels, but I've found that if you have the part number you can usually order it from someone.  But that someone is usually overseas, so it's just weird that a US Honda car dealer can order it and a US Honda motorcycle dealer cannot!

 

Ciao,

 

JZH

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Interesting topic, thanks for sharing. You're doing a great job for not a computer guy.

 

I take it the goal is to reduce weight but still keep the bike looking as close to stock as possible?

 

Look into having a lexan copy of the headlight glass made up... you'd be astonished at just how heavy that headlight assembly is.

 

The rear subframe is also seriously lardy, I replaced the entire rear bodywork/seat unit on a 4th Gen with one from a 2002 Yamaha R6. The entire Yamaha tail (subframe, seat, undertray etc.) weighs less than just the bare VFR subframe. An aluminium copy would take a lot of work, though.

 

You could also replace some of the metal pipes in the cooling system with plastic. I've got an electric waterpump for that 4th Gen but it requires a digital controller to get the best efficiency, so there wasn't much of a weight saving there - but the engine now no longer will have to drive the stock pump, so reduced parasitic power loss there, the hole in the block where the stock pump drive went is blocked by a welch plug I happened to have lying around from a Ford Windsor V8 kit.

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1 hour ago, The Phantom said:

Interesting topic, thanks for sharing. You're doing a great job for not a computer guy.

 

I take it the goal is to reduce weight but still keep the bike looking as close to stock as possible?

 

Look into having a lexan copy of the headlight glass made up... you'd be astonished at just how heavy that headlight assembly is.

 

The rear subframe is also seriously lardy, I replaced the entire rear bodywork/seat unit on a 4th Gen with one from a 2002 Yamaha R6. The entire Yamaha tail (subframe, seat, undertray etc.) weighs less than just the bare VFR subframe. An aluminium copy would take a lot of work, though.

 

You could also replace some of the metal pipes in the cooling system with plastic. I've got an electric waterpump for that 4th Gen but it requires a digital controller to get the best efficiency, so there wasn't much of a weight saving there - but the engine now no longer will have to drive the stock pump, so reduced parasitic power loss there, the hole in the block where the stock pump drive went is blocked by a welch plug I happened to have lying around from a Ford Windsor V8 kit.

I have been looking at the subframe to see where I could use hole saws and drills to take material out and I have located a number of places, but the savings won't be great. I did that to the seat pan and had a .02 savings, of course that was plastic. I would love to have an aluminum copy made of the stock subframe and for that matter the front subframe for the fairing, but I don't know anyone with the skills at the moment. I take that back, a place just came to mind that does custom car work and could do it if they would.

 

I was thinking about the water pipes today when I was peering into the middle of the v. The ZRX bunch came across some titanium coolant pipes for it that were super neat, but real expensive.

 

I have always wondered about how much power loss is saved as you then have to run the pump with more drag on the charging system. Never seen any facts and figures although I have done it to my van. It does make the water pumps last longer with out that big heavy fan hanging off the front/

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  • 2 weeks later...

I have to say it is pretty frustrating to go into 2 multiline dealerships and when you tell the parts guy 93 VFR750 they ask who makes that! Really.

I got the Barnett hard anodized aluminum clutch plates in with a .86 lb. savings. Removed the sound deadening from the cover along with some other weight removal and saved .29 of a pound. The new aluminum drain plug with magnet saved .04. I did weigh the footpeg weight from the other thread along with the peg feelers I had removed earlier which netted .37 of a pound. That footpeg weight is heavy.IMG_0093.thumb.JPG.2465405a8dbee221688ce6146e706cf4.JPG

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Don't remove the exhaust shield behind your right foot peg, as you will ROAST your leg at stoplights, and low speed riding in the summer. It looks better without, but unless you heat wrap the exhaust, it will be pretty hot!20150905_181319.thumb.jpg.d23c280323fdfab4fa74914fd5e1ee9d.jpg

20150905_185008.jpg

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I have already noticed the heat and it wasn't even hot out. I'm considering having the exhaust jet hot coated or some such. Still might need some more work to stay comfortable. I think a carbon fiber heat shield would look good.

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Got my ti swingarm pinch bolt in and the only thing I can say I dislike is the morphodite 18mm head size. It is .13 of a lb. lighter. I had my machinist drill it and I may have him turn that 18mm into a 17 mm head. I have done some research into subframes and I found a guy who 3d prints carbon fiber subframes, but the cost is prohibitive. He gave me a guys name for aluminum subframes that looks promising. Haven't been able to contact him yet due to work.IMG_0090.thumb.JPG.b413e89f0f6932a8dd0f92a32033f0c9.JPGIMG_0091.thumb.JPG.cd43d7d8eaf896882fa0fac6e744b064.JPG

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