Double fatality close to our house

[ancon]

On Saturday, there was a double fatality about a mile from our house. Husband and wife on cruiser-style motorcycle were riding on a clear, sunny day. Coming up on a yellow light, the rider was apparently a little too close to the SUV in front of him--couldn't stop when the SUV slowed and stopped as the light turned red. Rider veered to the right to avoid the SUV, entered the intersection and collided with a box truck turning left in front of him. Both rider and passenger were dead at the scene. Neither had helmets on--may not have even helped--who knows.

Not sure who was at fault--not clear if the light was yellow or red. Was the box truck at fault? He clearly did not see the motorcycle quickly maneuver around the box truck into his path as he was turning. Should he have waited until the intersection was clear before he turned?

Whatever the case, I was reminded of some basic riding strategies from this accident:

1. Approaching intersections (traffic signals) requires double my attention

2. Keep a safe distance behind cars as I approach an intersection--as I can't always assume the car in front will go through on a yellow light

3. Do not make any movements/lane changes approaching an intersection

4. Avoid riding too closely behind larger vehicles, as they limit line of sight to traffic signals and oncoming traffic.

5. Wear a helmet--may not always help in a serious collision, but at least it'll give me a chance.

Just thought I'd share--this has been a huge story around our neighborhood and I've been greatly affected. One of those stories where friends and relatives called me to make sure I was ok because it happened so close to our house. My next door neighbor who witnessed the accident wishes I'd sell my motorcycle.

I know it's impossible to avoid everything that happens on a motorcycle, but maybe these lessons may help you somewhere down the road. Thanks for reading.

[V4 Rosso]

Whatever the case, I learned a few lessons from this accident:

I hope you meant it was more of a confirmation of what you allready knew as this is all very basic stuff, isn't it?

[Jakobi]

4. Avoid riding too closely behind larger vehicles, as they limit line of sight to traffic signals and oncoming traffic.

^ This.

I once blew a red because I was behind a semi+trailer and I didn't think he would turn right on a red. I got lucky in that there was a gap in traffic going both directions. Almost needed a change of shorts after that.

-Jake

[spud786]

Being this was a 2 up incident everything as far as procedural, should have had double the distance.

[HispanicSlammer]

Good advice, dont follow too close, but sometimes people take advantage of your space and slot right in front of you this happens to me on the interstates. So you have to be aware of your mirrors and the cars next to you. I dont like riding right next to anybody either I dont want to get boxed in, usually go faster then the rest of traffic so that whats behind me is not approaching me from behind too.

I was thinking of passing a slow moving truck on the dotted yellow but the guy slowed down even more, sent my radar up a bit so I slowed down and waited to pass and then he darted across the road into a gravel driveway with NO signal. Had I tried to pass I would have been in the dirt! I use the SIPDE Process as much as possible on the road.

[ancon]

Whatever the case, I learned a few lessons from this accident:

I hope you meant it was more of a confirmation of what you allready knew as this is all very basic stuff, isn't it?

Of course--post was edited to show that my list was reminders and not new lessons to be learned. Thanks Rosso.

[Cogswell]

This reminds me why I: 1. Don't ride 2 up and 2. Don't ride a cruiser I can't imagine riding a Harley with only a rear brake . . . but I see people doing it. I guess they think it's cool.

It's easy to forget, but in my MSF class (I should take it again) they told us to ride with the outlook that "you are invisible and everyone is trying to kill you. Take nothing for granted - road conditions, off ramps, green lights, animals, that driver waiting to turn sees you, etc etc."

[VFRBulldawg]

We had an off duty police officer die here a week ago. He was riding a harley sportster on a busy road with two lanes each direction and a turn lane in the middle. He was in the right lane and passing a car in the left lane as he approached an intersection that had a green light. A lady at the intersection did not see him because he was behind the car from her point of view. The police said she had plenty of time and clearance to turn left in front of the car but since the bike was moving faster not in front of the bike. The police said she never knew the bike was there until it hit her. The bike hit the rear fender of the SUV. The passenger was pretty banged up but survived. I hate to second guess a dead man, but as I see it, the lane to the left of him was clear and a quick swerve prevents a fatal crash.

