(Mercedes?) electric waterpump, art.nr. ?

[Guest vfroem]

Maybe someone :idea3: on the forum can help me :wheel: ??

To get the last few ponies I will try an electric waterpump.

I got the idea from Durbahn, he has a picture of the pump on his website (www.durbahn.de)

I already contacted Durbahn but he bought his pump about 11 years ago... (still working!) He did not know excatly what pump it is (Bosch AAP 800 ?).

The pump needs to be small, light, 12 Volt and has to do about 800 Liter per Hour.

Mercedes Benz seems to use the pump I need.

Anyone who knows the art. nr. of the pump I need ?

See pic:

border='0' alt='user posted image' />

el.waterpomp.01.jpg

border='0' alt='user posted image' />

el.waterpomp.02.jpg

[Darth Bling]

-no radiator fan needed; more room for my rads

I agree with all your points, except for this one.

Why no radiator fan?

The only reason I can think of is because at low RPMs (like when sitting at a red light), your coolant is normally not flowing very fast (due to low engine speed), so the radiator fan is necessary to boost cooling. But, with an electric pump, you're coolant is always flowing at a high rate, so you have increased cooling capacity when sitting around at an idle.

Of course, the question that comes to my mind is: if you're sitting around at idle, then there isn't any air flow, so may still need a radiator fan?

[redmarque]

Guys so what's the deal with decommisioning the existing water pump? remove pump and housing completely?

[flyguyeddy]

you have to block off the hole that it sits in in the case.

[vfrcapn]

-no radiator fan needed; more room for my rads

I agree with all your points, except for this one.

Why no radiator fan?

The only reason I can think of is because at low RPMs (like when sitting at a red light), your coolant is normally not flowing very fast (due to low engine speed), so the radiator fan is necessary to boost cooling. But, with an electric pump, you're coolant is always flowing at a high rate, so you have increased cooling capacity when sitting around at an idle.

Of course, the question that comes to my mind is: if you're sitting around at idle, then there isn't any air flow, so may still need a radiator fan?

Was this the consensus, that keeping the water flow high enough, even when not moving, removes the need for a radiator fan?

[Rice]

-no radiator fan needed; more room for my rads

I agree with all your points, except for this one.

Why no radiator fan?

The only reason I can think of is because at low RPMs (like when sitting at a red light), your coolant is normally not flowing very fast (due to low engine speed), so the radiator fan is necessary to boost cooling. But, with an electric pump, you're coolant is always flowing at a high rate, so you have increased cooling capacity when sitting around at an idle.

Of course, the question that comes to my mind is: if you're sitting around at idle, then there isn't any air flow, so may still need a radiator fan?

Was this the consensus, that keeping the water flow high enough, even when not moving, removes the need for a radiator fan?

I would guess that the fan would still be required.

If you pump more coolant through a hot radiator, you won't achieve any cooling.

To someone's point about car A/C compressors running constantly and being inefficient at higher RPMs, It isn't entirely true. They are pressure regulated. Hence A/C compressor clutch which locks and unlocks as needed.

[magicman]

I'm wondering why you would want steady state flow?

Maybe it's just that I'm in Canada, but when my thermostat stuck open (all flow, all the time). It was almost impossible to keep the bike over the 63C required for VTECH. If I did get it there, it was by lots of low speed, low gear running. Hitting the highway, it would drop back into the 50C's.

I'd think you'd want a programable Tstat replacement, that way you can limit the flow while getting the bike to proper opporating temps.

[Flip998]

Just wondering what type of current draw do the electric water pumps have? If you are stuck in traffic will the draw overtax the charging system? Will the freed-up HP be negated by the alternator having to work harder to drive the electric pump? Just wondering...sounds like a good idea, especially for a person that has their mechanical pump starting to go out.

[Rice]

I'm wondering why you would want steady state flow?

Maybe it's just that I'm in Canada, but when my thermostat stuck open (all flow, all the time). It was almost impossible to keep the bike over the 63C required for VTECH. If I did get it there, it was by lots of low speed, low gear running. Hitting the highway, it would drop back into the 50C's.

I'd think you'd want a programable Tstat replacement, that way you can limit the flow while getting the bike to proper opporating temps.

This has nothing to do with thermostat. It is still there doing its job. The difference is what pumps the coolant - Engine or battery.

[magicman]

I'm wondering why you would want steady state flow?

Maybe it's just that I'm in Canada, but when my thermostat stuck open (all flow, all the time). It was almost impossible to keep the bike over the 63C required for VTECH. If I did get it there, it was by lots of low speed, low gear running. Hitting the highway, it would drop back into the 50C's.

I'd think you'd want a programable Tstat replacement, that way you can limit the flow while getting the bike to proper opporating temps.

This has nothing to do with thermostat. It is still there doing its job. The difference is what pumps the coolant - Engine or battery.

I was refering to the kit with the tstat replacement/eliminator...

[JES_VFR]

The stock waterpump can't use more than ONE horsepower!!

I bet it does, have you ever tried to turn on of those pumps by hand, there is plenty of friction from all the seals in those pumps to eat up horsepower.

My reasons for an electrical waterpump:

-less rotating mass.

-no radiator fan needed; more room for my rads

-less weight; removing mechanical waterpump, no fan

-better cooling; waterflow at higer speed

-waterflow always the same speed (also good flow at low rpm)

-quicker revving engine / gas respons

-probably small performance gain

Well my reasons for attempting to fit an electric water pump come from the availability of the pumps, Honda

is discontinuing all these types of pumps as fast as they can.

The newer designs don't fit, so that led me the electric pumps.

I agree with most of what you posted but I think you will still have to keep the radiator fan if this is going into a street bike.

More flow into the radiator won't help with cooling when the bike is stopped if there is no air flow to remove the heat... So

You will still need a radiator fan.

I have found a bosch pump that moves 15l/m at 12V 1.3 amps and .1bar., That's 900l/h It is smaller than that mercedes pump, its a brushless motor, and its a magnetic drive so there is no shaft seal to fail.

And now the best part, I get them for $65 plus shipping. The pig tail connector is included and a rubber ring mount is only a couple of bucks more.

I'm working on a next generation PWM motor controller for this pump that will make the Davies Craig unit look like a stuttering relay..

I just got the first order of pumps, and I've got the controller parts coming, but in the mean time, I'm going to test on first with just running the pump continuously.

The goal is to produce VFR kits (with the case plug, a molded hose for the inlet, a bracket to mount where the old pump was, clamps and the controller) for under $150..

Anyone that is interested email me off list for updates...

[mello dude]

Devils advocate view for grins, R/R dies, stator progressively fries, pump stops, bike overheats, battery craps too.

Debug that one. -Dunno... not gonna touch that one with the viffers traditionally marginal electrics.

[Veefer800Canuck]

Devils advocate view for grins, R/R dies, stator progressively fries, pump stops, bike overheats, battery craps too.

Debug that one. -Dunno... not gonna touch that one with the viffers traditionally marginal electrics.

Funny, I was thinking the same thing.

But realistically, if there isn't enough power left to run the water pump, then there isn't enough for the Fi system, ignition, ECU either.

So it ain't running anyway.......

Also, the pump he spec'd at 12v, 1.3 amps works out to 15.6 watts. Not very much.

[sereethai]

here is the pump on my mercedes w126,works great 26 years old with no failure

[The Phantom]

^ Like

[belovian]

Very interesting idea guys, gonna follow this one!