Wheel Balancing Beads

[Knife]

Has anyone had any experience with these wheel balancing beads from White Horse Gear? Feedback requested. Here's a blurb and a link.

Lose Those Wheel Weights Forever

We don't need no stinking lead weights! Dyna Beads are small, dense ceramic beads that are poured into your tire (or tube) through the valve stem. Lead weights are now completely unnecessary and they are an environmental hazard we can all live without. Better yet Dyna Beads are a dynamic balancing solution, automatically adjusting to the changing balancing needs of your wheels as your tires wear. Go green, go smart, and go smooth, with Dyna Beads.

http://www.whitehorsepress.com/product_info.php?products_id=5614&en=en0904

[SEBSPEED]

Some people love'em, I didn't like them.

[JHKolb]

I just had a new set of tires put on and thought about an alternative to the wheel weights but decided against it.

I do a lot of offroading (Jeeps mainly) and alot of options are out there, from using BB's to sugar packets. I would be worried that with a bike you might not get a perfect balance with beads each time you ride and that would not be good.

Sometimes the tried and true method winds up being the best option.

[V4 Rosso]

I call BS. I fail to see how these beads could help with wheel balancing. :biggrin:

[SEBSPEED]

I call BS. I fail to see how these beads could help with wheel balancing. :biggrin:

They do work, but you have to put in just the right amount - too little and you get vibes, too much and you get vibes. I tried them when I had the chrome wheels on my CBR - I thought they were a good alternative to clipping weights to the finish and risking damage to the chrome - but I put too much in the front and got a high speed up/down wobble at 80+ mph.

Also, the insertion method specified is a pain. You let the air out of the tire after seating the beads, then pull the valve core out and funnel the Dyna beads(which are not perfectly round) into the tire through the valve stem. It takes some time as they don't just roll in.

My preferred balancing method now involves stick-on weights.

[Luvmyvfr]

So are these beads always loose in the wheel?? I've been changing and balancing my own tires forever and I just can't grasp how they would always find the lightest part of the wheel....

Also what about when you hit the brakes?? Wouldn't they do the same things that spinners do on fancy rims..keep on going as you are stopping?

Then what happens if you put too much in as Seb said...do you have to take the tire of and start all over :biggrin:

As far as stick on weights go, I ve never had a problem with damage to the rim as long as your carefull...I 'm a pop it off with a screwdriver guy...then after 4-5 tire changes I'll clean off all the leftover glue at one time!

[JHKolb]

So are these beads always loose in the wheel?? I've been changing and balancing my own tires forever and I just can't grasp how they would always find the lightest part of the wheel....

Yes, that is the good and bad of using them. Depending on what type you used you can hear the beads in the tire at low speed.

Also what about when you hit the brakes?? Wouldn't they do the same things that spinners do on fancy rims..keep on going as you are stopping?

Cent. Force would keep the placed somewhat correctly as the wheel spins, then as you slow to a point that the beads overcome the CF they settle in the bottom of the tire.

Then what happens if you put too much in as Seb said...do you have to take the tire of and start all over :biggrin:

As far as stick on weights go, I ve never had a problem with damage to the rim as long as your carefull...I 'm a pop it off with a screwdriver guy...then after 4-5 tire changes I'll clean off all the leftover glue at one time!

They are a PIA to adjust after you put them in. The internal weights are great for an offroad tire, as the tire/wheel may get out of balance from mud the wheel balances itself automatically, but for street use I don't see the benefit. For a truck/car you can even use these quite successfully

http://mrtruck.net/centramatic.htm

If you could incorporate the Centramatic type bead ring actually into a motorcycle wheel as a single unit that would be cool. No more wheel balancing with tire changes.

[V-FORE]

I currently have these in my tires, I haven't had any problems whatsoever :biggrin: I bought them when I started changing tires myself & found them to be a great alternative to having to balance them. They aren't to bad to put in if you have patience :blush: That is what helped me!

I have no idea how they work, I figure its F.M. & don't ? it

[wera803]

I put them in my motor home tires since the tires wouldn't fit on my balancer. No problems with them yet. I know someone that put them in his motorcycle tires and likes them. Just seems like too much of a pain to pull them out every 3500 miles when I have to replace the rear tire. The sticky weights work just fine for me and since I have a balancer, they are a lot cheaper to use then the beads.

[Chev]

I'm a big believer in Dyna Beads. Even after a tire is visably worn out they remain in balance.

I found that by tapping the valvestem with the heavy end of a screwdriver and not dumping them in too fast the really do go in pretty easily.

For those of us paying for tire balancing...... it really come out about the same price.

It is absolutely not BS, I am a mechanical engineer and I know a out of balance tire. That said, non of my teachers at Missouri S&T could explain how it works.

[Rice]

I call BS. I fail to see how these beads could help with wheel balancing. :biggrin:

They do work, but you have to put in just the right amount - too little and you get vibes, too much and you get vibes. I tried them when I had the chrome wheels on my CBR - I thought they were a good alternative to clipping weights to the finish and risking damage to the chrome - but I put too much in the front and got a high speed up/down wobble at 80+ mph.

Also, the insertion method specified is a pain. You let the air out of the tire after seating the beads, then pull the valve core out and funnel the Dyna beads(which are not perfectly round) into the tire through the valve stem. It takes some time as they don't just roll in.

My preferred balancing method now involves stick-on weights.

What ^^^he^^^ said.

I tried them and they seemed to work, but not 100%. I was gettiing a wobble at speed and just didn't enjoy the ride.

I ended up buying MP balancer and stick-on weights. Still have a bottle of them Dyna beeds laying around in my garrage.

P.S.

I'm not a mechanical engineer, but pretty interested in this stuff. Chev - If you ever find an explanation, please share it. Actually, one could do an experiment. Take a round "something" and wrap it with a length of clear tube. Color the beads with some dye and add inside the tube. Weigh the rotating assembly unevenly and spin. That should help explain why/if indeed they congregate in the lightest part of the wheel.

[Guest]

I call BS. I fail to see how these beads could help with wheel balancing. :wheel:

If you ever find an explanation, please share it. .

http://www.innovativebalancing.com/HowItWorks.htm

[V4 Rosso]

Actually, one could do an experiment. Take a round "something" and wrap it with a length of clear tube. Color the beads with some dye and add inside the tube. Weigh the rotating assembly unevenly and spin.

Yes, and make sure to put the tire against a rolling road, as to deform the tire like it normally does, and put the whole contraption on a hydropulse that simulates the road surface while the wheel spins and watch the beads bounce around the inside of the tire.

[FJ12Ryder]

I call BS. I fail to see how these beads could help with wheel balancing. :wheel:

:goofy:

If you ever find an explanation, please share it. .

http://www.innovativebalancing.com/HowItWorks.htm

I'm not sure that isn't so much an explanation as wishful thinking.

[Chev]

I call BS. I fail to see how these beads could help with wheel balancing. :wheel:

:goofy:

If you ever find an explanation, please share it. .

http://www.innovativebalancing.com/HowItWorks.htm

I'm not sure that isn't so much an explanation as wishful thinking.

I would agree that is not much of an explination.

But, I've seen what they do on the long haul.

The best explionation at school I've gotten was that the lighter areas of the tire were thinner and the void filled by the ceramic balls evened it out....... that came from a dynamcs teacher, the afternoon he gave a lecture on dynamic balancing. I feel like the odds of the lighter parts of the being the thinnest and the ceramic balls actually having the proper density to fill the void.

I would think that the heavier part of the tire would deform outwards and suck a few beads into the void. Then that effect would snowball you off the road.

I don't know, but I also don't know how a tire balanced without the contact of the road can stay in balance when the road is in contact with it. Especially when you consider the deformations the tire make at speed and going around corners, or hitting different road surfaces.