Almost all the fatalities around here seem to come from harley/cruiser riders on busy roads. I'm not sure if that's because there seem to be more harleys out there than other bikes. But you almost never see a harley rider with a full face helmet. From what I can gather about the fatalities of people I don't know and several near fatalities (one case in ICU for over a month and other with a severed spinal cord) of people I know that go to my church (again all harley riders) the main issue seems not choosing to swerve and just hitting the brakes. This is compounded by the harley riders not knowing how hard they can hit the brakes or how to stop fast. In almost every case it seems to me that there was time and space to swerve into the adjacent lane or turn lane, or at least split the lane for a short distance before doing so. In all fatality and bad crash cases the rider never attempted to swerve and only hit the brakes. In some cases it seemed to me like there should have been enough room to slow or stop unless the rider was really hauling butt if the rider knows how to stop quickly. In other cases there was not enough room to stop, so attempting to do so when an avenue of escape existed was the wrong choice. In all cases there was severe trauma to the face and front of the skull because they were not wearing full face helmets.

I have been trying to talk to my harley riding friends at church about practicing emergency riding maneuvers and wearing more protective gear. I swear most of them have been riding alot longer than me but their skills at maneuving their bikes suck. We have nothing but straight, flat, country roads around here (which is what they prefer) I can't seem to get them to want to try to learn or practice anything. I was able to convince a few of them to give up their open face helmets for full face helmets right after two of our church members were almost killed, but a year later they are all back to wearing open face helmets. One of them told me he after he went back to open face that he spent $240 on a top of the line skid lid since it offered the most protection. I told him to let me know how that works for him the next time he crashes and lands and slides on the top of his head. As for other gear, it's hot down here and at best they wear jeans, leather vests, and gloves with open fingers. Often it's just shorts and a Tshirt. The only time they wear any leather (no armor) is when it gets cold in the mornings in the fall and spring. But they take it off and put it in their saddle bags as soon as it starts to warm up some. I just shake my head.

I swear these people are businessmen, cops, firefighters, mechanics, etc. They are generally smart seemly competent and normal people and not some bike gang wannabe's. What is it about harley riders that makes them not actually want to learn how to ride skillfully or wear any serious protective gear????

[kaldek]

My next door neighbor who witnessed the accident wishes I'd sell my motorcycle.

That attitude bugs me severely. Should I sell my car because there was a car crash nearby? No. But as soon as somebody gets killed on a bike, everyone is all over your ass telling you to give it up. WTF?

[mello dude]

I was thinking of passing a slow moving truck on the dotted yellow but the guy slowed down even more, sent my radar up a bit so I slowed down and waited to pass and then he darted across the road into a gravel driveway with NO signal. Had I tried to pass I would have been in the dirt! I use the SIPDE Process as much as possible on the road.

A long while ago, I was riding around on an '84 Sabre. I did a turn left on a 4 lane road at a busy city intersection in the left lane and there was a pickup truck in the right lane kinda going slow. I didnt take notice. I thought I had a clear shot and opened the gas a bit hard while just then the pickup truck driver decided that he wanted to turn left into a shopping center. He didnt see me cause I was zipping past and I ended up hitting his front drivers side fender square and I was launched over the hood and truck. My gear saved my butt but the bike was totalled.

The truck driver was cited, but in reality, my stupid ass could have avoided the whole thing if I was paying attention. That moment was sort of an epiphany for me in riding motorcycles and has probably has kept me allive in riding since. I havent been in a wreck since.

6 years ago, I was with a riding buddy headed for the dragon on TN129. My buddy Dean, on his ZX6 approached a pickup truck that was gradually going slower and was doing maybe 20 mph. I saw this coming before it happened. Dean decided to wack the gas to pass and I'm going - "No Dean! No!" Yup the pickup truck turns left into a driveway and Dean smacks the rear quarter panel. Dean was a bit banged up but ok, still needed a hospital trip. but bike totalled and towed to a local dealer- - - - I was glad that Dean was ok, but he didnt understand why I was a bit pissed at him for walking into a most basic foreseeable danger and risk. , The driver of the truck was cited for no turn signal and assigned fault for the incident by the THP, but again like my stupid wreck of years ago, if Dean was thinking and paying attention to the situation, he could have avoided the whole thing.

