Veefer Madness

[keef]

Thanks PR, the vfr will power slide through corners if you get it just right. The rear tyre was ripping up a little at the start of the trackday, so i softened the rear suspension up a bit, and then it was much better, really good through one particular corner at Eastern Creek here in Sydney. Not bad for a touring bike.

And Paladin, once you change the exhaust, dump the headlights and fairings, you'll lose a fair bit of weight. The ducati wheels i used are a lot lighter than the vfr ones, i think the 1098S rear wheel (bare, no cush/sprocket etc) weighs 3 or 3.5 kgs. It kind of offsets the extra weight of the SSSA.

[paladinreed]

The 1098s rear that I have is 17x6, and I have a 190 50 at the moment, but will change to a 190 55 in a week or so. Mine is used right to the edge, so no handling issues with a 6 inch

Pish is right. This is seriously BA. I would ride a machine I put together that hard no problem. My problem is just not having near the skill to maximize this bike. I've got a lot of riding experience to catch up on only having ridden street for less than two years. Awesome pic

The 1098s rear that I have is 17x6, and I have a 190 50 at the moment, but will change to a 190 55 in a week or so. Mine is used right to the edge, so no handling issues with a 6 inch

Keef, that tire makes my heart race, thinking about the little time I've spent on a track! I got to run my FZ6 around the track this summer, and I didn't have much chickenstrip left, and I was clearly sliding a good bit with the tire boogers! But my god, you look like you were at 10/10ths! riding ltterally on the edge of that tire of a bike that you assembled yourself! Way to go man! I can't wait till mine is complete, and better yet, till I'm comfortable enough on it to ride it hard from time to time!

As far as subframe comparison, the ducati frame is heavier than I thought it would be. Contrarily, the vfr8 frame is lighter than I suspected. Granted the ducati tail has to hold a 20lb exhaust and potentially two riders so its pretty beefy but I had too much hope that it would be featherweight comparatively.

paladinreed, have you considered Ducati's monoposto subframes?? I just spent about 5 minutes searching around for the weight comparisons of the biposto (two-up) subframe, vs. the aluminum (solo) monoposto subframe with no luck. But there are tons of them on fleabay! Check it out!

It's just awesome you get to go shove your bike around a road course! Closest thing to me here is almost 4 hours away in Oklahoma at Hulett. It isn't often I'm in OK.

As far as the subframe goes, my wife agreed to this project (I have too many others) under the one condition that she could A ride shot gun, and B learn to ride solo on the street. So it has to be a 2up seat for my needs.

That is also the reason for the goal of as much weight loss as possible because she is about 110lbs wet.

I know that for a first timer this bike is a little much but I'm proud to report that she took it around the block the other day before the strip down successfully going into all gears 1-3 and back into neutral to park. I was pretty impressed seeing her on a bike essentially 5 times her size. She gears up well so as long as shes not hurt from a tip over, I don't care much for the bike... That is... until it's built

If she likes it enough we'll get her something more suited to her size.

Thanks PR, the vfr will power slide through corners if you get it just right. The rear tyre was ripping up a little at the start of the trackday, so i softened the rear suspension up a bit, and then it was much better, really good through one particular corner at Eastern Creek here in Sydney. Not bad for a touring bike.

And Paladin, once you change the exhaust, dump the headlights and fairings, you'll lose a fair bit of weight. The ducati wheels i used are a lot lighter than the vfr ones, i think the 1098S rear wheel (bare, no cush/sprocket etc) weighs 3 or 3.5 kgs. It kind of offsets the extra weight of the SSSA.

Yeah, I'm looking forward to being able to handle the bike a little better just in general after shaving some lbs. The rear wheel I have planned will hopefully be no more than 13-15 lbs which is significantly heavier than the ducati wheel but I thought still pretty good.

Is the duc wheel magnesium?

btw PM incoming.

[keef]

Not mag, forged alloy. The rear duke wheel felt lighter than my carrozzeria front wheel.

[PishvaianRider]

Paladinreed,

well, you are building this thing yourself! you could always have two subframes? design it such that it would be a simple four or so bolts to take on and off, then a simple wiring setup, and you're good to ride two up or solo!

[paladinreed]

So I had the fabricator scheduled to come out yesterday but he bailed on me. (Hard to get good professional help here) so I went and bought a pipe bender and some materials and fire up the welder.

I must say I was making good headway fabricating the pipe but my little MIG running flux has been punching small holes in the steel. So I've got to have someone else do the welding for the subframe.

Here are a few pics.

[paladinreed]

Picked up w lobster claw from an 1125cr to see what was up. I think ill like it. Rads and coils will be remounted to look much cleaner and more flush underneath them.

[Dutchy]

fit more towards the back as to cool the R/R????

[keef]

Are the shrouds going to go over the rads to force air in, or just decorative to hide the rads?

If you leave them open, it will stop the rads from working, the scoops force air in from the outside, but air will also be pushed in from in front of the engine. The air from 2 different directions will cancel each other out.

