stinkyfinger Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I, for one, have crossed over...as you may have surmised. I have 11 bikes in my garage,10 with clutches. I log thousands of miles a year riding clutch bikes. I've put 13K miles on the DCT since April. It took 2500 miles on a variety of roads and conditions before I felt qualified to weigh in as an advocate - you simply cannot do this in 1, 10, or 100 miles of DCT seat time. If I am at all representative of the demographic, then I think DCT, or whatever variant offered, will take hold in the market. Having experience with the DCT now, I would opt for a clutch-less option on any street bike I buy in the future. In my experience it detracts nothing notable and adds tangible benefits. I really, really wish my 996 had clutch-less shifting, what an improvement it would be on that bike.The horse has been beaten into leather and bonemeal now. Well said. This sums it all for most people who have actually have ridden the bike for a few thousand miles and yes, this horse is well beaten. One last meme for all the haters.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Duc2V4 Posted January 18, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted January 18, 2015 Buy a scooter. scooters are the Antichrist of bikes, just like the Prius is to cars. I hate the Prius, and the majority of people who drive them seem to operate under some delusional self-entitlement. The Prius creates so much pollution to build and the batteries don't last which then become an entirely separate issue of antithesis. The engine isn't designed to operate in the way most of the owners drive and they end up getting worse mpg than normal cars. Eco friendly tires are total sh*t too which causes under steer in addition to the already hopeless driving prowess of the self-righteous hippie behind the wheel.You forgot to add that none of the Prius (tentious) drivers know how to park either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamworth Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I hate the Prius, and the majority of people who drive them seem to operate under some delusional self-entitlement. The Prius creates so much pollution to build and the batteries don't last which then become an entirely separate issue of antithesis. The engine isn't designed to operate in the way most of the owners drive and they end up getting worse mpg than normal cars. Eco friendly tires are total sh*t too which causes under steer in addition to the already hopeless driving prowess of the self-righteous hippie behind the wheel.You forgot to add that none of the Prius (tentious) drivers know how to park either! It's just a car, the people who drive them simply bought a car they thought might save them money on fuel. The building process for them doesn't create any more pollution that other vehicles. There is no Prius conspiracy perpetrated by "self-righteous hippies", they're just normal people . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Cogswell Posted January 18, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted January 18, 2015 I hate the Prius, and the majority of people who drive them seem to operate under some delusional self-entitlement. The Prius creates so much pollution to build and the batteries don't last which then become an entirely separate issue of antithesis. The engine isn't designed to operate in the way most of the owners drive and they end up getting worse mpg than normal cars. Eco friendly tires are total sh*t too which causes under steer in addition to the already hopeless driving prowess of the self-righteous hippie behind the wheel.You forgot to add that none of the Prius (tentious) drivers know how to park either! It's just a car, the people who drive them simply bought a car they thought might save them money on fuel. The building process for them doesn't create any more pollution that other vehicles. There is no Prius conspiracy perpetrated by "self-righteous hippies", they're just normal people . Even Toyota admits production of the Prius emits more CO2 than the production of other vehicles. http://science.howstuffworks.com/science-vs-myth/everyday-myths/does-hybrid-car-production-waste-offset-hybrid-benefits1.htm There's also lots of other reading about alternative cars compared to conventionally powered vehicles. http://healthland.time.com/2012/02/14/why-electric-cars-are-more-polluting-than-gas-guzzlers-at-least-in-china/ http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/alternative-fuel/electric/electric-cars-pollute-more-than-gasoline-cars-17535339 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogueWave Posted January 19, 2015 Author Share Posted January 19, 2015 I hate the Prius, and the majority of people who drive them seem to operate under some delusional self-entitlement. The Prius creates so much pollution to build and the batteries don't last which then become an entirely separate issue of antithesis. The engine isn't designed to operate in the way most of the owners drive and they end up getting worse mpg than normal cars. Eco friendly tires are total sh*t too which causes under steer in addition to the already hopeless driving prowess of the self-righteous hippie behind the wheel.You forgot to add that none of the Prius (tentious) drivers know how to park either! It's just a car, the people who drive them simply bought a car they thought might save them money on fuel. The building process for them doesn't create any more pollution that other vehicles. There is no Prius conspiracy perpetrated by "self-righteous hippies", they're just normal people . Well, actually there is a sociological phenomenon surrounding the Prius. It's the ultimate eco-poser-snob-yuppie-mobile. This commercial really illustrates how cult-like the Pruis is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer luvtoleanit Posted January 19, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted January 19, 2015 Buy a scooter. scooters are the Antichrist of bikes, just like the Prius is to cars. That's funny. I own a 125cc scooter and I enjoy riding it. One time I pulled up to the gym and a guy was getting off his R1. Same gen as mine but typical stupid mods. Plate shoved up under the rear cowling, crap flushmounts, and horrible quality cans (cheap). He said "ever thought of getting a real bike?" I said, how do you know I don't own any? He said "yeah right." So I rode 1 mile to the house, grabbed my R1 and went back. Parked right next to him. When I went back in the gym I said hey man, one of my bikes is parked next