The goofy thing about it was, this was going to be my first taste of the Dragon ever, (I'm on my old 4th gen) and after the wreck, I couldnt get this damn video out of my head that was running over and over in slow motion of Dean doing the slash wham bang. Bleah, I not gonna do any twisty riding with that going on in my head and it was a total abort for the Dragon idea. After picking up the pieces of the crash, and taking care of business to help Dean clean up details, it was ride it home to Ohio solo the next day.

This reminds me why I: 1. Don't ride 2 up and 2. Don't ride a cruiser I can't imagine riding a Harley with only a rear brake . . . but I see people doing it. I guess they think it's cool.

It's easy to forget, but in my MSF class (I should take it again) they told us to ride with the outlook that "you are invisible and everyone is trying to kill you. Take nothing for granted - road conditions, off ramps, green lights, animals, that driver waiting to turn sees you, etc etc."

-Um - Cruisers have front brakes too, its a matter of using them. (My Valkyrie has excellent brakes.) --- It's all about rider skill and being a thinking rider. Experience puts it all together.

-Totally agree with the idea of riding like you are invisible and everyone is trying to kill you... That is the first pretense of getting on a bike.

[Guest Recalcitrance]

A couple months ago, there was a fatal crash on a local canyon road here between a cruiser and a CBR1000RR. An off duty police officer was on the Harley and a solo rider on the CBR. The officer didn't survive the crash. The cause of the accident was the Harley rider's swerving into the opposite lane as a result of entering the turn too fast. The collision photos were evidence to how fast both riders were going. There was also a third bike which was following the Honda and that rider suffered severe injuries as did the rider of the CBR.

Quite sad. Every Sunday when I ride through the canyon, I see the roadside memorial. Good reminder.

I also just finished re-taking the MSF course today to review basic skills. I was reminded of just how much we know as experienced riders....but don't utilize (as much as we should).

The instructors gave me repeated reminders to give up the 2-finger braking...at least when I'm on the range.

Ride safe, everyone.

R

[Guest]

Copy an pasted:

50 Tips for Motorcycle Riders

From the August, 2006 issue of Motorcyclist

By The Motorcyclist Staff

The best bike in the world is scrap--or soon will be--unless you learn how to use it. The most powerful piece of high-performance hardware is between your ears. To help you program it with the right information, we've assembled 50 potentially lifesaving bits of street savvy. Some you'll know, some you won't. All are worth remembering, because when it comes to riding motorcycles on the street, the people over at the Motorcycle Safety Foundation (www.msf-usa.org) have the right idea with their tagline: The more you know, the better it gets.

1. Assume you're invisible

Because to a lot of drivers, you are. Never make a move based on the assumption that another driver sees you, even if you've just made eye contact. Bikes don't always register in the four-wheel mind.

2. Be considerate

The consequences of strafing the jerk du jour or cutting him off start out bad and get worse. Pretend it was your grandma and think again.

3. Dress for the crash, not the pool or the prom

Sure, Joaquin's Fish Tacos is a 5-minute trip, but nobody plans to eat pavement. Modern mesh gear means 100-degree heat is no excuse for a T-shirt and board shorts.

4. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst

Assume that car across the intersection will turn across your bow when the light goes green, with or without a turn signal.

5. Leave your ego at home

The only people who really care if you were faster on the freeway will be the officer and the judge.

6. Pay attention

Yes, there is a half-naked girl on the billboard. That shock does feels squishy. Meanwhile, you could be drifting toward Big Trouble. Focus.

7. Mirrors only show you part of the picture

Never change direction without turning your head to make sure the coast really is clear.

8. Be patient

Always take another second or three before you pull out to pass, ride away from a curb or into freeway traffic from an on-ramp. It's what you don't see that gets you. That extra look could save your butt.

9. Watch your closing speed

Passing cars at twice their speed or changing lanes to shoot past a row of stopped cars is just asking for trouble.

