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8200rpm

Thermostat replacement - hope to never do this again

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Very nice job.  This is going to be a solid 5th Gen, ready for another 20 years.

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11 hours ago, 8200rpm said:

For anyone replacing hoses, please remember to replace the o-rings in the water joints to the head in between the V and the two on the port side.

 

Another good tip. Thanks for the thread. Sorry my third generation questions sidetracked your project. That wasn't my intention. Once folks started helping me out it was a little late to change to my own thread.

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1 hour ago, Gebruiker said:

 

Another good tip. Thanks for the thread. Sorry my third generation questions sidetracked your project. That wasn't my intention. Once folks started helping me out it was a little late to change to my own thread.

No need for apologies. We’re all here to learn and help each other. 

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On 2/29/2020 at 6:09 PM, 8200rpm said:

It’s coming together now...

 

For anyone replacing hoses, please remember to replace the o-rings in the water joints to the head in between the V and the two on the port side.


 

This is the condition of the o-rings in the water joints in the V.

4C7207B1-07A3-4E6C-AB27-489BE03C42E8.thumb.jpeg.f528e8914137538abce4232b2500a43c.jpeg


Fresh o-ring

 

Call a penalty on me for piling on - I've been at my 5th gen's hoses, etc.  Even though it's a very low mile bike and has had regular cooling system maintenance, when I removed the two water necks from the V, I found mine in very much the same condition . . . These things are absolutely petrified.  Strangely other joints in the system look new and the o-rings are in fine condition (though those o-rings are also being replaced).   So the condition of the two (below) is not due to lack of maintenance or mileage, just age.  Rather than attempt to clean these, they're relatively cheap (about $20 for the pair) so a new set is on the way along with new o-rings.   So it seems regardless - if a motor is old enough, it's going to experience deterioration in the rubber cooling system components.  Thankfully these are all still available from Honda.  Once they're gone - I suppose my 5th gen will be my personal museum piece. 

 

20200310_200654_resized.thumb.jpg.50570dcd5553787d8f3fbe9ccbe2dfdf.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

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49 minutes ago, Cogswell said:

Call a penalty on me for piling on - I've been at my 5th gen's hoses, etc.  Even though it's a very low mile bike and has had regular cooling system maintenance, when I removed the two water necks from the V, I found mine in very much the same condition . . . These things are absolutely petrified.  Strangely other joints in the system look new and the o-rings are in fine condition (though those o-rings are also being replaced).   So the condition of the two (below) is not due to lack of maintenance or mileage, just age.  Rather than attempt to clean these, they're relatively cheap (about $20 for the pair) so a new set is on the way along with new o-rings.   So it seems regardless - if a motor is old enough, it's going to experience deterioration in the rubber cooling system components.  Thankfully these are all still available from Honda.  Once they're gone - I suppose my 5th gen will be my personal museum piece. 

Hi Cogswell.

Your pictures seem to show a fine example of perhaps a chemical reaction to the o-ring rubber. The housings are very nice and clean internally, a testament to your good cooling system maintainance. I just wonder wether the o-ring specs are not compatible to engine coolant chemicals, there really seems like some bad chemical reaction going on with the o-rings over a long period. Just a thought!

Cheers.

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This subject of ancient cooling hoses worries me....

My ‘99 VFR has covered 18000 miles and has languished in a heated garage for the past 4 years...

I've never looked in the under-filter innards yet. So how are my hoses down there?

Your photos make me defo uneasy... Hopefully they are OK. Replacement prices are not good.

I will let you know what I find....

 

Chris B.

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Regarding an earlier entry: a peek at the coolant overflow container should reveal the color of the coolant.

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On 2/19/2020 at 12:57 AM, Cogswell said:

Also, be kind to the throttle body boots.  They are no longer available so if they get borked you'll have to find them used.

 

I have a set of 6th Gen boots on hand (Loaned from MiniCarver, Thanks!) to see what, if any, differences there are. Best I can tell is that the 5Th Gen boots have MBG molded into the top, and 6th have MCW. Fit nice and snug to a 2000 TB, interior contours match up from TB to boot.

MiniCarver is running 6th Gen TB on 5Th Gen engine, with a new set of MCW boots (which is why he has a used set spare).

Ron Ayes shows MCW at $10.11 each, MBG has no listed price.

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So 8200rpm, where did you finally get all your hoses from and at what cost?

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On 3/24/2020 at 8:43 PM, Fritzer said:

So 8200rpm, where did you finally get all your hoses from and at what cost?

Partzilla. Around $235 including a new radiator cap, thermostat and 5 o-rings...

