Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted September 2, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 2, 2015 Tried to use my new Motion Pro carb synchronizer to synch the carbs on my '97 with no luck. The blue fluid broke into such small little sections and was pulled out the top of the tubes. I could find an RPM where the majority of the fluid was together, but there was still a good gap at the bottom of each tube and as soon as I made an adjustment which changed RPM, there goes the fluid again. I thought I would try using a vacuum gauge, so I connected one to #1 and the needle was bounching so fast it was just a blur. It was between 8 and 18. So I connected the gauge to #2 and it was quite different, tried to adjust it to be the same a #1 with no luck. (Yes I capped-off the other cylinders.) So I guess I will have to take the carbs off and bench synch them again as they are all messed-up now. So...am I doing something wrong here or is there an engine problem here? I did not check valve clearance when I had the carbs off earlier this year....do I need to start there? I did take a look at the intake valves before putting the carbs back on and they all had about the same amount of "junk" on them, which prompted me to add Chevron fuel injector cleaner to the tank...but have only put 100 miles on it since doing so. Suggestions, comments.....anyone want to buy a Motion Pro carb synchronizer?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer dawson Posted September 2, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 2, 2015 Were the little brass inserts in the hoses for the Motion Pro? I think they recommend having them at one end - possibly the engine side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted September 2, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted September 2, 2015 Yes the brass inserts were in the correct position. Also forgot to mention that I did the calibration prior to attempting the carb balance and that I tried to keep the RPM at 1100 or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer YoshiHNS Posted September 2, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 2, 2015 If you are going to use a vacuum gauge on each one individually, it has to be one that is not relieving. The vacuum is pulsing, which is why the needle is bouncing. If the carbs are that far out that it quickly sucks one side up, immediately shut the bike off, adjust that carb, then start it up and see if it's a little more even, or if you adjusted it the wrong way. I've had to do that before, where it took a handful of on-off before it was to a point where I could leave it running and do the final adjustments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted September 2, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted September 2, 2015 Yep...the vacuum had better be pulsing or there is a huge problem!!!...LOL.... Yeah I knew the vacuum gauge I had was not really going to work very well as it was the relieving type.....only one I had handy. I have taken the carbs off and did the bench sync....so I will try once again with the Motion Pro tool to see if any better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer V-FORE Posted September 2, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 2, 2015 Hi Lanny, been there done that, the Motion Pro units used to work well when they used Mercury but the blue fluid doesn't work well for me. I got frustrated with mine last week (after waiting a week for more blue fluid) I purchased the Morgan Carbtune. Received yesterday, less than a week from ordering, uses s/s Rods, unit works great! I also purchased a flexible 1/4" adapter so I was able to synch without burning my hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Dutchy Posted September 2, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 2, 2015 Carbtune is the bizniz... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted September 3, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 Looking into the Cartune unit...but have another question; what about the 4 gauge sets being sold? Do the gauges have the "non relieve" feature as mentioned by YoshiHNS or is the needle going to bounce around like crazy? Curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer YoshiHNS Posted September 3, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 If you want to try anything at all, go for the DIY route. I made mine for $15 and a home depot trip. It's just as good as anything you can buy, except in the looks department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer rangemaster Posted September 3, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 I've got both-guages and the Carbtune. Dutchy's right, Carbtune every time, hands down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V4 Rosso Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 Do the gauges have the "non relieve" featureNot all. Some use hose line restrictors that you adjust to minimise needle bounce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted September 3, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 YoshiHNS: I think I have seen your DIY manometer....but now I can not find it. Can you post a link or title for me to search for it? Becoming unemployed at the end of Sept so buying a CarbTune Pro is not a good idea at this time. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogman Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 I had a motion pro and it dried out. After that I couldn't get it to work properly and gave up on it. I bought a set of 4 gauges on ebay and they are quite good, and also made a homemade manometer with 4 tubes, but it is about 5 feet tall, but it is very good to get really fine adjustments after it is roughly correct with the gauges The thing to remember is that there is one cylinder (front left # 2 the one with the throttle cables attached) that you have to make all the others the same as in terms of vacuum, and if the vacuum is too high on any one you have to open the throttle on that one to get the vacuum down to the base cylinder level. This means that you are constantly adjusting the idle speed screw to keep the engine speed correct. # 1 is left rear #3 is right rear and #4 is right front There is also a logical sequence to adopt for the adjustments because the linkages "piggy back" off each other, #1 is connected by a linkage to #2 and #3 is connected to #1 so any adjustment you make to 1 also happen to #3 From memory, #4 linkages off #2 The screws are a bastard to get to and it is almost impossible without a 90 degree screwdriver. I also used a small mirror on an extension, and also it gets very hot in there afer the engine has been running for a while. Dont forget to keep blipping the throttle after you have made an adjustment so the linkages can settle. It makes a big difference when you get it right, you can hear the idle rhythm change. Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marsman99 Posted September 3, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 I had the same problem with the MotionPro when I inadvertently blipped the throttle when setting it up. Had to order the refill kit which came with o-rings and more blue fluid. Refill was easy, but do it on a very clean surface. It will work if you follow the set up exactly and make no sudden throttle changes. Each time you use the tool you have to start by tightening all four of the calibration screws all the way down before beginning with the calibration manifold connected to carb #1. Then you loosen them all enough to get the liquid in each channel near mid gauge and even across all 4 tubes. Then you disconnect the calibration manifold, reattach each of the hoses to a carb and begin synchronizing. Here's a link: http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/articles/view/715/important_information_and_tips_on_using_the_motion_pro_syncpro_08-0411/ That said, now that I know, I wish I'd bought the Carbtune, or something less finicky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogman Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 You can easily make a home made manometer with irrigation fittings and 5mm clear plastic tube. It is basically 4 vertical plastic tubes all connected at the bottom and partially filled with fluid.attached to a piece of board Because everything except mercury has a low Sg the tubes need to be long, about 1.5-1.8m tall I used ATF in mine because it is red and easy to see, and if it was sucked into the engine its not too serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted September 3, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 I did everything mentioned above, but the main problem was that the Motion Pro fluid immedately broke-up into such small sections and was drawn out the top into the rubber hoses. I could never get a solid fluid level across the four tubes. Sure wish I had not thrown-out my old Carb Stix....had mercury in it and was always solid....never thought I would use it again. Has anyone tried using a different fluid in the Motion Pro? I am going to connect the Motion Pro once more to see if my bench synching has changed / improved what the fluid does. As far as a sequence of adjustments....I was thinking that #3 should be adjusted to #1 (base) first, then #2 followed by #4. But as dogman stated, they are all linked together and a major PITA to get to....even with a flex driver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer YoshiHNS Posted September 3, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 Adjust whichever one is the furthest off until they are somewhat close. Then an adjustment on one will affect the rest. Might have to bump two up to get one down and even and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer V-FORE Posted September 3, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 as dogman stated, they are all linked together and a major PITA to get to....even with a flex driver. Here is what I use, found on ebay attach a 1/4 socket adapter and a 7mm socket & no more burnt hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer BCmcrider Posted September 3, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 Has anyone tried using a different fluid in the Motion Pro? Mine was low on fluid due to evaporation so I looked at the motion pro site and/or documentation and seem to remember somewhere reading a caution label that mentioned the fluid contained ethylene glycol ... so I topped mine up with antifreeze and proceeded to set my starter valves without issue. Not sure if it's the recommended procedure but it seemed to work. The other issue with using this tool is that the graduations aren't marked with any units that I recall so setting the difference between starter valves becomes a bit of a guessing game based on assuming the specific gravity of the mystery fluid. Edit: Looks like folks here came to the same conclusion. http://vfrworld.com/forums/showthread.php/42778-motionpro-syncpro-tool-fluid but at the motion pro site, it says Proprietary petroleum-based mineral oil blend The antifreeze works for me and I just added it to some of the leftover blue stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted September 3, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 Well...had better results this time. The fluid was still broken-up into small sections, so I just used the highest one that was moving and made many small adjustments, reseting the idle each time, blip throttle couple of times and then let everything settle for about a minute before making any more adjustments. Was able to get all the levels within 2 lines...could not get it any closer...or rather got tired of trying to get it any closer. Who ever said that you will be able to hear the difference when getting close to being in-synched, was sure correct. I had no problems getting to #2 and #4 screws, but that #3 was a real pain....using an inspection mirror and getting the correct angle so the 7mm socket would turn the screw. Luckly no screw required not even 1/2 of a turn....all were very close from the bench synch. Oh and I used that same exact flexible tool....obtained via ebay. Called it good and put the mid fairings back on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer V-FORE Posted September 3, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 Glad to hear it worked out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer YoshiHNS Posted September 3, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted September 3, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alhazred Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 I did everything mentioned above, but the main problem was that the Motion Pro fluid immedately broke-up into such small sections and was drawn out the top into the rubber hoses. I borrowed one from a friend that was doing this to me,I eventually figured out that the fluid level was too low. I fixed it by adding some coolant (the fluid is just glycol,you can also use food coloring that is glycol based) to each tube until they were even and filled to 5/8 inch under the top where the threads for the adjusters start. You also need to take all the hoses off and cap them all off first or the fluid will get pushed up into the tubes as you thread the adjusters back in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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