10. Beware the verge and the merge

A lot of nasty surprises end up on the sides of the road: empty McDonald's bags, nails, TV antennas, ladders, you name it. Watch for potentially troublesome debris on both sides of the road.

11. Left-turning cars remain a leading killer of motorcyclists

Don't assume someone will wait for you to dart through the intersection. They're trying to beat the light, too.

12. Beware of cars running traffic lights

The first few seconds after a signal light changes are the most perilous. Look both ways before barging into an intersection.

13. Check your mirrors

Do it every time you change lanes, slow down or stop. Be ready to move if another vehicle is about to occupy the space you'd planned to use.

14. Mind the gap

Remember Driver's Ed? One second's worth of distance per 10 mph is the old rule of thumb. Better still, scan the next 12 seconds ahead for potential trouble.

15. Beware of tuner cars

They're quick and their drivers tend to be aggressive. Don't assume you've beaten one away from a light or outpaced it in traffic and change lanes without looking. You could end up as a Nissan hood ornament.

16. Excessive entrance speed hurts

It's the leading cause of single-bike accidents on twisty roads and racetracks. In Slow, Out Fast is the old adage, and it still works. Dialing up corner speed is safer than scrubbing it off.

17. Don't trust that deer whistle

Ungulates and other feral beasts prowl at dawn and dusk, so heed those big yellow signs. If you're riding in a target-rich environment, slow down and watch the shoulders.

18. Learn to use both brakes

The front does most of your stopping, but a little rear brake on corner entry can calm a nervous chassis.

19. Keep the front brake covered--always

Save a single second of reaction time at 60 mph and you can stop 88 feet shorter. Think about that.

20. Look where you want to go

Use the miracle of target fixation to your advantage. The motorcycle goes where you look, so focus on the solution instead of the problem.

21. Keep your eyes moving

Traffic is always shifting, so keep scanning for potential trouble. Don't lock your eyes on any one thing for too long unless you're actually dealing with trouble.

22. Think before you act

Careful whipping around that Camry going 7 mph in a 25-mph zone or you could end up with your head in the driver's side door when he turns into the driveway right in front of you.

23. Raise your gaze

It's too late to do anything about the 20 feet immediately in front of your fender, so scan the road far enough ahead to see trouble and change trajectory.

24. Get your mind right in the driveway

Most accidents happen during the first 15 minutes of a ride, below 40 mph, near an intersection or driveway. Yes, that could be your driveway.

25. Come to a full stop at that next stop sign

Put a foot down. Look again. Anything less forces a snap decision with no time to spot potential trouble.

26. Never dive into a gap in stalled traffic

Cars may have stopped for a reason, and you may not be able to see why until it's too late to do anything about it.

27. Don't saddle up more than you can handle

If you weigh 95 pounds, avoid that 795-pound cruiser. If you're 5-foot-5, forget those towering adventure-tourers.

28. Watch for car doors opening in traffic

And smacking a car that's swerving around some goofball's open door is just as painful.

29. Don't get in an intersection rut

Watch for a two-way stop after a string of four-way intersections. If you expect cross-traffic to stop, there could be a painful surprise when it doesn't.

30. Stay in your comfort zone when you're with a group

Riding over your head is a good way to end up in the ditch. Any bunch worth riding with will have a rendezvous point where you'll be able to link up again.

31. Give your eyes some time to adjust

A minute or two of low light heading from a well-lighted garage onto dark streets is a good thing. Otherwise, you're essentially flying blind for the first mile or so.

32. Master the slow U-turn

Practice. Park your butt on the outside edge of the seat and lean the bike into the turn, using your body as a counterweight as you pivot around the rear wheel.

33. Who put a stop sign at the top of this hill?

Don't panic. Use the rear brake to keep from rolling back down. Use Mr. Throttle and Mr. Clutch normally--and smoothly--to pull away.

34. If it looks slippery, assume it is

A patch of suspicious pavement could be just about anything. Butter Flavor Crisco? Gravel? Mobil 1? Or maybe it's nothing. Better to slow down for nothing than go on your head.

