Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
HispanicSlammer

F3 fork cartridge swap for 98 vfr

Recommended Posts

Still in a major dilema. ?Following this thread and the one where everyone is going the Hyperpro route. ?

I spoke with Traxxion and they were helpful, but fall into the fixed rate school of thought on springs.

Preliminary research for F3 forks looks they run $300-$400 for a servicable set. ?Is this about right? ?Was anybody able to find a much better deal?

:twist:  ZMZMON2,  Using f3 internals with the stock VFR lower tubes with give you Pre-load and Rebound Adjustment, not Comp. That's built into the lower leg tubes.

On cost of used F3 forks, I see them in the $100-200 range on ebay all the time and even better you can buy slightly bend forks much cheaper and still use the undamaged internals. I've bought several sets of bent F4 forks for less than $100 shipped to my door. Only problem is now I decided to just run the whole F4 forks instead( on Vtec), now I have to buy some good one's . :doh:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks 'Slammer for the explanation, it paints a much better picture now and increases my confidence in my final decision.  Baileyrock, thanks for correcting my error. :bow:

I'm in the process of tearing the bike down now.  As much as the thought of gaining some adjustment on the forks by doing the F3 swap was appealing, I decided not to for time and cost reasons.  

I'll be sending the forks to California Suspension Works for a complete Gold Valve job and springs along with a custom sprung Ohlins for the rear.  Looking forward to the wrenching experience and the "transformation" that is about to occur.

Thanks again to everyone who weighed in on the topic. :wink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
?

I'll be sending the forks to California Suspension Works for a complete Gold Valve job and springs along with a custom sprung Ohlins for the rear. ?Looking forward to the wrenching experience and the "transformation" that is about to occur.

Thanks again to everyone who weighed in on the topic. :beer:

:twist:  Sweet ! Should be an awesome transformation ! :bow:

Please post results !

:wink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And how about us poor people, who don't have RaceTech gold valves. Do we use the F3 or the VFR compression valve?

I managed to pick up a slightly bent set of F3 forks from eBay recently, and have just ordered stiffer springs from Wirth in Germany. I guess the adjustment in the rebound valve will be enough to handle the stiffer spring, but how about compression. The valves seem identical, but which will fit the weight of the bike best?

I'm guessing the VFR valve, but there seems to be some pretty smart people around here :beer:

Jan Strandgaard

Denmark, Europe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
And how about us poor people, who don't have RaceTech gold valves. Do we use the F3 or the VFR compression valve?

I managed to pick up a slightly bent set of F3 forks from eBay recently, and have just ordered stiffer springs from Wirth in Germany. I guess the adjustment in the rebound valve will be enough to handle the stiffer spring, but how about compression. The valves seem identical, but which will fit the weight of the bike best?

I'm guessing the VFR valve, but there seems to be some pretty smart people around here :goofy:

Jan Strandgaard

Denmark, Europe

Welcome Jan.

I did the F3 swap w/Race Tech valves on my 5th gen and I know that the F3's and VFR's are interchangeable. You can install the VFR's compression valves on the F3's rods, but the F3's rebound valve stack may not be just right for the VFR. Save up a little bit and get the whole system done. You already got some of the hardest parts, the fork caps/rods/pistons.

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Welcome Jan.

I did the F3 swap w/Race Tech valves on my 5th gen and I know that the F3's and VFR's are interchangeable.  You can install the VFR's compression valves on the F3's rods, but the F3's rebound valve stack may not be just right for the VFR.  Save up a little bit and get the whole system done.  You already got some of the hardest parts, the fork caps/rods/pistons.

Jim

Don't you mean that the valves mounted to the rods are the rebound valves?

Cheers

Jan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Don't you mean that the valves mounted to the rods are the rebound valves?

Cheers

Jan

That's correct. The compression will sit at the bottom of the fork with the rebound attached to the rod itself. I'd be concerned about the shims from the F3 not matching the need of the VFR.

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is there any way the pix from this topic can be resurrected? I've got a mate here interested in doing some front end mods, just not to the extent that I have smile.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My bike is apart for a winter freshening. I am installaing the Wilbers rear shock (arrived yesterday) and the racetech springs and Gold Valve kit. I was able to secure a pair of bent F3 forks for the rebound adjustability.

I need some help.

The F3 forks cam apart rather easily, specifically the aluminum cover over the bottom of the fork that prevents access to the compression valve. This part was in the fork tube after I disassembled th forks. Perhaps because of the bend and additional force needed to get the cartridge out fo the F3 tubes.

On my VFR cartridge, that part is very secure. I have watched Paul Thede's video on rebuilding forks and reread HS original post when added the gold valves before he scored the F3 forks for this post but I still can't get those parts off.

I don't want to clamp them inthe vice, any other adVICE?

Keith

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
My bike is apart for a winter freshening. I am installaing the Wilbers rear shock (arrived yesterday) and the racetech springs and Gold Valve kit. I was able to secure a pair of bent F3 forks for the rebound adjustability.

I need some help.

The F3 forks cam apart rather easily, specifically the aluminum cover over the bottom of the fork that prevents access to the compression valve. This part was in the fork tube after I disassembled th forks. Perhaps because of the bend and additional force needed to get the cartridge out fo the F3 tubes.

On my VFR cartridge, that part is very secure. I have watched Paul Thede's video on rebuilding forks and reread HS original post when added the gold valves before he scored the F3 forks for this post but I still can't get those parts off.

I don't want to clamp them inthe vice, any other adVICE?

Keith

PM sent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Keith you have to push on the bottom of the compression valve, push it inside into the cartridge in order to get at the circlip iholding it in, once thats out you can remove the compression valve, careful that circlip will want to bound out of there and take off then dissapear in the dark reaches of your work area!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Keith you have to push on the bottom of the compression valve, push it inside into the cartridge in order to get at the circlip iholding it in, once thats out you can remove the compression valve, careful that circlip will want to bound out of there and take off then dissapear in the dark reaches of your work area!

He was having a little trouble getting the shiny aluminum "oil caps" off of the VFR dampers and was concerned that there was something holding them on (press fit, hidden setscrew, magic), unlike the F3 caps that practically fell off of the dampers. He didn't want to force something unknowingly and tear it up. :joystick:

I told him that they'll come off with just a little gentle tapping....nothing in particular holding them on, except magic. wink.gif

THEN he'll get to the compression valve circlip, but he's already taken the F3 stuff apart so he's familiar with that process.

And yeah, I've taken about a million circlips off of all sorts of stuff for 30 years...but sure enough, I launched that damn compression circlip into the darkest reaches of my work area. Well...actually, I don't HAVE any dark reaches in my work area, but it managed to vanish and cause me 20 minutes of searching anyway!! :wub: :pissed:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Keith you have to push on the bottom of the compression valve, push it inside into the cartridge in order to get at the circlip iholding it in, once thats out you can remove the compression valve, careful that circlip will want to bound out of there and take off then dissapear in the dark reaches of your work area!

He was having a little trouble getting the shiny aluminum "oil caps" off of the VFR dampers and was concerned that there was something holding them on (press fit, hidden setscrew, magic), unlike the F3 caps that practically fell off of the dampers. He didn't want to force something unknowingly and tear it up. :joystick:

I told him that they'll come off with just a little gentle tapping....nothing in particular holding them on, except magic. wink.gif

THEN he'll get to the compression valve circlip, but he's already taken the F3 stuff apart so he's familiar with that process.

Well, those shiny little caps smited me since yesterday, so anyone who happens upon this thread in the future, know this.

A little bit of heat and they will fall off. I used a map gas torch for 10 sec and then they will come off in a (gloved) hand, or just give them a little push with a screwdriver or something. my first one fell off when i turned it upside down to get a grab on it after heating. :unsure: i thought they had loctite or something or were screwed on. nope!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After doing the rear Ohlins shock install, this is the next step, 'cause I'm too poor to install a upside down fork smile.gif

Do you REALLY think it will improve my ride???

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
After doing the rear Ohlins shock install, this is the next step, 'cause I'm too poor to install a upside down fork smile.gif

Do you REALLY think it will improve my ride???

The F3 parts alone will give you rebound damping adjustment only. That is a small, but good improvement.

The Gold Valves, correct spring for your weight, they offer the largest improvement, but are also the most expensive part of the equation.

The used F3 parts should be cheap in comparison if you look around.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And how about us poor people, who don't have RaceTech gold valves. Do we use the F3 or the VFR compression valve?

This is also my big question right now.

I have the F3 iterials (thanks SEB !) just no racetech valves

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And how about us poor people, who don't have RaceTech gold valves. Do we use the F3 or the VFR compression valve?

This is also my big question right now.

I have the F3 iterials (thanks SEB !) just no racetech valves

You will REUSE the F3rebound valve atttached to the Rebound adjustment rod..

I did this with a 6th gen and F4 parts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And how about us poor people, who don't have RaceTech gold valves. Do we use the F3 or the VFR compression valve?

This is also my big question right now.

I have the F3 iterials (thanks SEB !) just no racetech valves

You will REUSE the F3rebound valve atttached to the Rebound adjustment rod..

I did this with a 6th gen and F4 parts.

So.

F3 interials whit F3 rebound valve and VFR compression valve and VFR spring, and outer upper and lower tubs.

Got it right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And how about us poor people, who don't have RaceTech gold valves. Do we use the F3 or the VFR compression valve?

This is also my big question right now.

I have the F3 iterials (thanks SEB !) just no racetech valves

You will REUSE the F3rebound valve atttached to the Rebound adjustment rod..

I did this with a 6th gen and F4 parts.

So.

F3 interials whit F3 rebound valve and VFR compression valve and VFR spring, and outer upper and lower tubs.

Got it right?

Check the length on the F3 cartridge itself. THe only parts I used for my F4/6thgen conversion were the rebound rod and attached rebound valve. I tried using the F4 cartridge but it was too short and didnt let the forks extend fully..

Remember I did this with F4 parts not F3 on a 6th gen but I assume it shoudl be about the same either way..

I also had to reshim the rebound valve but that is a whole other subject..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Check the length on the F3 cartridge itself. THe only parts I used for my F4/6thgen conversion were the rebound rod and attached rebound valve. I tried using the F4 cartridge but it was too short and didnt let the forks extend fully..

Sam,

I don't see how it would be possible to Not use the F4/F4i cartridge and expect to have any rebound adjustment as the length of the rebound rod is specific to the length of the cartridge. If you used the longer VFR cartridge the adjusting rod end(needle part) would be no where near the valve orifice it's trying to regulate! :fing02:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Check the length on the F3 cartridge itself. THe only parts I used for my F4/6thgen conversion were the rebound rod and attached rebound valve. I tried using the F4 cartridge but it was too short and didnt let the forks extend fully..

Sam,

I don't see how it would be possible to Not use the F4/F4i cartridge and expect to have any rebound adjustment as the length of the rebound rod is specific to the length of the cartridge. If you used the longer VFR cartridge the adjusting rod end(needle part) would be no where near the valve orifice it's trying to regulate! unsure.gif

You dont need the f4cartridge itself as it is too short to work properly with the VFR upper and lower fork tubes, You do need to use the VFR cartridge with F4/F4I internals inside it..

.. The Adj rod, and hollow rebound rod with rebound valve on the end is all. Well you need the fork cap too.. And yes it does work..

The F4 adj rod end (needle part) is specific to the rebound rod itself(Hollow tube w/ rebound valve on 1 end and bolts to the fork cap on the other)

If you use the F4 cylinder cartridge in the VFR forks the rebound valve actually tops out on the cartridge itself instead of the built in stops inside the forks. And will also pulll the Comp valve thru the bottom of the cartridge destroying the C-Clip that holds it inside the cartridge..

not sure if Im right but I refer to the cartridge as the long -+1" tube that the rebound valve rides inside of..

..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You dont need the f4cartridge itself as it is too short to work properly with the VFR upper and lower fork tubes, You do need to use the VFR cartridge with F4/F4I internals inside it..

.. The Adj rod, and hollow rebound rod with rebound valve on the end is all. Well you need the fork cap too.. And yes it does work..

The F4 adj rod end (needle part) is specific to the rebound rod itself(Hollow tube w/ rebound valve on 1 end and bolts to the fork cap on the other)

If you use the F4 cylinder cartridge in the VFR forks the rebound valve actually tops out on the cartridge itself instead of the built in stops inside the forks. And will also pulll the Comp valve thru the bottom of the cartridge destroying the C-Clip that holds it inside the cartridge..

not sure if Im right but I refer to the cartridge as the long -+1" tube that the rebound valve rides inside of..

..

No, your right. The rebound valve is attached to the bottom of the tube(hollow) so as long as you use the F4/F4i tube in the VFR cartridge the rebound needle with be right where it needs to be in relation to the rebound valve. :comp13:

Was thinking of something else I guess. :wheel:

One of the suspension shop guys just modded the top out spring on the F4 cartridge assm in order the make the F4 cartridge work.

I guess either way will work if set-up right! :fing02:

BR

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok, I opened the F3 interials today, but found one not so good thing, other headcaps rebound adjuster is sized, aint moving. I did put some wd40 on and layd it on oil bath. Any other adwise to make it move again?its in full out posision.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FIrst I would let it soak for a while. If it still doesn't budge, heat the oil bath up a bit (au bain marie). If it still won't come loose, clean it as much as possible and ask at the local jewelry store if they are willing to soak it in in their ultrasonic cleaner.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A friend (that do a lot of werch on bikes) manage to make the reb adjuster turn again :goofy:

So I´m back on track

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy.