Change Out Only The Front Sprocket?

[46alpha]

I'm looking to go down one tooth (15) on my 6th gen. I know the SOP is to do both front and rear as well as the chain all at the same time to prevent premature wear. Will it really cause much harm to just switch out the front sprocket or should I wait until I need to do the chain as well. Bike only has 4k miles on it so the stock chain is like new.

TIA

[jeremy556]

No problem.

The replacing both sprockets and chain together thing is when your chain is shot, you really should change your sprockets also, because worn out sprockets will wear out a new chain.

[squirrelman]

once u replace the stock rubber-damped Honda front sprocket you'll notice more noise......

[turtlecreek]

did the same thing at almost the same miles.....went to 20k prior to the chain wearing out....replaced just the chain as both front/rear looked fine....bike exploded into flames the day after. knew i should have changed them all at the same time

[46alpha]

did the same thing at almost the same miles.....went to 20k prior to the chain wearing out....replaced just the chain as both front/rear looked fine....bike exploded into flames the day after. knew i should have changed them all at the same time

:blink:

Is there any way to remove the rubber washer from the stocker and place it on the new one? IIRC, this was a problem when I changed out the sprockets on my YZF600R. Not a huge deal but something to think about.

[Baileyrock]

:biggrin:

Is there any way to remove the rubber washer from the stocker and place it on the new one? IIRC, this was a problem when I changed out the sprockets on my YZF600R. Not a huge deal but something to think about.

No way to use/remove the rubber mount part, just slap one in the and go. You'll enjoy the quicker pick up and throttle feel (unless you only ride on the hwy)

:blink:

[BusyLittleShop]

2 things to consider...

1) Installing new parts on worn drive systems is bike abuse... do it right... all new or nothing...

2) Dropping a tooth with the same number of links of chain will position your cassette to the 5 O clock which

mean you loose important ride height... you'll need to subract 2 links of chain in order to postion the

cassette back to the 6 O clock...

Wrong... lost ride height...

Right... correct ride height...

Here's how the pros do it...

Start with the stock ratio 43/16= 2.68

Next enter the desired ratio 43/15= 2.86

Now keep the stock 16T rubber cushioned front sprocket and calculate the number of teeth to add to the

rear sprocket in order to have the desired ratio of 2.86...

16T x 2.86 ratio = 46T

Now for 3T add 2 links of chain to the stock number of links because you can only have even numbers of

links and never odd (half links don't count)...

[turtlecreek]

2 things to consider...

1) Installing new parts on worn drive systems is bike abuse... do it right... all new or nothing...

2) Dropping a tooth with the same number of links of chain will position your cassette to the 5 O clock which

mean you loose important ride height... you'll need to subract 2 links of chain in order to postion the

cassette back to the 6 O clock...

Wrong... lost ride height...

Right... correct ride height...

Here's how the pros do it...

Start with the stock ratio 43/16= 2.68

Next enter the desired ratio 43/15= 2.86

Now keep the stock 16T rubber cushioned front sprocket and calculate the number of teeth to add to the

rear sprocket in order to have the desired ratio of 2.86...

16T x 2.86 ratio = 46T

Now for 3T add 2 links of chain to the stock number of links because you can only have even numbers of

links and never odd (half links don't count)...

bLS, thats a great point...never thought of the fact that the wheel tension system would change the ride height and thus impact handling adversly....

[Guest]

This is a good example of why an aftermarket shock such as a Penske is so great. Get a reference point somewhere on the bike (I have a sticker on the left Staintune directly above the center of the axle). Make your sprocket(s) change and then adjust your shock length to get your ride height back to where it was.

[Guest]

On off-road stuff I try to always buy two front sprockets when I replace the set and change the front at the half life of the chain. Since it spins approx 3x faster then the rear they wear much faster then the rear. Changing the front only won't hurt anything and IMO it may actually increase the life of your chain.

[BusyLittleShop]

This is a good example of why an aftermarket shock such as a Penske is so great. Get a reference point somewhere on the bike (I have a sticker on the left Staintune directly above the center of the axle). Make your sprocket(s) change and then adjust your shock length to get your ride height back to where it was.

Adjusting the ride height to compensate for 5 O clock cassette will cost you 2 trade offs... 1) running the

swingarm at a greater angle than designed... 2) running the chain with greater slack than designed...

To get the optium out of your VFR the cassette must be in the neighborhood of 6 O clock...

[SEBSPEED]

Not to mention the negligible change in wheelbase... but let's face it, how many Rossis do we have here? Some of us will notice, some won't, but will it give us problems on the street? Probably not.

If we were making these changes on a sharp bike like a late model supersport(or a homologated race bike like the RC45 ), they might be much more noticeable.

Not to say that these things shouldn't be mentioned, just adding some fodder for discussion. :biggrin:

[turtlecreek]

Not to mention the negligible change in wheelbase... but let's face it, how many Rossis do we have here? Some of us will notice, some won't, but will it give us problems on the street? Probably not.

If we were making these changes on a sharp bike like a late model supersport(or a homologated race bike like the RC45 ), they might be much more noticeable.

Not to say that these things shouldn't be mentioned, just adding some fodder for discussion. :blink:

well, like i said, mine DID catch fire.... :biggrin:

[46alpha]

Oh well I guess I'll either pony up for the full monty (chain, front & rear sprockets) or just wait. Thanks for the info guys.

[spud786]

Oh well I guess I'll either pony up for the full monty (chain, front & rear sprockets) or just wait. Thanks for the info guys.

4k on an 06? nothing should be worn enough to justify a full package, unless you just want one.

I have over 50,000 mile on my o6 sprockets, on the forth chain, I never adjust the chain in between replacements , just drape a new one on(its a perfect fit they dont stretch) at the first link that sprouts reddust, usually around that 18,000 mile mark , i order a new one, no adjustment required in between.

its all in the Lube ,cutting the metal to metal with sprocket teeth on the street

[BusyLittleShop]

Not to mention the negligible change in wheelbase... but let's face it, how many Rossis do we have here? Some of us will notice, some won't, but will it give us problems on the street? Probably not.

If we were making these changes on a sharp bike like a late model supersport(or a homologated race bike like the RC45 ), they might be much more noticeable.

Not to say that these things shouldn't be mentioned, just adding some fodder for discussion. :biggrin:

Mercy SEB... You don't have to be Rossi to appreciate a properly set

up bike... making all the good changes builds rider confidence because

the bike feels sharp and responds well whereas making all the wrong

changes destroys rider confidence because the bike geometry is

confused... VFRD is about discussion and I hope more are about the

positive changes and warning against any negative changes no matter

how small ... after we all have a lot of money invested in our

prize... might as well get the most out of the whole package by

setting it up properly...

[BusyLittleShop]

Oh well I guess I'll either pony up for the full monty (chain, front & rear sprockets) or just wait. Thanks for the info guys.

4k on an 06? nothing should be worn enough to justify a full package, unless you just want one.

I have over 50,000 mile on my o6 sprockets, on the forth chain, I never adjust the chain in between replacements , just drape a new one on(its a perfect fit they dont stretch) at the first link that sprouts reddust, usually around that 18,000 mile mark , i order a new one, no adjustment required in between.

its all in the Lube ,cutting the metal to metal with sprocket teeth on the street

Follow your shop manual on sprocket wear... you'll note there is no

way in hell you can justify 50K miles... your drive line efficiency

drops dramatically running new chains on worn sprockets... your chain

is eating up precious HP and if you wait for the Red Death to appear

it's too late... chain is toast because your links went dry a long

time ago and you failed to notice it... it's all in the factory

installed lube at the critical pin and roller junction behind the X

rings which only last 8 to 10K miles...

Red Dust??? If you want to know what your chain went through... just try screwing dry next time...

[spud786]

Follow your shop manual on sprocket wear... you'll note there is no

way in hell you can justify 50K miles... your drive line efficiency

drops dramatically running new chains on worn sprockets...

These sprockets are going alot farther than 50,000 mile, I can tell ya that, and they are in great shape.

what you seem to miss, i can run a chain 18,000 miles, install a brand new one without even touching any adjustment , its a perfect fit , done it a few times. What wear?

I use to trash cs sprockets well under 20,000 mile on the street , that stopped when I discovered the secret , steel rear sprockets will go a long time with a heavy film base that prevents metal to metal and dramatically cuts cs sprocket wear.

your right the lube in most orings are probably dry by 10 or 12 thousand mile or shortly there bouts. But around 18, 000 atleast on the vfr is where I usually see one link begin to show signs.

[BusyLittleShop]

These sprockets are going alot farther than 50,000 mile, I can tell ya that, and they are in great shape.

what you seem to miss, i can run a chain 18,000 miles, install a brand new one without even touching any adjustment , its a perfect fit , done it a few times. What wear?

Great shape??? you're failing to note as chain wear increases, the pitch of the chain becomes greater than

the pitch of the sprockets. causing fewer teeth to contact the sprocket teeth. This increases sprocket wear

and decreases efficiency... at what point do you realize that your bike's get and go... got up and went

because you're trying to save a few bucks on consumable parts???

[SEBSPEED]

Not to mention the negligible change in wheelbase... but let's face it, how many Rossis do we have here? Some of us will notice, some won't, but will it give us problems on the street? Probably not.

If we were making these changes on a sharp bike like a late model supersport(or a homologated race bike like the RC45 ), they might be much more noticeable.

Not to say that these things shouldn't be mentioned, just adding some fodder for discussion. :excl:

Mercy SEB... You don't have to be Rossi to appreciate a properly set

up bike... making all the good changes builds rider confidence because

the bike feels sharp and responds well whereas making all the wrong

changes destroys rider confidence because the bike geometry is

confused... VFRD is about discussion and I hope more are about the

positive changes and warning against any negative changes no matter

how small ... after we all have a lot of money invested in our

prize... might as well get the most out of the whole package by

setting it up properly...

Very true! I just thought it was worth mentioning that there are more obvious steps to be taken in sharpening the bike, that the points you brought up were good, but more subtle than the average Joe will notice. :blink:

[spud786]

I'm saying i havent had to adjust the chains between their 18,000 mile intervals at all on the vfr, only reason I replace is from first sign of internal rusting is noticed.

The grease i run is very heavy film, it cuts the metal to metal contact which prevents sprocket teeth from wearing faster than they have too, but stretched chain wear that causes chains to ride at the top of the teeth, like your pictures show is a seperate issue with wear. As i stated above the chains arent stretching in between replacement intervals.

I do need to look alot closer at the front sprocket at the next chain replacment interval, theres probably is some very slight wear on it(its the hardest sprocket to prevent wear on). but its' nothing like you'd expect from a 50 to 60 ,000 mile sprocket to look like, looks very good. I'm very impressed and I've changed dosens of sprockets and chains over the last 30 plus years).

[46alpha]

Ok there seems to be some difference in opinion on adding new parts to a broken in drive system. I'd hate to put a whole new chain on when the OEM chain has only 4k on it. It's not a cost thing, just seems like a waste. As more stress is placed on the front sprocket, would it be more advisable to go with a +2 in the rear? Correct me if I'm wrong, that would require a longer chain anyway?

Maybe just wait till next winter and go with a new DID chain and -1 +2. Winter is always hard. Bikes right here in my basement a mere 10 feet from my computer and I feel the need to mod :blink:

[Guest]

Ok there seems to be some difference in opinion on adding new parts to a broken in drive system. I'd hate to put a whole new chain on when the OEM chain has only 4k on it. It's not a cost thing, just seems like a waste. As more stress is placed on the front sprocket, would it be more advisable to go with a +2 in the rear? Correct me if I'm wrong, that would require a longer chain anyway?

Maybe just wait till next winter and go with a new DID chain and -1 +2. Winter is always hard. Bikes right here in my basement a mere 10 feet from my computer and I feel the need to mod :excl:

Here's a viewpoint from an Average Joe: My 6th gen has this very -1 front +/- 0 rear sprocket mod you asked about in your thread starter. It does improve acceleration, of course, but it also makes your speedo progressively more inaccurate the faster you go. This means mileage, too. Though, this can be solved with a speedo calibration device like a Speedohealer.

Plus, at around 100 mph (guessing here) the VTEC is just about to kick in. So if you do any spirited back road riding :blink: that's certainly another consideration. It's turning 5000 rpm at (probably) 75 mph cruising speed affecting gas mileage, too. So, there's a trade-off. If you just ride around town it might be worth doing for the accel boost, but if you plan to ride any distance your engine will be revving higher than it should. I'm probably going to re-install the stock front sprocket during my next oil change (soon).

[Guest]

This is a good example of why an aftermarket shock such as a Penske is so great. Get a reference point somewhere on the bike (I have a sticker on the left Staintune directly above the center of the axle). Make your sprocket(s) change and then adjust your shock length to get your ride height back to where it was.

Adjusting the ride height to compensate for 5 O clock cassette will cost you 2 trade offs... 1) running the

swingarm at a greater angle than designed... 2) running the chain with greater slack than designed...

To get the optium out of your VFR the cassette must be in the neighborhood of 6 O clock...

I have to disagree with you here BLS. A lot of us raise the rear of our bikes to improve the handling. Raising the rear does change the swingarm angle. I've seen nothing but improvements from it.

The lengthening of the wheelbase will be minimal - you do that whenever you adjust your chain.

Increasing the swingarm angle isn't a bad thing. It improves the anti-squat characteristics of your bike. I'll quote from page 83 of Andrew Trevitt's "Sportbike Suspension Tuning" concerning anti-squat:

As a rule of thumb, the greater the angle between the top of the chain run and the swingarm and the closer the chain is to the swingarm, the more anti-squat you will have. To increase anit-squat for less weight transfer, you can:

1. Increase swingarm angle by adding rear ride height or increasing rear preload

2. Increase chain angle by making the front sprocket smaller or the rear sprocket bigger

3. Raise the swingarm pivot (not possible on the VFR), so that it is closer to the chain run

[BusyLittleShop]

I have to disagree with you here BLS. A lot of us raise the rear of our bikes to improve the handling. Raising the rear does change the swingarm angle. I've seen nothing but improvements from it.

I think we agree that you may raise the rear to improve handling but make sure the axle is in the correct 6 O

Clock position... and it's not good idea to adjust the ride height to compensate the axle in the 5 O clock

position...

[BusyLittleShop]

I do need to look alot closer at the front sprocket at the next chain replacment interval, theres probably is some very slight wear on it(its the hardest sprocket to prevent wear on). but its' nothing like you'd expect from a 50 to 60 ,000 mile sprocket to look like, looks very good. I'm very impressed and I've changed dosens of sprockets and chains over the last 30 plus years).

Hold a new sprocket up against the old to note the degree of wear... and post a pic of your poor sprocket if

you're so proud of it...