to you. he went down there, was out there for must have been ten minutes, came back in and said "HOLY F**K why don't you ride that instead?" I had to explain I live a mile from the gym and it's not even worth firing up one of the bikes for. Just another stupid squid. Scooters are awesome for short local. I'd rather beat up the 125cc single on a $1750 scooter than a $10-15k motorcycle. Short trips are hell on motors. As far as the Prii, shame about the rap that car gets. It is very fuel efficient, and not everyone who drives them is a douche. I currently drive an all electric car and get some of the same comments when it's parked. While driving I'm usually passing everyone (on highway, not in the city) and in the fast lane doing 80mph. On occasion I'll go around some doucher on his phone, and have had all sorts try to race because they can't handle a little Electric car passing their overpriced truck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satariel Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 I have an electric scooter! And a 50cc moped too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marsman99 Posted January 20, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted January 20, 2015 Buy a scooter. scooters are the Antichrist of bikes, just like the Prius is to cars. As far as the Prii, shame about the rap that car gets. It is very fuel efficient, and not everyone who drives them is a douche. Agree completely. To bag on the Prius is pettifogging. In general, motor vehicles are the worst environmental scourge ever unleashed by mankind (besides overpopulation). The production, operation and disposal of them is horribly impactful to the environment. To single out the Prius seems trifling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer luvtoleanit Posted January 20, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted January 20, 2015 Buy a scooter. scooters are the Antichrist of bikes, just like the Prius is to cars. As far as the Prii, shame about the rap that car gets. It is very fuel efficient, and not everyone who drives them is a douche.Agree completely. To bag on the Prius is pettifogging. In general, motor vehicles are the worst environmental scourge ever unleashed by mankind (besides overpopulation). The production, operation and disposal of them is horribly impactful to the environment. To single out the Prius seems trifling.It is. Somehow it's a threat to many an ego. Sure isn't the car's fault. I mean I don't want to buy one but I do rent it or a Civic Hybrid when visiting Cali because the gas is much higher than I'm used to. It's just a car and I see douche driving in every vehicle sold. Large SUV's driven by Trophy wives while using their smart phones are a much bigger problem and threat to motorcyclists. The Prii mostly go slow so they are easier to pass, see around, etc.I'm putting up solar panels in April, whole backside of the roof. I also lease an electric vehicle. Neither are for "green" crap. It's saving me money. Just cheaper to run. The cash savings goes towards tires for the bikes, gasoline for the bikes, and ammunition. I enjoy busting stereotypes. It's a hoot to pull up to the outdoor gun range in the e car then pull out the 338LM with a brake haha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Skids Posted January 20, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted January 20, 2015 Large SUV's driven by Trophy wives while using their smart phones are a much bigger problem and threat to motorcyclists. We have those over here too. . The cash savings goes towards tires for the bikes, gasoline for the bikes, and ammunition. You know what, even though I absolutely understand you, to an Englishman that's still a scary statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogueWave Posted January 21, 2015 Author Share Posted January 21, 2015 Buy a scooter. scooters are the Antichrist of bikes, just like the Prius is to cars. That's funny. I own a 125cc scooter and I enjoy riding it. One time I pulled up to the gym and a guy was getting off his R1. Same gen as mine but typical stupid mods. Plate shoved up under the rear cowling, crap flushmounts, and horrible quality cans (cheap). He said "ever thought of getting a real bike?" I said, how do you know I don't own any? He said "yeah right." So I rode 1 mile to the house, grabbed my R1 and went back. Parked right next to him. When I went back in the gym I said hey man, one of my bikes is parked next to you. he went down there, was out there for must have been ten minutes, came back in and said "HOLY F**K why don't you ride that instead?" I had to explain I live a mile from the gym and it's not even worth firing up one of the bikes for. Just another stupid squid. Scooters are awesome for short local. I'd rather beat up the 125cc single on a $1750 scooter than a $10-15k motorcycle. Short trips are hell on motors. As far as the Prii, shame about the rap that car gets. It is very fuel efficient, and not everyone who drives them is a douche. I currently drive an all electric car and get some of the same comments when it's parked. While driving I'm usually passing everyone (on highway, not in the city) and in the fast lane doing 80mph. On occasion I'll go around some doucher on his phone, and have had all sorts try to race because they can't handle a little Electric car passing their overpriced truck. Oh, I'm not being all that serious. Your scooter is fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Rush2112 Posted January 21, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted January 21, 2015 I hate the Prius, and the majority of people who drive them seem to operate under some delusional self-entitlement. The Prius creates so much pollution to build and the batteries don't last which then become an entirely separate issue of antithesis. The engine isn't designed to operate in the way most of the owners drive and they end up getting worse mpg than normal cars. Eco friendly tires are total sh*t too which causes under steer in addition to the already hopeless driving prowess of the self-righteous hippie behind the wheel.You forgot to add that none of the Prius (tentious) drivers know how to park either! It's just a car, the people who drive them simply bought a car they thought might save them money on fuel. The building process for them doesn't create any more pollution that other vehicles. There is no Prius conspiracy perpetrated by "self-righteous hippies", they're just normal people . A Prius's top speed is 104 mph... Do they come with