Why Shouldn't I?

[RoystonRocket2]

Buy a VFR1200F DCT that is? I currently ride a VFR800 Fi1, I'm keeping that and have a very strong need to buy a 1200. I've ridden the standard clutch bike, the day after it's launch here in the UK in 2010. I'll be riding one on Friday this week for a test to remind myself what it's like but I loved it the first time.

But what are the down points to ownership? Bearing in mind I'm a big VFR fan and a V4 lover who will probably ignore you and buy either a 2012 or new DCT anyway

P.S. Apologies if this is in the wrong section.

[Guest]

Everything I've read or heard about the DCT is that it works outstandingly well....the big "if" is how much of the riding experience you put down to manual shifting, etc.

I'd like to spend a couple of days riding one and see how the adjustment goes before buying one - but I have no doubts it works really well.

[crakerjac]

Downsides to a VFR1200: Premium gas requirement and poor resale value. Otherwise it's a fantastic bike.

[TimC]

I had to ride through excruciatingly bad Friday rush hour traffic in Chicago one day last month. DCT would have been a very welcome option on my 6th gen. that day. That's the only big advantage I can think of, and that kind of nasty traffic jam is only maybe a once per year occurrence for me.

To be fair, I have not ridden a 7th gen, standard or DCT. I'm sure it works well, but personally I think I'd miss having a clutch and running through the gears myself. That, and the extra money on the price tag probably rules DCT out for me.

[dalesvfr]

I test rode the DCT version of the NC700X and felt like the engine revs weren't where I wanted them in automatic mode when entering and exiting a turn. Just my experience. I prefer a CVT to the DCT. What about the CB1100? The inline four sounds amazing,

[luvtoleanit]

You inner child really wants that RSV4.

If its a comfort thing, then get the VFR. I like having a full on sportbike and a sport tourer. You've got the sport tourer sorted. If its a trade you are doing go for it but I much prefer shifting my own gears and the manual will be cheaper to fix and service post warranty.

[RoystonRocket2]

the manual will be cheaper to fix and service post warranty.

That's one of the main things I'd thought about. I do all my own servicing/maintenance but if that DCT goes wrong I'll possibly be into special tools or Honda labour costs to get it sorted!

[Yokel]

The best way I can describe the 1200...

Its like a dancing partner with full curves. She takes a while to change directions but does so with grace and finesse. She also loves to tango and polka, can stop faster than you, is a bit meaty in all the right spots, has plenty to hang on to (or off of), and squeals in a magnificent and throaty way when you get the steps right. She also dresses up well at night, is well behaved enough to bring home to mom but knows how to blow your hair back when you are in the mood. She is the low-maintenance type who just knows she is only being used and is fine with it.

All told, win/win. Buy it. :)

Downsides to a VFR1200: Premium gas requirement and poor resale value. Otherwise it's a fantastic bike.

This is also very true.

[Volfy]

My understanding is that the use of premium fuel is recommended, but not absolutely required. I believe both the manual and the little sticker on the tank say this. VFR1200 is equipped with a knock sensor, which advance the timing to just shy of impending knock to optimize power. By the same token, it will also retard timing to protect the engine if lower octane is used.

I run 87 AKI in the colder months and the VFR1200 runs just fine. In the hot and humid summer months, I do switch to premium, which is 92 or 93 AKI around here. Octane requirement is not a fixed variable. It depends on ambient temp, humidity, atm pressure, engine load, as well as operating conditions.

Not doing it to save a few cents on regular gas. More as a personal conviction on knowing exactly how my machine work per a given set of working conditions.

[luvtoleanit]

To me the cost savings just aren't there and I always end up tuning my bikes and at that point you really want to run the premium all the time. But stock, yeah, you can run lower octane. Here the difference on a fillup between both is just under a dollar.

[Guest]

I love mine and tend to use it manual mode mostly. The only time it's a bit lacking is during very low speed manouvres as I find it just takes away some of the fine control you get with a clutch. Brilliant in heavy traffic though.

[Beck]

Downsides to a VFR1200: Premium gas requirement and poor resale value. Otherwise it's a fantastic bike.

Ehhhh... most bikes have poor resale value,......unless maybe if it's a Ducati, An MV Agusta or a BMW.

Where the logic lies in that is still a mystery to me as A VFR have just as much engineering investment put in it as these other brands do.....

I suspect resale value is mostly "Perceived" value.

BTW, IIRC by law, all vehicles in the US should be able to run on regular grade gasoline. Manufacturers can only recommend premium gas but not require to operate their vehicles with such without danger of causing damage to their engines or losing warranties if they choose to use regular gas....... I know that this is the case for cars, but not sure if it also applies to bikes....

[Volfy]

the manual will be cheaper to fix and service post warranty.

That's one of the main things I'd thought about. I do all my own servicing/maintenance but if that DCT goes wrong I'll possibly be into special tools or Honda labour costs to get it sorted!

I'd like to consider myself a fairly accomplished shadetree, but if the transmission goes south on any of my bikes, I won't be digging into it. That's a bit beyond the typical home garage repair. Now, I would maybe look into how easy it is to R&R the clutch plates in the DCT, assuming that is considered part of the normal maintenance routine.

[BrianF]

DCT is heavier, not that you'll notice the difference. It also has a tiny bit less cornering clearance to the right (because of the plastic clutch protection plate, note longer footpeg feeler). I personally think it's a fun gimmick, but I wish I'd bought the standard. Then again, I wish I'd just bought another sixth gen!

I have gotten the flashing "--" in the gear indicator display twice, but zero problems otherwise. It seems to be bulletproof.

If you're a good/experienced rider, I don't think you'll really enjoy the DCT enough to make it worth the cost. Then again, the reason I ponied up for it was because I thought "if you don't get the DCT, you'll always think 'I wonder what the DCT was like...maybe I should've gotten it.'" Can't say that now.

Despite all my bashing of the 7th gen all over this board, it really is a good bike. Just not a good bike for me. Everyone else seems to like theirs.

FWIW, I only use manual mode. I used "D" once, and "S" twice. On the '10, I'd say they're useless. Not sure about the re-cal on the '12 though, never ridden one.

[Beck]

In cars they have developed automatic tranmissions that will now easily beat the performance (as in 0-60) of the manual version on the cars they are installed in......

Can it be the same with the DCT?....if not, eventually in the future??

[luvtoleanit]

In cars they have developed automatic tranmissions that will now easily beat the performance (as in 0-60) of the manual version on the cars they are installed in......

Can it be the same with the DCT?....if not, eventually in the future??

Certainly. HRC is running a seamless gearbox in GP, and they have a DCT on the VFR (DCT's aren't allowed in GP). The VFR is always the first to get new tech so it'll move out to the sport models soon enough.

[Volfy]

I can't help but think Honda put DCT on the VFR for the sole purpose of selling DCT with the lower end bikes like the 700s and 500s. That's really where this technology shines - new and or inexperienced riders.

That said, I don't believe it takes away from the fun of performance riding. I purposely picked a track for my first track day so I can pretty much stay in 2nd and 3rd gear. Still, I had all that I can handle and not having to shift gears much really help me concentrate on the other tasks at hand. If anything, it helped me enjoy the sessions and learn the fundametals faster. Plenty of level 2 and 3 riders put quick shifters on their track bunnies.

[dadofseven]

My 2012 is my 3rd VFR.....I've owned an 83, a 97, and this one, I have had other makes in between, both Yamaha 86 FJ1200, and an 05 FZ1.

The 12 VFR reminds me of both Yamaha's, big and strong like the FJ, and sporty like the FZ.....it's a bit of a porker, but on track days, 1/4 mile days, Horsepower Shootouts, 500 mile days, quick trips to the lake, commuting to work, ETC she shines all day long. My VFR is simply the best motorcycle I have ever owned.

Take a look at my other comments in other forums. I have fixed the small problems 1st and 2nd gear restrictions, fuel map, added a slip on and PCV, right now it has 157 HP at the rear, and almost 90 FT LBS of torque, not many bikes, any day can say that and put down a 500 mile trip to Monterey, CA and back. Great bike, not perfect, but perfect for me.

[interceptorrider]

The best way I can describe the 1200...

Its like a dancing partner with full curves. She takes a while to change directions but does so with grace and finesse. She also loves to tango and polka, can stop faster than you, is a bit meaty in all the right spots, has plenty to hang on to (or off of), and squeals in a magnificent and throaty way when you get the steps right. She also dresses up well at night, is well behaved enough to bring home to mom but knows how to blow your hair back when you are in the mood. She is the low-maintenance type who just knows she is only being used and is fine with it.

All told, win/win. Buy it. :)

Downsides to a VFR1200: Premium gas requirement and poor resale value. Otherwise it's a fantastic bike.

This is also very true.

That is the best metaphor for the big VFR I can imagine. Sums it up perfect. She is a lovely gal and my 4th VFR (two 5th gens, 6th gen, now 7th gen). I like her best. Like he said above.

