Magsz Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 Heya guys! Short background. I had a sixth generation VFR, a 2007. I loved it but sold it to a buddy so that he could get riding. Since then I've had a myriad of different bikes, most of them with some seriously good brakes. I recently picked up a GORGEOUS, low mileage 8th gen and well, the front brake is kinda...squishy and lacks feel. I really like the M50 caliper that has really good initial bite and strong feel through the entire braking range. Any suggestions on how to shore up the front brake? Pads, steel lines, different caliper? (if that's even a thing). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armod Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 I was hating the ABS and traction control but that all changed when I put some Michelin rubber on.Start with the simplest and move up.Check your tire pressure Clean your brakesCheck your suspension setupMake sure your lines are bled with good fluid.Double check that what you have is performing the best it can before you start throwing parts at it. Start with pads/tiresThen rotors/braided linesThen calipersThen master cylinder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Grum Posted December 9, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 9, 2019 Completely flush and bleed with new DOT4, then re-assess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer fink Posted December 10, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 10, 2019 Mine is exactly the same, even after replacing fluid and bleeding correctly, can pull lever back to bars. Still stops the bike tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Thumbs Posted December 10, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 10, 2019 3 hours ago, fink said: Mine is exactly the same, even after replacing fluid and bleeding correctly, can pull lever back to bars. Still stops the bike tho. Which setting is your lever on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer fink Posted December 11, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 11, 2019 16 hours ago, Thumbs said: Which setting is your lever on? Number 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magsz Posted December 11, 2019 Author Share Posted December 11, 2019 On 12/10/2019 at 11:31 AM, fink said: Mine is exactly the same, even after replacing fluid and bleeding correctly, can pull lever back to bars. Still stops the bike tho. Same brother. Basically there's a ton of slop before the brakes bite. Once they bite you essentially have what accounts to mush through the travel range. The brake is strong and will stop the bike but it doesn't have the same "feel" as some of the better braking systems out there. Obviously there's a component difference so im not knocking the viffer. Ill start with bleeding the brakes and seeing where that gets me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer fink Posted December 12, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 12, 2019 I am going to do mine again over the winter. Remove pads, back off pistons and block then refill and bleed system and see if that makes any difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Bent Posted December 15, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 15, 2019 There's another problem someplace from reading the posts. Clean new DOT 4 fluid with no air in the lines, with the brakes set on 2 (my preference, or 1 if you choose) and the brake levers won't even come close to the bars on my 8th gen. The brakes on my standard will lock the wheels immediately if that's what I wanted to do (I certainly don't). The front brake rotors are larger on the 8th gen. than other gen's. so there should be no stopping issue. FWIW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Thumbs Posted December 16, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 16, 2019 On 12/11/2019 at 1:07 PM, fink said: Number 5 Apologies for the delay ...set the lever to 1 or 2 Mines is on 1 and stops a good inch off the throttle grip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Bent Posted December 16, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 16, 2019 There is some variability going on. I recently replaced my brake (and clutch) fluid, have it on 2 and the lever stops much more than an inch from the throttle grip. Heck if I know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer fink Posted December 16, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 16, 2019 Will give it a go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepretender Posted December 16, 2019 Share Posted December 16, 2019 Properly working 8th gen brakes are fine but could use improvement as they are lacking in feel and stoping power. I think braided lines and possibly different pads may be all that is needed. They don't bother me at all except when I ride the VFR right after the S1000R as the brakes on that are very very good, great feel and 1 finger if your so inclined. If you are getting anywhere near the bar when stoping your 8th gen something is wrong, for safety's sake don't stop trouble shooting until you find the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer HighSideNZ Posted December 19, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 19, 2019 Braided lines will make a huge difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Dutchy Posted December 19, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 19, 2019 12 hours ago, HighSideNZ said: Braided lines will make a huge difference Maybe..... 😎 If you have the cash and like tge looks, why not. If $ are scarcer and you cannot live with what are great brakes, different pads would be my preference. Or hone your riding, anticipation and braking SKILLS first... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer fink Posted December 20, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted December 20, 2019 I would agree, but much prefer Mr Hondas HH pads by Nissen over ebc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rsparky Posted February 28, 2020 Share Posted February 28, 2020 I have been bleeding mine more often than other bikes because of this as well. I also can touch the bar with the lever, but it does stop me so I can't complain. I switched to EBC HH pads to help a little, but it's still not there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob2m Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 On 2/28/2020 at 5:12 AM, Rsparky said: I have been bleeding mine more often than other bikes because of this as well. I also can touch the bar with the lever, but it does stop me so I can't complain. I switched to EBC HH pads to help a little, but it's still not there. If you can pull the lever to the bar you have air in the system, Has the bike got a secondary master cylinder on the front left caliper, I'm not sure which generation they stopped fitting them, if so you need to fully understand the bleeding of the system, no amount of bleeding without the SMC rotated will clear the air out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer fink Posted March 1, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted March 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Rob2m said: If you can pull the lever to the bar you have air in the system, Has the bike got a secondary master cylinder on the front left caliper, I'm not sure which generation they stopped fitting them, if so you need to fully understand the bleeding of the system, no amount of bleeding without the SMC rotated will clear the air out. New vfr doesn’t have one. Mine did the same until Bent suggested altering the span adjuster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8200rpm Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 6 hours ago, Rob2m said: If you can pull the lever to the bar you have air in the system, Has the bike got a secondary master cylinder on the front left caliper, I'm not sure which generation they stopped fitting them, if so you need to fully understand the bleeding of the system, no amount of bleeding without the SMC rotated will clear the air out. On the Honda CBS or LBS, the secondary master cylinder is actuated by the rotating force of the front disks in relation to the forks. SMC hydraulics are NOT PLUMBED to the front lever - front master cylinder hydraulic system at all and should have no bearing on lever feel. Air in the SMC and rear hydraulics will definitely affect pedal feel but not lever feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer fink Posted March 1, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted March 1, 2020 4 hours ago, 8200rpm said: On the Honda CBS or LBS, the secondary master cylinder is actuated by the rotating force of the front disks in relation to the forks. SMC hydraulics are NOT PLUMBED to the front lever - front master cylinder hydraulic system at all and should have no bearing on lever feel. Air in the SMC and rear hydraulics will definitely affect pedal feel but not lever feel. 8th Gen bikes which is what we are talking about DO NOT have linked brakes so this is irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8200rpm Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 1 hour ago, fink said: 8th Gen bikes which is what we are talking about DO NOT have linked brakes so this is irrelevant. Lucky! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer fink Posted March 2, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted March 2, 2020 18 hours ago, 8200rpm said: Lucky! We are indeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatshoutybloke Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 I've been having this feeling too, brakes working fine but needing a lot of pull on the lever. Bled them several times without making much difference but then had an idea from my Ducati 900SS days, as the Ducati had an extra bleed nipple built into the front brake casting which really helped with bleeding the front end. So, I fitted a new banjo bolt at the reservoir which had an integral bleed nipple for the top of the line. Bled the system again top and bottom and it has certainly improved things. The banjo bolts are stainless and made by Hel Performance if anyone's interested. I think the only thing left would be stainless lines but I'm not going down that route yet. Fitted one to the clutch reservoir as well, for symmetry's sake if nothing else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer lazyeye Posted April 18, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted April 18, 2020 That's cool. I didn't know those existed, I was doing it the old fashioned way by bleeding from the banjo bolt itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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