Fuel Pump Not Working After Ignition Is Turned On

[Guest lofty1979]

Hi all,

I recently went about giving my VFR 800 Fi (2000 reg) a clean up and since removing the farings etc when I go to start the bike there is no longer a whirring noise from the fuel pump when the ignition is turned on, consequently the bike will not start. I am really stumped as to what it could be, I've checked for loose wiring around the bike and checked for blown fuses in the fuse box but all seem to be fine. I can't understand why it is doing this as everything was put back exactly how it was beforehand.

Anybody got any ideas?

Cheers.

[timmythecop]

if you cant get her going, before you re-dismantle, tap the fuel pump with the handle of a screwdriver a few times. It has worked for me in the past.

Also, be midnful of the little lip on the tank where the gasket goes. If that gets bent, it is a mother to get the tank to seal (ask me how I know)

good luck.

[Guest]

Hi all,

I recently went about giving my VFR 800 Fi (2000 reg) a clean up and since removing the farings etc when I go to start the bike there is no longer a whirring noise from the fuel pump when the ignition is turned on, consequently the bike will not start. I am really stumped as to what it could be, I've checked for loose wiring around the bike and checked for blown fuses in the fuse box but all seem to be fine. I can't understand why it is doing this as everything was put back exactly how it was beforehand.

Anybody got any ideas?

Cheers.

Please make sure that the large orange kill switch thats adjacent to the throttle is switched to "RUN". Ask me how I know this :goofy: It should start right up now that it isnt in kill switch mode.

Hello Dino,

Sorry I should of mentioned that I had made sure that the kill switch was in the correct position before posting here.

Unforunately no closer to finding out the problem, I'm really at a loss as to the problem, such a pain and I'd almost finished putting everything back together.

[Baileyrock]

Clean the kill switch and check the side stand switch! :goofy:

[Guest]

Hello there,

Thanks for the reponse. The engine is cranking over but not firing, so I assume from this that the kill switch and the side stand switch are okay? The fuel pump is not making a noise so it is not getting power for some reason, hence why the bike wont start.

What is most strange is that before cleaning the bike, it was all working perfectly!

[Guest]

Hello there,

Thanks for the reponse. The engine is cranking over but not firing, so I assume from this that the kill switch and the side stand switch are okay? The fuel pump is not making a noise so it is not getting power for some reason, hence why the bike wont start.

What is most strange is that before cleaning the bike, it was all working perfectly!

Okay I've just got a test meter on the little brown connector (branches off with a blue connector for the fuel sensor) that powers the fuel injector and there is no juice coming out of it when I switch the ignition on, so it seems the fuel injector is not getting any power at all! I've had a look at all the cables in the surrounding area and checked the fuses again but I can't see any problems at all.

[HispanicSlammer]

Lift the tank and check for battery voltage at the fuel pump connector, if there is no voltage there are 3 fuses in line, the main 30amp (probably not since you get everything else) then a 10amp, and a 20 amp in the fuse box. after that check the connectors for the engine stop switch, fuel cut relay, engine stop relay, and the bank angle sensor, then the last thing is to reseat the ecm connectors- clean and treat with diaelectic grease all the connectors.

[HispanicSlammer]

fuel cut relay is located on the sub frame by the seat on the right side, enngie stop relay is on the same side further forward by the rear brake fluid vessal, bank angle sensor is behind the headlights up front and in the middle of the bike. You can probably figure out which one it was by where you where cleaning!

[timmythecop]

did you ever get the thing started?

[Guest]

did you ever get the thing started?

I second that question!

I've been searching the boards for the solution to the exact same problem. In my case, I changed the battery on my '99 a few months ago, took it for a quick ride, and parked it in my garage (on a float charger) until last weekend. I know, too long w/out riding.

Now, when I try to fire it up I get exactly the same symptoms -- no whirring of the fuel pump when I turn the key, turns over great, won't start... I've confirmed that there's no voltage to the fuel pump by testing w/ a volt meter, and checked the fuses, the stop relay, and the fuel relay. I've yet to test the bank angle sensor, the ECM, the input power line to the ECU, or for an open/short circuit in the engine stop switch ground wire. Honestly, I'm dreading removing all the bodywork to get to the bank angle sensor, and I don't really know how to test the ECM, or how to look for the other two electrical issues.

Any advice would be *much* appreciated.

Thanks,

austexvfr

[Guest]

From rebuilding my bike I know that it's really easy to put the sensors that sit on the battery case back incorrectly (don't ask how I know...) and only by using the shop manual diagrams - my clymer's wasn't detailed enough - was I able to get it back together and have no issues with the fuel pump.

Just an idea...

[spud786]

Hello there,

Thanks for the reponse. The engine is cranking over but not firing, so I assume from this that the kill switch and the side stand switch are okay? The fuel pump is not making a noise so it is not getting power for some reason, hence why the bike wont start.

What is most strange is that before cleaning the bike, it was all working perfectly!

Thats a pretty sure sign of water issue, in a connection

[Guest]

From rebuilding my bike I know that it's really easy to put the sensors that sit on the battery case back incorrectly (don't ask how I know...) and only by using the shop manual diagrams - my clymer's wasn't detailed enough - was I able to get it back together and have no issues with the fuel pump.

Just an idea...

Thanks, DotW. I think you're talking about the fuel cut and engine stop relays, and I removed and tested both of them, but no luck. Next I suppose I'll unplug and reseat the ECM. If that doesn't work, I'll pull things apart and try the bank angle switch (though it seems odd that it'd just fail while sitting peacefully in my garage). If neither of those work, I'm not sure what I'll try...

Any advice on how to test (or bypass) the handlebar kill switch?

[squirrelman]

a paperclip will work....................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

....................................after you get to the connections.

[TimC]

Failure of the fuel pump to cycle is the exact problem I've been having with my '04. A couple friends and I narrowed it down to this issue last Friday night in my garage. We disconnected and reconnected a couple switches and fuses and checked for any loose wires around the bike. Since then the fuel pump has cycled every time and the bike has started right up. It's frustrating not knowing exactly what caused the problem, or if it will reappear.

If the issue reappears - and we figure out exactly what's causing it - I'll post up the solution here.

[Guest]

Failure of the fuel pump to cycle is the exact problem I've been having with my '04. A couple friends and I narrowed it down to this issue last Friday night in my garage. We disconnected and reconnected a couple switches and fuses and checked for any loose wires around the bike. Since then the fuel pump has cycled every time and the bike has started right up. It's frustrating not knowing exactly what caused the problem, or if it will reappear.

If the issue reappears - and we figure out exactly what's causing it - I'll post up the solution here.

Thanks, Tim. I'm encouraged that someone's been able to get their fuel pump to work again

Tonight I further dismantled my bike and tried:

1) unplugging the ECM, removing my Power Commander (to eliminate one more possible point of failure), cleaning and applying dialectic grease. Still, no fuel pump.

2) testing the bank angle sensor (per instructions in the shop manual). Seems to pass the voltage tests, and I can hear the relay "click" when I turn the ignition key on and off. Still, no fuel pump.

3) unplugged the side stand switch and bypassed it with a paperclip. Still, no fuel pump.

Any advice on how to get to the handlebar kill switch connections so that I can try to test and/or bypass?

Any other switches or wires or connections anyone suggests I look at?

Thanks very much.

[YoshiHNS]

mine was the fuel relay, and an unplugged ignition coil. Thats right, if you lose a certain coil, you lose fuel. At least thats how my 4th gen is wired. Look through the diagram and trace the wires as far as you can, using a meter to check for proper voltage and connectivity. I used a bit of wire to jump out the relay, but still have the relay connected so my coil will work. Its a mess. Anyways, the schematic is your best friend right now.

[TimC]

Any other switches or wires or connections anyone suggests I look at?

One of the connections we looked at (per a tip from Kanadian Ken) was the starter relay switch. I don't know about the 5th gen. VFR, but on my 6th gen. it's right behind the battery. Unplug it and check for dirt, etc. Also pull out and check the fuse (if it's like mine) under the plug itself.

[Guest]

Any other switches or wires or connections anyone suggests I look at?

One of the connections we looked at (per a tip from Kanadian Ken) was the starter relay switch. I don't know about the 5th gen. VFR, but on my 6th gen. it's right behind the battery. Unplug it and check for dirt, etc. Also pull out and check the fuse (if it's like mine) under the plug itself.

Thanks. I'd tried the starter relay (I believe the '98-2000 manual calls it the "engine stop relay") over the weekend, but tried it again just now. Upon further inspection, the 4P connector looks a bit suspect (slightly melted), but the relay seems to work appropriately. When I turn on the ignition and turn on the kill switch I can hear/feel it engage. On the 5th gen there's no fuse under the relay itself (at least I couldn't find one), instead it lives in the main fuse compartment in front of the battery. Checked all of those again tonight, too.

Also decided to try the fuel cut relay again. I took it out and bypassed it per the manual, but no luck. This relay did pass the voltage test per the manual, but it doesn't make a click when the power's turned on/off. I'm guessing that's appropriate?

Next, I took apart the kill switch control on the handlebar, sprayed the contacts with with contact cleaner and put it back together. No luck there.

Finally, I checked the connections on all of my coils. They all seem tight.

Another day, another donut...

The only other things to try (per the manual) are:

1) Open or short circuit at the input power line of the ECM

2) Faulty ignition switch

3) Faulty ECM

4) Open circuit in the engine stop switch ground wire

I think I can manage checking #2 now that I have all the bodywork off, but I'm probably going to be stumped on #1, #3 and #4...

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone.

[turtlecreek]

long post, so sorry if you did this already:

have you pulled out the fuel pump and applied 12v directly to it ot insure it is opperable?

[TimC]

My fuel pump has been acting up again. Both Friday morning and this afternoon, the first few or several times I flipped the run/stop switch to run the fuel pump failed to cycle. Didn't have time to mess with it then, but tried it at home again tonight. Same thing. Seems like after a few times of NOT working, suddenly it works and then keeps working every time.

While at home this evening and it wasn't working I took the opportunity to leave the ignition on and the run/stop switch on run, removed the seat and lifted the front of the fuel tank up. Unplugged and refastened the starter relay switch, including checking the 30 amp fuse there. No effect. Fiddled around with the wiring to the fuel pump under the tank, but it also had no effect. Again, after flipping the run/kill switch a few more times the fuel pump started to cycle and then I couldn't get it NOT to cycle after a couple times, starting the bike each time so I didn't flood the engine.

A couple friends helped me with this last time, and I may have to ask for help again. I'm not enough of a mechanic to do much more than I have already. What really bugs me is not knowing exactly what the problem is and the fact that it's completely intermittent, so it's also hard to ID what the real issue is.

[TimC]

Update: It's good to have friends. A fellow VFRD member (Flip) who lives nearby saw my posts on the issue I was having with my VFR last month. He and another buddy came over and we worked on it a bit. But like I said above, it started acting up and actually got worse last week. So Thursday night I headed over to Flip's house and we tore into it in his garage, pausing for pizza and Mountain Dew for a short time.

Long story short, we couldn't finish it that night, so we left it for that night. We think it might be a bad fuel cutoff relay, which resides in the right side of the upper cowl in 6th gen's. We progressed along the list of possible causes and after fiddling with this relay the fuel pump started working again. Just to be safe we finished checking out the remaining items on the list of possible causes that night.

Flip called me Sat. afternoon to say he researched this part some and found a few Honda owners who had bad ones that had to be replaced. Mine looked OK, but who knows. He swapped my part out with a buddy's who had bought a VFR just for the SSSA. Was working OK after we had fiddled with it Thursday night and after Flip swapped out the relay this weekend. If the swapped unit ends up working all the time I believe we will have found the culprit, and Flip will cut it open and check it out.

So I said, "Great! What time would be good for me to come over and help reassemble the front cowl, etc? Sun. afternoon? Anytime on Monday good for you?" No need - he already had it done. Plus he went ahead and changed my oil and filter since I had said I wanted to do that before we put the fairings back on. Unbelievable. Very generous of him. (Or maybe he just didn't want my VFR in pieces in his garage anymore...:fing02:)

So I go to pick up the bike Sunday morning at Flip's house - and found he'd also washed it for me. What a guy. I gave him the oil and filter I'd bought a couple weeks ago that I was going to use. And since I was sure he wouldn't take cash from me for all his help and work, I gave him a new front tire I had just bought from a friend. Should work well on Flip's very sweet 5th gen.

I've only had time to get a couple short rides in since Sun. morning, but so far so good. I don't believe any shop mechanic could have done a better or more thorough job in diagnosing the problem. I hope we have it licked this time.

A big public "THANKS" to Flip for his help and hard work on this. He actually did a lot more than me. And he knows to call me if and when I can help him with anything in the future.

(Sorry for the threadjack, lofty1979, but if it helps anyone who has the same issue...)

[TimC]

Well, my bike was fine for a few days but started acting up again. Fuel pump light would cycle and I could hear the relay click, but fuel pump itself did not cycle. Happened a few times just like before.

Yesterday, however, I started experiencing NO action from the light, the relay or the pump. After 5-10 seconds the FI light would start flashing and the relay would click with each flash. At first I thought it was indicating a code, but I'm wondering if it's just trying to cycle over and over. I say that b/c it's flashing constantly, no long flashes and no pauses.

Got it to run last night a couple times when it did this, so at least I could get home. Once it's running I have no problems and it's not cutting out. Tried it this morning and the same thing happened - no light, no click, no pump action - then the FI light started blinking and the relay started clicking, over and over with no pauses. This time I could not get the pump to cycle and ended up driving to work.

Flip and I are going to check things out again tomorrow morning, but before that I'm hoping somebody on VFRD can tell us if they've experienced the same issue/symptoms and what the cause/fix ended up being. (Thanks in advance!)

[Baileyrock]

lofty, did you ever get this resolved? :idea3:

[TimC]

Update: Flip and I tore into my bike again this morning.

We worked our way into it from a different angle and found a bad engine stop relay, which resides in the left side of the upper cowl. Flip removed and tested it. At times it was kind of working, and at other times it just went haywire. BTW, this relay is the exact same part as the fuel cutoff relay I posted about above. Either one could affect the operation of the fuel pump, but in this case it was the engine stop relay.

We ended up switching the old 1996 VFR relay on the right side back out for mine that we removed last week, then switched the 1996 one out for my engine stop relay and the fuel pump and engine fired up perfectly, every time. We believe we got it licked this time.

While the upper cowl was off I ran out to buy a new pair of headlights, as one of my low beams was starting to go. Bought a set of Sylvania Silverstars at a local auto parts store. I would have preferred PIAAs, as I've heard some people have problems with Silverstars, but this was all they had. Hopefully they'll be fine for a long time.

Big thanks again to my buddy Flip for all his help and work on my bike! :fing02: