Charging - Voltage Starting To fluctuate

[BlackheathMatt]

Hi,

 

The R/R output on my 2005 6 Gen which previously never changed from 14.1/14.2 V at any revs above idle - has dropped slightly and now fluctuates from 13.5 V to 14.0 V. Doesn't seem to be dependent on revs, but the voltage rises slightly when I back off the throttle.

 

The battery is obviously still charging at this voltage - but I'm concerned this may be early warning of a developing problem.

 

Some background:

I've had the bike for 2 years - when I got it it had a charging problem which I traced back to a burnt stator (output was fine cold, but when warmed up one of the phases dropped to virtually no output). I replaced the stator - and also upgraded the R/R to a MOSFET type and fitted a VFRNESS and a voltmeter in the cockpit to keep an eye on things at the same time. As above, things seemed fine until recently.

 

I soldered the stator to R/R directly rather than use the connectors when I changed the stator and R/R - last time I had the fairings off I noticed that one of my soldered joints was getting hot through the insulation. That's the obvious suspect, I'll take the fairings off and resolder the joints over the weekend and hopefully that will be the end of it.

 

The only other thing I've changed recently was replacing the aftermarket LED bulbs the previous owner had fitted with OEM bulbs (the beam pattern of the LEDs was awful and was upsetting oncoming traffic).  Would conventional bulbs rather than lower power LEDs be enough to pull the voltage down. ?

 

I've checked that the displayed output of the voltmeter I installed matches the voltage across the battery terminals measured with a multimeter - and it's the same.

 

Anything else obvious I should check apart from my suspect soldering ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Grum]

Just make sure all connections are good. 

Going back from LED to standard 55w halogens will no doubt alter the charging voltage slightly, 13.5 to 14.0v is still a reasonable charging voltage.

The main good thing is you have a fairly new Stator and a MOSFET R/R.

How old is the Battery? And has it been on a charger/maintainer when not ridden much in the colder months?

[BlackheathMatt]

Hi Grum - thanks for your advice once again.

 

Should have said - I've ruled out the battery. I don't have any electrical power in the garage where I keep my bike, but I have a second battery that I keep inside on a smart charger and swap them over occasionally during the winter months when my bike only gets ridden occasionally.

 

Swapped the battery out for the fully charged (and relatively new) one last weekend and I see the same behaviour with both batteries.

 

Will resolder the suspect joint and check the other connections this weekend.

 

Cheers.

[bmart]

Can you unplug the LEDs and see what changes? 

[BlackheathMatt]

Was thinking just that on the way home. Really don't want to go to the hassle of putting the LED bulbs back in, but pulling the fuse would prove it it was the lights that caused the change. 

[Knute]

10 hours ago, BlackheathMatt said:

Hi,

 

The R/R output on my 2005 6 Gen which previously never changed from 14.1/14.2 V at any revs above idle - has dropped slightly and now fluctuates from 13.5 V to 14.0 V. Doesn't seem to be dependent on revs, but the voltage rises slightly when I back off the throttle.

 

The battery is obviously still charging at this voltage - but I'm concerned this may be early warning of a developing problem.

 

Some background:

I've had the bike for 2 years - when I got it it had a charging problem which I traced back to a burnt stator (output was fine cold, but when warmed up one of the phases dropped to virtually no output). I replaced the stator - and also upgraded the R/R to a MOSFET type and fitted a VFRNESS and a voltmeter in the cockpit to keep an eye on things at the same time. As above, things seemed fine until recently.

 

I soldered the stator to R/R directly rather than use the connectors when I changed the stator and R/R - last time I had the fairings off I noticed that one of my soldered joints was getting hot through the insulation. That's the obvious suspect, I'll take the fairings off and resolder the joints over the weekend and hopefully that will be the end of it.

 

The only other thing I've changed recently was replacing the aftermarket LED bulbs the previous owner had fitted with OEM bulbs (the beam pattern of the LEDs was awful and was upsetting oncoming traffic).  Would conventional bulbs rather than lower power LEDs be enough to pull the voltage down. ?

 

I've checked that the displayed output of the voltmeter I installed matches the voltage across the battery terminals measured with a multimeter - and it's the same.

 

Anything else obvious I should check apart from my suspect soldering ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Did you go OEM or aftermarket on the stator? Some time ago I replaced the stator on my '04 with a Rick's and it failed at about 5,000 mile, replaced it with OEM and have had no issues since. Just a FYI. Best of luck, hope you get it sorted.

[bmart]

I'm sorry to hear that. Everything I've ever installed from Rick's has never needed attention after. 

[DannoXYZ]

Which RR did you get? Shunt or series circuit? 

One of problems with 5/6th-gen engines is there's not enough oil flow across stator to keep it cool. That's why you had failed original one. 

Compounding this issue is shunt RR circuits (original SCR and new MOSFET) will drive stator at 100% full-time. Some of power will go to driving lights, ECU, accessories, etc. But remainder of stator capacity will be dumped to ground. MOSFET may be more efficient at converting more of stator's power for available use, but it still drives stator @ 100% and will eventually fry it.

 

1. Test stator again, it may have failed due to overheating
 

2. replace RR with series unit SH775 or SH847 which only sucks enough power from stator to meet current electrical needs. They run much cooler as result, can touch RR after ride and it won't fry you like previous shunt design. Meaning, stator is also similarly cooler.

[BlackheathMatt]

My new stator was from Rick's - it's now 18months/5000 miles old .....

 

No reason to point the finger yet at Stator yet - fairings coming off today for this winter's dousing with ACF-50. Will check connections , then 'the drill" if needed.

 

What are your opinions on a new OEM stator Vs a rewind if that's what's needed ? Can anyone recommend somewhere to do a stator rewind in the UK ?

[BlackheathMatt]

My R/R was from wiremybike and is apparently the one Rick's sell.

 

https://www.wiremybike.com/product_info.php?cPath=1_17&products_id=325

 

Is this a shunt or series type ?

 

[bmart]

9 hours ago, BlackheathMatt said:

What are your opinions on a new OEM stator Vs a rewind if that's what's needed ?

They rewound my CB-1 stator without any issues. Works great. 

[BlackheathMatt]

So I'm pretty sure it was changing the LED bulbs back to halogens that caused the change in behaviour. 

 

I pulled the headlight fuse and I see 14.4V immediately after startup - settling down to a steady 14.1V after a couple of minutes - which is very similar to what I used to see with the LED bulbs.

 

Putting the fuse back in - I see 14.1V on startup settling down to 13.7. Went for a ride and saw between 13.6 and 14.0., dropping to 13.4 at warmed up idle. Brake light, high beam and cooling fans drop it to about 13v. I think the voltage does fluctuate more than it used to - but never drops to a level that causes concern - suspect something to do with having a higher baseload draw from the more demanding lights. 

 

If I hadn't fitted a voltmeter I'd never have known or worried !

 

Still a bit paranoid and want to have a spare stator on the shelf just in case - so would still be grateful for a recommendation of somewhere to get my old stator rewound in the UK. Or maybe just bite the bullet and may for an OEM stator in the knowledgeable that it will last 30k miles rather than the 3k the previous owner got out of the Chinese unbranded one he replaced the original one with .,...

 

Also would be grateful if anyone has an opinion of whether there's a better choice of R/R than the Rick's one I've got - although it was still cool to the touch after 30 mins of stationary running. 

 

Thanks once again for the knowledgeable and friendly advice. Having this community to call upon makes owning the bike all the more enjoyable.

 

 

 

 

[mello dude]

I'm running the FH020AA for 3 seasons and it's fine, it's just warm to the touch.

Get it here....

www.roadstercycle.com

 

 

[Cherryriver]

For what it's worth, during some fairly extensive exchanges with Jack Fleming of Roadstercycle, he pretty much insisted I go with the 847 series-type for my '03.

I had already changed all the lamps to LEDs excepting the high beams.  He says that shunt-type regulators will suffer with being too lightly loaded and so the series type is needed.

That makes sense enough to me, so I purchased and installed his 847 "Superkit".  So far I've only managed 300 miles with it- it is winter, after all- but the voltmeter on the panel is pretty much locked on 14.4-14.6.  That sounded a touch high to me but Mr. Fleming says it's fine that way.

The bike keeps running, so there's that.

[bmart]

My '00 w/same setup reads 14.3-14.4 at RPM

My '98 w/VRFness and Rick's RR reads 14.7-14.8 at RPM

 

(Stock setup '89 and '90 Honda CB-1 read 13.9-14.3 at RPM)