[spotthedogg]

I put too many in and I think that is why I am getting a weird vibration at 120+ Km/h. It's a strange on/off pulse vibration. One second vibration (three distinct vwoup,vwoup,vwoup), one second smooth, one second vibration and I can see the fork lowers vibrate when I look down. I put a little more in this time than last thinking any extra would simply spread out but it would seem I was wrong. I will keep running them but at the accurate 1.5oz F/2.0oz R.

[spotthedogg]

"The best explionation at school I've gotten was that the lighter areas of the tire were thinner and the void filled by the ceramic balls evened it out....... that came from a dynamcs teacher, the afternoon he gave a lecture on dynamic balancing. I feel like the odds of the lighter parts of the being the thinnest and the ceramic balls actually having the proper density to fill the void."

That seems like a silly explanation, the way I understand it is if you think of the heavy part of the tire wanting to pull from center then the beads would find the opposite point or light spot. I may not have the best explaining skills but what I like is that dynamic balancing is constantly changing, as a tire wears etc. I know I get less scalloping with them and I use them in my All Terrain T/A's and they make a huge difference in that type of tire.

[Guest]

Dynamic balancing does work. Watch your washing machine as it starts the spin cycle. At first it will be out of balance. It will then smooth out. It works every time. Same principal, different mechanism. If your dynamics instructor can't explain this phenomenom, you should ask another dynamics instructor. If none of the dynamic instructors can explain the phenomenon, find another school. Fundamental dynamics.

Also, the tire doesn't balance until you reach resonate frequency (somewhere around 50-60 mph). After that, the tire will remain balanced until you stop or brake hard.

That said, I use stick on weights.

[vfrcapn]

Dynamic balancing does work. Watch your washing machine as it starts the spin cycle. At first it will be out of balance. It will then smooth out. It works every time. Same principal, different mechanism. If your dynamics instructor can't explain this phenomenom, you should ask another dynamics instructor. If none of the dynamic instructors can explain the phenomenon, find another school. Fundamental dynamics.

Also, the tire doesn't balance until you reach resonate frequency (somewhere around 50-60 mph). After that, the tire will remain balanced until you stop or brake hard.

That said, I use stick on weights.

Doesn't work every time. The oscillations can produce a resonance that builds on itself. That's why your washer bangs around and you have to run down and redistribute the load. I imagine having too many or little beads could produce the same result.

[Rice]

I call BS. I fail to see how these beads could help with wheel balancing. :biggrin:

They do work, but you have to put in just the right amount - too little and you get vibes, too much and you get vibes. I tried them when I had the chrome wheels on my CBR - I thought they were a good alternative to clipping weights to the finish and risking damage to the chrome - but I put too much in the front and got a high speed up/down wobble at 80+ mph.

Also, the insertion method specified is a pain. You let the air out of the tire after seating the beads, then pull the valve core out and funnel the Dyna beads(which are not perfectly round) into the tire through the valve stem. It takes some time as they don't just roll in.

My preferred balancing method now involves stick-on weights.

Same experience.

I've used them for a while as an alternative to buying a balancer, but never found the right amount to put in. If you put too little, you can always add some. If you put too much, you have to remove the wheel again. And how do you know if there's too little or too much?

It seems that this method is not accurate enough for a sport motorcycle application. It will probably work much better on cruisers and other slower, heavier vehicles.

P.S.

Physics of how they work I shall never understand.

I've read a number of discussions of the principles of their operation, but don't recall ever seeing a clear explanation.

[NorthernVFRDave]

My front load washing machine has a system like this to keep it in balance as it spins up to 1200RPM, works really well.

[Guest]

Found this demonstration:

[Guest]

I personally didn't like them. :goofy: They work but like others have stated gotta have the right amount, put too much in and you have to take the tire off to get them out. I just think it is easier to use stick on , besides you can't see them when the wheel is turning and I like to ride. :biggrin:

[V4 Rosso]

Dynamic balancing does work. Watch your washing machine as it starts the spin cycle. At first it will be out of balance. It will then smooth out.

It can smooth out because the drum does not constantly deform like a motorcycle tire (contact patch). I wonder how the beads hold up when riding over less than silky smooth roads and the