If they're just decorative, carry on. I think you'd need to tip them down a bit at the front, the lines don't work. The lines on the tank point down, then the line from the cowl goes back up again. I think you need to make the lines on the cowl follow the tank.

[paladinreed]

fit more towards the back as to cool the R/R????

har har

Are the shrouds going to go over the rads to force air in, or just decorative to hide the rads?

If you leave them open, it will stop the rads from working, the scoops force air in from the outside, but air will also be pushed in from in front of the engine. The air from 2 different directions will cancel each other out.

If they're just decorative, carry on. I think you'd need to tip them down a bit at the front, the lines don't work. The lines on the tank point down, then the line from the cowl goes back up again. I think you need to make the lines on the cowl follow the tank.

Well, they are primarily aesthetic. I really want to do a front mount, but I also want to run some lower side fairing. So this just keeps the stock system in tact and allows me to run a good looking mid fairing.

Two I plan on getting the entire exhaust jet-ceramic coated which should reduce surface and ambient temps a little in that area, and also the front of the bike there is certainly not the hottest spot as far as heat coming from the engine/exhaust. It gets lots of airflow, and its mostly exposed now. Not to mention the rads are going to be remounted horizontally and the coolant piping simplified (tucked in hopefully) so they will be tucked back and against the aluminum frame rather than out there by the front pipes.

I may vent the backsides of the lobster claws to provide more "through" airflow but in the end I think they will certainly be functional to a degree and expect cooler ambient and riding temps. Time will tell

I do agree about the lines though. That will take some piddling with. They were just placed on the rad that shouldnt be the final mounting place.

[keef]

The rads need air to flow through, not just past them.

With a normal front facing rad, a lot of air hits the front of the rad, creating high air pressure. It then flows through the rad to the back where the low air pressure zone is, as the air flows through the rad, it takes away the heat.

When Honda mounted them sideways, it needed to use the fairing to create high pressure on one side of the rads ( in front of the engine) and low pressure on the other side, to make air flow sideways, when it just wants to go front to back.

With the scoops the way they are, you will still have the high pressure in front of the engine, but you have added another high pressure zone on the other side of the rad. as those giant scoops capture a lot of air. Two high pressure zones means no flow through the rads, just around them as the air looks for the easiest path of travel.

With my bike, I noticed that without the fairings ( and with the er6n rad shrouds that created a little bit of negative pressure on the outside of the rads) the fan was always running, there was heaps of flow around the rads, but not through. It meant it was always hot.

Put a TL1000R top rad on it. I bought a new from china one for $112 delivered, paid a rad shop to move the inlet from top left to top right, and then some I did new silicone hoses. You could probably get away with using most of the existing rubber hoses. Much easier than the internet made it seem.

Not lecturing, but I ran mine for a year and a bit with the side mounts, always ran hot with the fan on, and that was with ceramic coated headers and a vtr pusher fan.

[keef]

Just had a thought, if you blocked the front of the intake scoop, and opened it up at the back, it should help suck air through the rads from in front of the engine.

Have a look at cycra power flow dirtbike rad shrouds, that'll explain it better than I can.

[paladinreed]

Decided to get the rest of this tacked together. Good news is, Im getting better at this. And its now ready for the pro. Bad news is, he's got his hands full with correcting my early mistakes and making this sub look decent but I have the fullest confidence I didn't muck it up too bad.

Hopefully will go out to him tomorrow or Thursday.

Ghetto rigged tail support and positioning but its pretty darn straight if I do say so myself.

Pics

Played with the 2007 CBR exhaust I picked up for $50. Think it might work with a few inches chopped out and a clean SS linkpipe tucked up in there. The fat ducati tail will swallow it.

Just zipped on. Can probably utilize stock 848 hangers to look factory

Finally, all tacked together and hung until it goes to the welder. And the lobsta claw tossed on for a laugh.

Cheers gents.

PSA- Entire front end of this 45k mi bike is for sale. Forks are nice and straight, no pitting or major leaks. From tire to controls Id like to sell as a unit. Shoot me offers if interested.

Also, picking up complete 06 GSXR600 front end on Thursday as well as an entire 08 CBR600rr front end to play with.

[keef]

Looking good, mate. The angle of the seat seems to flow with the angle of the tank, too.

Can you take a shot from the front so I can see how wide the claw is?

[paladinreed]

If anyone needs any measurements, I've got a hold of two front ends to muck around with.

2008 600rr on the right

2006 gsxr600 on the left

Will also be pulling the vfrs stock front end if anyone wants a caliper on something lmk (pm if interested in parts or whole)

[Mohawk]

Secondly, I'm spitballing this custom rear wheel and am thinking a 17x6 et ~10-13 with a 190 or 200 series rear tire. Are there any glaring issues with that in application?

