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Frame Welding


JZH

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As I am sadly now essentially exiled from my garage workshop and, thus, my numerous unfinished projects, all I can do is ruminate about yet more potential projects... sad.gif

However, one idea I've been thinking about is making a modification to my FP's frame, along the lines of what vfroem has done to his (which was to cut off part of the cast side plates, which made his frame more like that of the FR-FV), but my modification would likely require welding to support the (necessarily) somewhat weakened frame. I'd like to cut away the parts on both sides that block the view of the Ohlins (and, er, the heat from the rear pipes--but I'll wear my Kevlar undies). It would involve welding to the cast part, not the extruded frame spars, but as the cast part was actually welded to the spars at the factory, it must be possible.

Does anyone have any thoughts about welding, say, some bits of 3/8" alloy plate to the back of the cast part of the VFR750FL-P frame? Is it do-able? Are there large pitfalls awaiting? I'd like to know now, cuz once I apply hacksaw to frame, I'll be pretty much committed!

I have welded before, but based on some of the remaining evidence thereof, I can't really claim any degree of competence, so I would be seeking the services of a skilled welder to actually do the deed. I'll cut and shape the new parts to be welded onto the frame, so I'll only be out-sourcing the welding. Maybe I could do the tack-welding, though? I've got some welding kit, which I think includes some alloy rod and appropriate gas for my MIG, but I've never tried welding aluminum, so I'm a bit apprehensive about the whole idea. Anyway, TIA.

Cheers,

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Take it to a real good welder who tigs everyday and who understands cast alum. You need to be very competent with a mig on alum to undertake this and it still won't be as good as tig welded.

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Take it to a real good welder who tigs everyday and who understands cast alum. You need to be very competent with a mig on alum to undertake this and it still won't be as good as tig welded.

:blink:

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I follow with the guys advise - talk to a good welder. I take it you are London based?

James at essex wheels and engineering did my Hossack VFR tig welding. http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...60&start=60

he's a top guyand ace grass-track frame builder based just north of Chelmsford Essex.

http://www.essexwheelsandeng.com

PM me if you'd like his number?

Redmarque

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Thanks, yes, I'm nominally in London, so Chelmsford isn't very far away. TIG it is, then...

Ciao,

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Thanks, yes, I'm nominally in London, so Chelmsford isn't very far away. TIG it is, then...

Ciao,

PM Sent. - Sure you'll let everyone know - probably worth sending some pics/sketches of what you'd like done.

Redmarque :blink:

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Honda has to contract out with local Tig welding shops all over the world in order to repair faulty GL1800 Wing frames, it's no big deal for a qualified welder to weld aluminum frames. :blink:

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I was thinking about this idea again and remembered that I had not asked a particular question, namely, which _grade_ of alloy/aluminum/aluminium should I be trying to have TIG-welded to the cast part of the frame?

While this is going to be a strengthening operation, I think the ease/quality of the weld with the existing metal will be more important than the absolute strength of the alloy plate (which will probably be at least 10mm thick anyway). The pieces of plate would be welded inside the frame, in a perpendicular orientation so that they would not be visible, in order to build up the skeletonized parts of the frame openings, which support the rear subframe. I'll be removing the pillion accomodations and possibly also the rear part of the seat (which would otherwise be under the cowl). Because the bike won't be carrying any passengers, I am really only considering the welding for piece of mind, since I will necessarily have to cut some of the frame away.

Let's see if I can illustrate what I'm trying to do...

gallery_362_402_30118.jpg

Imagine...

Well, I'm afraid I've maxed-out my Photoshopping abilities with the above effort... Try to imagine the same bike with an Ohlins w/yellow spring behind the now-fully-open frame openings, a polished frame, no pillion footpeg brackets, no rear mudguard, Laser underseat exhausts, a black NR rear wheel, a polished RC30 swing arm, RC51 forks and black front wheel, 929 front mudguard, no lower cowl metal pieces, a dark double-bubble windscreen, Y2k mirrors, FR-FV footpeg brackets and a black seat. Otherwise, exactly as in the image!

Cheers,

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A-ha, now I get what you want to do. Sure it needs welding? I'll have to go have another look at a nekkid 3rd Gen frame, but could you potentially get by with a bolt-on support where the subframe meets the to-be-modded frame spars?

And I'm sure there's some talent here to flesh out your proposed mods on a pic of a 3rd Gen... the Hi-Perform 3rd Gen would be a good place to start:

vfrrt1.jpg

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A-ha, now I get what you want to do. Sure it needs welding? I'll have to go have another look at a nekkid 3rd Gen frame, but could you potentially get by with a bolt-on support where the subframe meets the to-be-modded frame spars?

I've had some preliminary looks at my FL's frame (which is helpfully not attached to an FL at the moment!), and the problem is that the "webbing" material appears to be structurally significant--at least to my untrained eye. I'll have another look this weekend.

Ciao,

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If there's anyway it could be done by bolting on, I would go that route. Welding on an aluminum motorcycle frame is tricky stuff - especially if it's for cosmetic reasons only.

With the paints available now days, you can make any material look like aluminum. The luggage rack on the Honda ST1300? Looks like it's cast aluminum that's been polished but in reality it's plastic that has been painted. It has fooled a lot of people when they went to tie down their ST on a trailer and the plastic broke. I never realized it was plastic until I got to looking real close at the "casting".

For my 2¢, you're going to a lot of time, trouble, expense, and inviting a lot of problems just for cosmetics. Of course, I could be wrong.

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