 

Description Price Diagram #
Radiator cap $30.93 Radiator 11
Hose, Radiator (lower) $12.35 Radiator 20
Hose, L. Radiator (lower) $6.69 Radiator 21
Hose, R. Radiator (lower) $14.01 Radiator 22
Hose, Radiator (upper) $7.41 Radiator 24
Hose, R. Radiator (upper) $22.50 Radiator 25
Hose, Radiator breather $12.14 Radiator 27
Hose, Overflow, Bulk (into and out of resv. tank) $21.78 Radiator 39
Thermostat $28.19 Water Pump 2
O-Ring, 47.5x2 $1.59 Water Pump 17
Hose A $11.18 Water Pump 11
Hose B $7.02 Water Pump 12
Hose, Bypass $40.83 Water Pump 13
Hose, Fr. Head $4.61 Water Pump 14
Hose Rr. Head $4.61 Water Pump 15
O-Ring, 23x2.4 for Joint A (fr. head port) $2.05 Water Pump 16
O-Ring, 23x2.4 for Joint B (rr. head, port) $2.05 Water Pump 16
O-Ring, 21.2x2.4 for Joint (inside V to fr. head) $2.58 Water Pump 18
O-Ring, 21.2x2.4 for Joint (inside V to rr. head) $2.58 Water Pump 18
Total $235.10    

 

The upper middle radiator hose between the two radiators is no longer available. I'm not really worried about that one, since it's easy to access from the front of the bike, and the hose has very little bend to it. It should be easy to replace using generic automotive hose if you detect a leak.

 

Also, for 00-01 bikes, you'll need two more hoses that go to the throttle body assembly.

 

I might have also replaced a couple of the small wire tube clips that were corroded. Most of the worm drive clamps were re-useable. For the hose clamps inside the V of the engine, I tightened them down onto the new hoses. Let them sit overnight to compress the new rubber, then tightened them down again. I don't want any leaks in there due to insufficient clamp tension!

 

Also, getting the pair tube reattached to the front of the airbox is a MAJOR PITA!

 

1951367587_dadsgarage.thumb.jpg.88ee7f81ab67f14210284786eb76c9c8.jpg

 

 

After I got everything back together and refilled the coolant, I left the side fairings off just in case. I fired up the bike, and it started right away but it would not hold idle and die after a few seconds. The FI light was also blinking. I had to run the FI self-diagnostic... two blinks = "loose connection to the MAP sensor vacuum tube" as per the service manual. And that's exactly what it was! In my rush to get everything back together after my "episode" with the front PAIR tube, I forgot to reattach the vacuum hose to the MAP sensor on the back of the air box. Easy fix,  reset the malfunction light as per the service manual, and the bike was running perfect!

 

I rode the bike naked for a couple days just to make sure there were no leaks or other issues.

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8 hours ago, 8200rpm said:

Partzilla. Around $235 including a new radiator cap, thermostat and 5 o-rings...

 

 

 

Description Price Diagram #
Radiator cap $30.93 Radiator 11
Hose, Radiator (lower) $12.35 Radiator 20
Hose, L. Radiator (lower) $6.69 Radiator 21
Hose, R. Radiator (lower) $14.01 Radiator 22
Hose, Radiator (upper) $7.41 Radiator 24
Hose, R. Radiator (upper) $22.50 Radiator 25
Hose, Radiator breather $12.14 Radiator 27
Hose, Overflow, Bulk (into and out of resv. tank) $21.78 Radiator 39
Thermostat $28.19 Water Pump 2
O-Ring, 47.5x2 $1.59 Water Pump 17
Hose A $11.18 Water Pump 11
Hose B $7.02 Water Pump 12
Hose, Bypass $40.83 Water Pump 13
Hose, Fr. Head $4.61 Water Pump 14
Hose Rr. Head $4.61 Water Pump 15
O-Ring, 23x2.4 for Joint A (fr. head port) $2.05 Water Pump 16
O-Ring, 23x2.4 for Joint B (rr. head, port) $2.05 Water Pump 16
O-Ring, 21.2x2.4 for Joint (inside V to fr. head) $2.58 Water Pump 18
O-Ring, 21.2x2.4 for Joint (inside V to rr. head) $2.58 Water Pump 18
Total $235.10    

 

The upper middle radiator hose between the two radiators is no longer available. I'm not really worried about that one, since it's easy to access from the front of the bike, and the hose has very little bend to it. It should be easy to replace using generic automotive hose if you detect a leak.

 

Also, for 00-01 bikes, you'll need two more hoses that go to the throttle body assembly.

 

I might have also replaced a couple of the small wire tube clips that were corroded. Most of the worm drive clamps were re-useable. For the hose clamps inside the V of the engine, I tightened them down onto the new hoses. Let them sit overnight to compress the new rubber, then tightened them down again. I don't want any leaks in there due to insufficient clamp tension!

 

Also, getting the pair tube reattached to the front of the airbox is a MAJOR PITA!

 

1951367587_dadsgarage.thumb.jpg.88ee7f81ab67f14210284786eb76c9c8.jpg

 

 

After I got everything back together and refilled the coolant, I left the side fairings off just in case. I fired up the bike, and it started right away but it would not hold idle and die after a few seconds. The FI light was also blinking. I had to run the FI self-diagnostic... two blinks = "loose connection to the MAP sensor vacuum tube" as per the service manual. And that's exactly what it was! In my rush to get everything back together after my "episode" with the front PAIR tube, I forgot to reattach the vacuum hose to the MAP sensor on the back of the air box. Easy fix,  reset the malfunction light as per the service manual, and the bike was running perfect!

 

I rode the bike naked for a couple days just to make sure there were no leaks or other issues.

So True. I've got a few "sayings" but I'll leave them to y'all's imagination. I'd be surprised if that isn't a common situation. But we'd need a non-family section to explore that subject in detail, as much as I'd find it interesting to do. 

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The kid in front may have overhead me when I dealt with my cooling system.

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On 2/29/2020 at 6:09 PM, 8200rpm said:

It’s coming together now...

 

For anyone replacing hoses, please remember to replace the o-rings in the water joints to the head in between the V and the two on the port side.


 

Looking better...

B481A0B2-BE5A-4D47-9556-0268083CA78A.thumb.jpeg.65a39f0d3ad7eb14449247d701e5e713.jpeg
 

I decided to replace the overflow hose into and out of the reservoir tank and also the air bleed hose from the starboard side radiator to the thermostat housing. Those are still in the mail, so the throttle bodies need to stay off the bike until then.

 

Not being able to ride sucks. 

Nice acquisition! Doesn’t the bank of V look so much nicer with fresh hoses? This post is déjà vu as I did the very same job last year after discovering the water pump was weeping.  Leading up to that, I new I needed to replace the thermostat and a quick evaluation of the hoses’ condition led me to add the replacements to the parts list. I found the o-rings to be in exactly that condition. Additionally I removed the radiators to clean the fins with compressed air and HVAC evaporator cleaner. It was a great learning and familiarizing experience part of which was an understanding of the coolant circuits’ flow. I too went with Honda Type 2 auto coolant. The job was a success; no leaks and the coolant temp consistently runs about 100 degrees over ambient at speeds over ~30-40mph. The other memorable aspect of this job was I performed a valve clearance check/adjustment concurrently so that added some time.

 

Good stuff - I think you’ll enjoy the piece of mind knowing the good condition to which you’ve restored that system. So, good job.

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16 hours ago, YosemiteVFR said:

The other memorable aspect of this job was I performed a valve clearance check/adjustment concurrently so that added some time.

 

Good stuff - I think you’ll enjoy the piece of mind knowing the good condition to which you’ve restored that system. So, good job.

Thanks!

 

As for the valve job, I was super tempted to get into those heads especially because it's such a hassle getting the airbox and throttle body off. My problem is that I have no patience when my bike is down. I'm jonesing the entire time to ride again. So, I saved the valve job for "next time".

 

I agree with you about piece of mind. Before this task, I was constantly smelling coolant on every ride, worried about what was going on inside that V, and checking the reservoir level after every ride. No more! I can enjoy riding with the temp consistently reading 170-180F. Piece of mind for sure!

 

Every mechanical challenge and wrestling match brings me a bit closer to the machine. Feels like I grow more intimately connected to it.

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4 hours ago, 8200rpm said:

Thanks!

 

As for the valve job, I was super tempted to get into those heads especially because it's such a hassle getting the airbox and throttle body off. My problem is that I have no patience when my bike is down. I'm jonesing the entire time to ride again. So, I saved the valve job for "next time".

 

I agree with you about piece of mind. Before this task, I was constantly smelling coolant on every ride, worried about what was going on inside that V, and checking the reservoir level after every ride. No more! I can enjoy riding with the temp consistently reading 170-180F. Piece of mind for sure!

 

Every mechanical challenge and wrestling match brings me a bit closer to the machine. Feels like I grow more intimately connected to it.

It’s a somewhat amusing phenomenon that I and presumably some or many others will put up with something that needs fixing for quite a while. “Oh that’s right, I need to...” every time you engage with that given thing. Then the satisfaction & relief that comes with the release of attention from that undone thing that’s now done. 
 

When you go to do the valve check/adjust I think you’ll find removing the air filter housing easier than last time and enjoy the fact that you don’t have to remove the throttle bodies! 🎉 Rear bank is nice and accessible; the front...not so much. You’ll decide whether unfastening & lowering the radiators provides “enough” room to work on the front bank. Since I was going to be replacing the coolant hoses, I decided, once I saw what room lowering the radiators gave me, to remove the radiators. Even then I felt fortunate that no adjustment was necessary. Do you have the factory service manual? Do you plan on purchasing a third party shim kit to minimize down time?

 

i agree with you about the regard one gains for the bike after going through the trials of a service or repair for the first time. Unknowns become knowns. I have things on my laundry list which are firsts for me. I’m looking forward to arriving out the other end. There are so many examples of well-kept VFRs on this forum that provide inspiration not only of all the great upgrades and personalization but also just how good a clean & refreshed stock (or mostly) VFR is to see. It makes me want to just take mine completely apart and clean it.
 

Good luck with yours. I look forward to seeing the results of your endeavors.

 

Cheers

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