I have an RC45 BST. Carbon rear on mine, I went for the 5.75" version as I was not sure if the 6" would fit with a 190 section tyre. With a 180/55 Michelin Pilot Pure fitted I can just get a 13mm socket between the tyre edge & the swingarm. The socket external dimensions are approx 18mm diameter, so a 6" wheel would reduce clearance by 3mm. A nominal 190 section tyre would reduce clearance by 5mm, so you should be left with approx 10mm of clearance to the swingarm.

I'm pretty sure a 200 would fit, but may rub as the tyre flexes !!! Remember that wider tyres do NOT usually improve handling.

[paladinreed]

Looking good, mate. The angle of the seat seems to flow with the angle of the tank, too.

Can you take a shot from the front so I can see how wide the claw is?

I've only got the one pic from the front 3/4 up there but I'll try to snag a better one of the claw dimensions. I'll be out in the garage this Tuesday night with some mates, I'll grab some pics.

Rethinking the undertail pending ducati fairings mock up. A really high left exit might be cool as well I'm beginning to think.

Also, have a few parts for sale still in a new thread in the classifieds section. Already sold and shipped numerous items successfully on this forum with great response. Hit me up if you see something you need.

I have an RC45 BST. Carbon rear on mine, I went for the 5.75" version as I was not sure if the 6" would fit with a 190 section tyre. With a 180/55 Michelin Pilot Pure fitted I can just get a 13mm socket between the tyre edge & the swingarm. The socket external dimensions are approx 18mm diameter, so a 6" wheel would reduce clearance by 3mm. A nominal 190 section tyre would reduce clearance by 5mm, so you should be left with approx 10mm of clearance to the swingarm.

I'm pretty sure a 200 would fit, but may rub as the tyre flexes !!! Remember that wider tyres do NOT usually improve handling.

Thanks for your input on the wheel specs. Might I ask if the rc45 wheel is stock offset? Overall I don't suspect the handling to be changed much with the 190 but I do think it will fit/seat better on the wider custom wheel.

Cheers

[keef]

I'm running a 6 inch ducati wheel, have used a 190/50 and now a 190/55. The 55 is much more betterer.

no issues with clearances, looks better than the 5.5 inch 180 section (especially with a smaller seat unit), and doesn't sacrifice any handling.

[paladinreed]

Not too much to update, just some more stripping. Trying to get some stuff sold before I resume. Budget is tight this time of year. Check out the classifieds if you need anything you see coming off the bike.

Also, a quick pic of how the subframe got finish welded. I'll smooth them out before it gets powder but I still have the battery box to incorporate before that.

What are the general opinions on ballistic batteries? Size needed? What is the expected life when tended with a battery charger? Obviously there is going to be a significant shortening of the harness and far less electrical draw on the system than stock. Need to start looking into this issue.

Lastly, got some cool alu cnc pieces although yet to get the thing they mount. Doh! No clams for that.

Also have word on the rear wheel. Should be complete in a couple of weeks and could be in my hands by January sometime!

[apexandy]

Knifemaker headlight bracket? Looks just like mine :)

And I'm running an 8 cell ballistic. It works awesome!

[paladinreed]

Yeah it's the same design, and honestly the best looking headlight brackets for adapting that headlight I've seen. I love it on your build. The design was sold to another CF member and now they're being produced by DBDesigns over there and he's does a few sets at a time.

Thanks for the input on the battery. I'll have to start mocking up a small battery/electronics box for the tail now with some dimensions from online.

[PishvaianRider]

I did a search for "knifemaker headlight" and one of the first things to come up was this pretty incredible build over on Custom Fighters.

http://www.customfighters.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33094&highlight=LSL&page=39

Pretty awesome, and build motivation!!

[apexandy]

You should check out his recent build... A virago engined custom framed sportbike with handmade CF bodywork. He's a talented man.

[PishvaianRider]

Woahh, thats pretty sick! Hopefully these three latest builds on the 5th gen VFRD page turn out as nice as that guys! the CF work that he's done on his bikes looks incredible

[paladinreed]

You should check out his recent build... A virago engined custom framed sportbike with handmade CF bodywork. He's a talented man.

Yeah homeboy has some serious talent. But don't discount your own. Both craftsmanship was incredible on both builds especially in the one off body parts.

Woahh, thats pretty sick! Hopefully these three latest builds on the 5th gen VFRD page turn out as nice as that guys! the CF work that he's done on his bikes looks incredible

Don't hold your breath haha

The more I'm on this site the more I realize most people have more work into their "stockers" than I will have into my customized ride. Lots of skill on this site. Comparatively I'm just throwing a bike together.

[PishvaianRider]

Don't hold your breath haha

The more I'm on this site the more I realize most people have more work into their "stockers" than I will have into my customized ride. Lots of skill on this site. Comparatively I'm just throwing a bike together.

Haha yes thats how it starts, I thought that I was doing the same, just throwing something together. Then the more you read, the more you find other cool custom bikes like that one on custom fighters, the more ideas you get! The more ideas you get, the more you want to do to your project It's never ending!

. . . . or is that just me?