DCT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer luvtoleanit Posted January 21, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted January 21, 2015 Large SUV's driven by Trophy wives while using their smart phones are a much bigger problem and threat to motorcyclists. We have those over here too. . The cash savings goes towards tires for the bikes, gasoline for the bikes, and ammunition. You know what, even though I absolutely understand you, to an Englishman that's still a scary statement. What can I say, I live in TX. Shooting guns is required, it's the state law Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogueWave Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share Posted February 12, 2015 This is interesting. I am not sure if it is like DCT. Go to the R 1200 RT http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/index.html "Shift Assistant Pro allows the rider to shift up and down without using the clutch or throttle" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandyRedRC46 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Probably just a standard transmission with a quick shifter and auto blipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marsman99 Posted February 12, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted February 12, 2015 Probably just a standard transmission with a quick shifter and auto blipper Yep, that's all it is...and a software upgrade to orchestrate the workings. Still need clutch to start and stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandyRedRC46 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Me personally, I think that's all you need. And if you don't want to you the clutch at all, then get a http://www.rekluse.com/ clutch. This whole dct thing is pretty unnecessary these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marsman99 Posted February 12, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted February 12, 2015 Me personally, I think that's all you need. And if you don't want to you the clutch at all, then get a http://www.rekluse.com/ clutch. This whole dct thing is pretty unnecessary these days. A bit Rube Goldberg, but would do the trick I suppose, albeit more $ and no warranty. However, the whole idea of BMW offering such a "system" might speak to the very question posed on this thread. Is this their way of hedging their bet, while using the sales of this option to gauge whether they should go further...maybe with their own integrated system? Or are they with you and thinking this covers the need? Don't know, just throwing it out there, but I'm sure BMW gave it some thought before offering it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandyRedRC46 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 If BMW will sink money into the transmission, I am sure that they will go with seamless shift technology, not DCT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satariel Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 if bwm will sink money into the transmission, i am sure that they will go with seamless shift technology, not dct. Do you mean CVT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandyRedRC46 Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 No this thread is about dual clutch transmissions and their competitors. Not scooters and Prius'.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Polarbear Posted February 12, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted February 12, 2015 Interesting question for a thread. I do not have anything intelligent to contribute to the question directly, but in true VFRD fashion, I will add my two cents and state my opinion. I have never tried a DCT bike, but would love to so I can form my own opinion. But the very little wisdom I have acquired with old age has made me embrace new technologies in vehicles. They usually make our lives easier and make us more productive by allowing us to focus our energy on something else. Would anyone like to forgo their electric starters and go back to kickstarters??? Just saying. Carry on now. C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marsman99 Posted February 13, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted February 13, 2015 If BMW will sink money into the transmission, I am sure that they will go with seamless shift technology, not DCT. Agree that seamless shift systems like Zeroshift or Xtrac might be better fits for motorcycles in terms of size/weight compared to DCT, though they too will need hydraulics and a CPU to make them auto-shift. I get the feeling all the manufacturers have some version on the table. They're likely navigating licensing and IP issues, and gathering market feedback before they commit to it, which is why the BMW shifter option is interesting...seems like a stop gap solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satariel Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 If BMW will sink money into the transmission, I am sure that they will go with seamless shift technology, not DCT. Agree that seamless shift systems like Zeroshift or Xtrac might be better fits for motorcycles in terms of size/weight compared to DCT, though they too will need hydraulics and a CPU to make them auto-shift. I get the feeling all the manufacturers have some version on the table. They're likely navigating licensing and IP issues, and gathering market feedback before they commit to it, which is why the BMW shifter option is interesting...seems like a stop gap solution. Honda DCT has a lot of hydraulics too. And an extra connector to ecu. You don't need any hydraulic for a sequential transmission - like few hyper sport cars did with some electric actuators. I believe this is the way to go - I would like to see honda transmission without dual clutch - just standard shift with some fancy electronic. No this thread is about dual clutch transmissions and their competitors. Not scooters and Prius'.... LOL bmw already did the cvt, Aprilia also wither their SportGear® sequential transmission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CandyRedRC46 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Well the thing is, Honda and Ducati are already using their own seamless shift transmissions (probably bought from zeroshift etc...) in moto GP, which I'm sure are rated for a considerable amount of power. CVT transmissions generally don't have high power ratings and aren't used in any forms of power sports besides scooter racing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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