Ride safe.

[zedXmick]

I love my DCT......I use Sport Mode for 99 % of my back roads. The VFR is a real world SPORT TOURING ride.....you can super slab it THOUSANDS of miles to the mountains,and then ENJOY the mountains, AND super slab it back home again......not many bikes can fill THAT role.

[Guest]

Owned a 2010 DCT. Traded it in for Ducati Multistrada six months after I purchased it. Two reasons for why I sold it (otherwise DCT is awesome)

1. Slow speed precise control without a clutch is very difficult to impossible - I took an advanced police riding skills class using their normal bikes and realized the DCT would get dropped multiple times in the slow speed maneuvers had I used it. You simply don't have the ability to balance clutch and throttle to balance the bike.

2. In the same training class we practiced high speed braking at least 50 times. 1'out of 10 times most of us had the the throttle partially opened while braking but the clutch was engaged so no issue. On DCT is one were to make that error, the results could be scary.

It was a great class and made me realize I had picked the wrong bike for ME. If you have strong interest in a vfr, I recommend you get a manual version.

[NorthernVFRDave]

Guess the small tank size isn't an issue for everyone... 4 liters smaller than the 800.

[Guest]

For nothing in the world I'd give away my DCT. Very much fun in manual, very comfortable for comuting in D, good low speed control even in fresh snow. And very very much fun in manul mode.

However, there are two major flaws:

- Lack of launch control. It won't win any traffic light sprint.

- No simple way (Z-Bomb) to remove 1st&2nd gear and top speed restrictions.

[Guest]

Guess the small tank size isn't an issue for everyone... 4 liters smaller than the 800.

Five gallons isn't a small tank....not FJR or ST sized, but I get a regular 45mpg on the road and have gone over 200 miles quite a few times.

I just got back from a 1200 mile road trip up to the Black Hills to ramble around - gas isn't an issue.

That makes the assumption that a buyer is looking at a '12 or '13 of course.

[Guest]

Short Answer: I love my VFR1200 FD. I've had a wide range and number of bikes past and present but If I could only have ONE bike, it'd be my Vee Great White.

and some rambling...

re: 1)shifting: I've been shifting cars and bikes for 42 years. I don't think I have to prove that I know how to shift, and yes there are isolated instances where the DCT is not perfect, but there are many, many yes MANY more times it is much more perfect, and faster, smoother than I will ever be. It's not only great in sporting attitude, but when covering thousands of miles in all types of conditions and traffic and fully loaded, I'll always... ALWAYS be fresher than anyone who is manually shifting. Fact. And ultimately more alert and safer than I would be on those forays without the DCT. Really just get over the " real men/bikers ÖNLY shift manually ". When I want to shift, I'll choose a bike or my car and go through the gears. wheee... yea, I love that too, but there is a reality... the comparison or choice has become more of a visceral preference than a performance issue.

2) gas tank/range: Yes the bike could use a larger tank, and yes it'd be nice if it didn't prefer Premium. Having said that I routinely get 155 miles between fill ups, and seem to always have at least a half to 3/4 gal still, and I manage 175 often on my trips... and yes I have also gotten over 200 miles on a tank 6 or 7 times. Admittedly, I think however my electronic cruise control perhaps maximizes my mileage. My limiting factor between stops could be more an issue of seating than the fuel/range.

The only additional thing I'd like to add that it is not mentioned in the now plethora of remarks and comments about the VFR1200 DCT in particular in various forums, (which sadly seem to be more negative than positive, except from actual well-traveled owners with time in the saddle)... is THE SINGLE Worst design element AND MOST IMPORTANT THING TO KNOW for ALL owners of the DCT:

There is an oil pressure relay on the bottom , under the black plastic, forward angled under cowling. It is unprotected and prone to impact and should it get bumped hard, the relay prongs and or plastic fitting can get displaced or sheared, which will effectively disable the ability to shift the gears, and can leave you stranded. If the prongs are bent or broken and the gear indicator light is blinking but you can still move, do NOT turn off the engine. If you do, you're dead in the water. I hoped some company might design and produce a guard, but as this has now happened to me twice, the most recently last summer during an impact with and over a deer, I'm thinking I might need to fabricate one myself. In any case, you should travel with a spare relay, some oil and tools and learn the reset procedure. (Pictures of the relay are in my gallery if interested).

Still, I have no regrets on my VFR12 FD purchase and look forward with sincere hope that Honda improves and develops the DCT product line both in the sport bike and touring models.