35. Bang! A blowout! Now what?

No sudden moves. The motorcycle isn't happy, so be prepared to apply a little calming muscle to maintain course. Ease back the throttle, brake gingerly with the good wheel and pull over very smoothly to the shoulder. Big sigh.

36. Drops on the faceshield?

It's raining. Lightly misted pavement can be slipperier than when it's been rinsed by a downpour, and you never know how much grip there is. Apply maximum-level concentration, caution and smoothness.

37. Emotions in check?

To paraphrase Mr. Ice Cube, chickity-check yoself before you wreck yoself. Emotions are as powerful as any drug, so take inventory every time you saddle up. If you're mad, sad, exhausted or anxious, stay put.

38. Wear good gear

Wear stuff that fits you and the weather. If you're too hot or too cold or fighting with a jacket that binds across the shoulders, you're dangerous. It's that simple.

39. Leave the iPod at home

You won't hear that cement truck in time with Spinal Tap cranked to 11, but they might like your headphones in intensive care.

40. Learn to swerve

Be able to do two tight turns in quick succession. Flick left around the bag of briquettes, then right back to your original trajectory. The bike will follow your eyes, so look at the way around, not the briquettes. Now practice till it's a reflex.

41. Be smooth at low speeds

Take some angst out, especially of slow-speed maneuvers, with a bit of rear brake. It adds a welcome bit of stability by minimizing unwelcome weight transfer and potentially bothersome driveline lash.

42. Flashing is good for you

Turn signals get your attention by flashing, right? So a few easy taps on the pedal or lever before stopping makes your brake light more eye-catching to trailing traffic.

43. Intersections are scary, so hedge your bets

Put another vehicle between your bike and the possibility of someone running the stop sign/red light on your right and you cut your chances of getting nailed in half.

44. Tune your peripheral vision

Pick a point near the center of that wall over there. Now scan as far as you can by moving your attention, not your gaze. The more you can see without turning your head, the sooner you can react to trouble.

45. All alone at a light that won't turn green?

Put as much motorcycle as possible directly above the sensor wire--usually buried in the pavement beneath you and located by a round or square pattern behind the limit line. If the light still won't change, try putting your kickstand down, right on the wire. You should be on your way in seconds.

46. Every-thing is harder to see after dark

Adjust your headlights, Carry a clear faceshield and have your game all the way on after dark, especially during commuter hours.

47. Don't troll next to--or right behind--Mr. Peterbilt

If one of those 18 retreads blows up--which they do with some regularity--it de-treads, and that can be ugly. Unless you like dodging huge chunks of flying rubber, keep your distance.

48. Take the panic out of panic stops

Develop an intimate relationship with your front brake. Seek out some safe, open pavement. Starting slowly, find that fine line between maximum braking and a locked wheel, and then do it again, and again.

49. Make your tires right

None of this stuff matters unless your skins are right. Don't take 'em for granted. Make sure pressure is spot-on every time you ride. Check for cuts, nails and other junk they might have picked up, as well as general wear.

50. Take a deep breath

[Muff]

As a 30 year Paramedic I have seen motorcycle, auto, truck and God knows what kind of wrecks. I bought my VFR about two years ago desiring the feelings of a bike from years ago. I do NOT regret my decision and love the ME time I have. I know the dangers but would rather have that feeling of riding. I'm 55 years old and have a wonderful wife, children and life. It's worth the risk if you want to say that.

Eleanor Roosevelt said it best: Do one thing every day that scares you.

[Polarbear]

Thanks for these tips.

C

[MBrane]

6. Pay attention

This is probably the single most important thing on this list other than the obvious point of being able to properly handle your machine. You need to pay attention not only for yourself, but also for all the others on the road who aren't. Your life depends on it.

[Muff]

It is posting like this that make us review our driving habits. As I read the list above I took time to visualized my response to each situation. Not only should we physically practice but mentally practice our responses. Thanks for to those whom have commented and gave me the mental points.

[Infidel]

This reminds me why I: 1. Don't ride 2 up and 2. Don't ride a cruiser I can't imagine riding a Harley with only a rear brake . . . but I see people doing it. I guess they think it's cool.

It's easy to forget, but in my MSF class (I should take it again) they told us to ride with the outlook that "you are invisible and everyone is trying to kill you. Take nothing for granted - road conditions, off ramps, green lights, animals, that driver waiting to turn sees you, etc etc."

I know I am going to catch a lot of flak around here, but I have never been a sheep so... who cares. Where in the original post did it say anything about a Harley? Yeah I ride a Harley. So I guess based on your rediculous assumptions I must never ride with a Helmet on or use my front brakes either. Rider education my friend, is not just limited to what you learn in a MSF class. I don't care how long you have been riding, you seem to have a lot to learn. Reminds me of the retards on the Harley forums who bash Sportbike riders. You all are ALL equally FUBAR, you just ride different bikes. Food for thought.

[Guest]

This reminds me why I: 1. Don't ride 2 up and 2. Don't ride a cruiser I can't imagine riding a Harley with only a rear brake . . . but I see people doing it. I guess they think it's cool.

It's easy to forget, but in my MSF class (I should take it again) they told us to ride with the outlook that "you are invisible and everyone is trying to kill you. Take nothing for granted - road conditions, off ramps, green lights, animals, that driver waiting to turn sees you, etc etc."

I know I am going to catch a lot of flak around here, but I have never been a sheep so... who cares. Where in the original post did it say anything about a Harley? Yeah I ride a Harley. So I guess based on your rediculous assumptions I must never ride with a Helmet on or use my front brakes either. Rider education my friend, is not just limited to what you learn in a MSF class. I don't care how long you have been riding, you seem to have a lot to learn. Reminds me of the retards on the Harley forums who bash Sportbike riders. You all are ALL equally FUBAR, you just ride different bikes. Food for thought.

So what type of helmet and gear do you wear on your Harley?

[whiteboyslo]

My next door neighbor who witnessed the accident wishes I'd sell my motorcycle.

That attitude bugs me severely. Should I sell my car because there was a car crash nearby? No. But as soon as somebody gets killed on a bike, everyone is all over your ass telling you to give it up. WTF?

Totally agree. I have lots of co-workers who always read me the riot act once they learn I ride, especially once they know I'm one of 'those guys' out on the backroads every weekend. It gets old, and each time it happens I'm that much less cordial with my response. I used to always try to rememebr that these are just people who believe they have my best interests at heart, but after a while it almost becomes insulting.

Mike

[Infidel]

This reminds me why I: 1. Don't ride 2 up and 2. Don't ride a cruiser I can't imagine riding a Harley with only a rear brake . . . but I see people doing it. I guess they think it's cool.

It's easy to forget, but in my MSF class (I should take it again) they told us to ride with the outlook that "you are invisible and everyone is trying to kill you. Take nothing for granted - road conditions, off ramps, green lights, animals, that driver waiting to turn sees you, etc etc."

I know I am going to catch a lot of flak around here, but I have never been a sheep so... who cares. Where in the original post did it say anything about a Harley? Yeah I ride a Harley. So I guess based on your rediculous assumptions I must never ride with a Helmet on or use my front brakes either. Rider education my friend, is not just limited to what you learn in a MSF class. I don't care how long you have been riding, you seem to have a lot to learn. Reminds me of the retards on the Harley forums who bash Sportbike riders. You all are ALL equally FUBAR, you just ride different bikes. Food for thought.

So what type of helmet and gear do you wear on your Harley?

I have different sets of gear. Mind you I am in Iraq right now so pulling up the exact model of gear will be rather difficult. For starters, I have two sets of footgear. I have a pair of Sidi boots/shoes that I ride on my Honda. I have two sets (Brown pair and black pair) of genereic leather riding boots for my Harley. I wear Kevlar reinforced jeans with the underarmor kevlar mesh for pants, and i use them cushion type shorts that i got from motorcyce superstore. i dont have any different pants for my Honda. I have two types of jackets. One is a mesh type jacket and the other is a thicker winter jacket. both have armor and both are from tourmaster. I can upload some pics of the jackets i took before i left. I have a pair of tourmaster leather gloves for summer and a pair for winter. none are the fancy racing type. they offer up just basic protection. my helmet is silver type combo deal, like the one the dude wore on Biker Boyz. It flips up from a full face to an open face. SO i can convert it to a full face on my honda, and convert it to a 3/4 helmet when on the harley. it also as one of them kind of cool flip down tinted visors so I can wear my prescription glasses while driving and not have to worry about sunglasses until i get off the bike.

actually scratch that, i had to edit cause i looked at the pics. my mesh jacket is a fieldshear, got it on sale. the thick one is a tourmaster. my winter gloves are the dual thick ass harley gloves. warmest gloves i have ever worn.

[Rice]

On swerving.

Most of the time, I am well aware of my surroundings and can change lanes with ease and w/o introducing additional unknowns into my safety equation.

However, sometimes $hit catches me off guard and I realize that I need to make an extra motion or two with my head to catch up with what's been happening around over the last few seconds. In these situations I try to avoid emergency swerving at all costs. If I am heading for trouble, I know what kind of trouble is ahead and can take steps to avoid or minimize damage. If I swerve, I am then faced with a whole new set of variables, for which I am not prepared.

[mrmatt]

I might add to remember to keep yourself in a position where you can be seen, and know whose blind spot you're in. I was riding up to an intersection on a 4 lane highway that had the left turn lane filled with cars. I was in the left lane and my light was green but it occurred to me that no one turning left (coming from the other direction) could see me because of the line of cars. I thought of it just before I entered the intersection and sure enough there was a small car right in front of me, fortunately I was able to brake and swerve left around the back of their car. Ride like you're invisible but also give everyone the chance to see you

[Brown81]

Here in the Bay Area CA we have our share of accidents. They seem to be split equally among the riding community.

Seen many Harley/Cruiser crashes. But, personally, I have seen more sportbike crashes then cruisers, likely because the roads I often ride and the company I keep.

It's ignorant to assume the type of bike is the cause of a crash or to point a finger at cruiser riders. It's also wrong to say a Harley has inferior stopping ability. A Harley Bagger will stop as fast as your VFR, and a Sportster will likely stop faster. Don't take my word for it: Ask Lee Parks. He tested motos and braking for a living. It's improper braking technique that can be a problem.

Unfortunately, sport riding comes with a "culture of speed", in which the newb riders are looking up to the guys who are posting their knee dragging street riding photos/videos online (no offense meant to those that do post vis). They do the natural thing: they emulate. Then, they crash. Seen it too many times to count.

I am no angel. Broke every driving law there is. Likely will break several next time I ride. Just pointing out that crashing is not related in any way to the type of bike you ride.

I was not at the crash posted above, but the description does make it sound avoidable. Imo, riders often follow way too close and have far to much faith (unfounded) in the stopping ability of their motos and themselves.

[tharkun]

Had a rider rear end an SUV here sometime in past couple of days & died. He was apparently following too close when driver ahead stopped to avoid a car with no lights dead in the road.

Maybe we get complacent thinking we can stop faster...because we (experienced riders) usually can...? But, to quote a phrase from one of my favorite movies: "....reaction time is a factor...."

Tragedies indeed.

[Guest]

Interesting and very important subject for sure. I've recently had two Harley's along with my VFR. Sold the last Harley and am looking to replace it but not sure with what. I know I love my VFR and am looking for a new one but will also probably buy another Harley cruiser too.

However I have to say that I feel much safer on my big old Street Glide than I do on my VFR. To me the first is the sitting position on my Harley that allows me much better visibility than when i'm crouched down on my VFR. I also think people see me better on the bigger and louder bike. The second reason, and probably more important is that when I'm riding my Harley I'm always very patient and stay in my lane, wait in traffic, drive the speed limits or along with traffic. For me there was no pleasure in riding my Harley at 80 or 90mph. When I get on my VFR I find myself much more impatient and passing more cars, cornering faster etc., and I love every second of it!

I had this discussion last week with a close friend that rides a sport bike and always makes fun of my Harley's. He didn't agree with the visibility difference but did agree that most cruiser riders do ride much less aggressively than do most sport bike riders. I know I do. And I'll always have one of each as both types of bikes are fun to ride.

Just my two cents.