Lint Posted April 8, 2015 Share Posted April 8, 2015 I am looking at the Service Manual and it states the stock position for the forks, measured at the top of the top bridge is 41mm. Right now, I have it set to 51mm, as I lowered it 10mm. I read on bikersoracle that the 6th gen is already lowered 5mm, and I should be lowered only to 46mm. Which should it be? Who has experience with this? Lemmee know. This is the Service Manual pic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 9, 2015 Author Share Posted April 9, 2015 Another question I have, is how do I shim the rear shock up and by how much? I've read a coupe of threads and I have been given advice to raise the shock. After riding my VFR with the forks raised by about 10-11mm, I really like it. It tips in quick! So, let's say I return the forks to stock and shim the shock, how and how much? I'm 260lbs and 6'2" and the forks and shock are at Mac compression. I already know that the most correct route is to have Jaime sell me the cartridge kit and rebuilt/resprung rear shock. I'm just looking to quicken the steering until then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer MadScientist Posted April 9, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 9, 2015 To raise the rear suspension, you can make shims that go between the shock and the frame crossmember. I'm not exactly sure what the rising ratio for a 6th gen is, but I would expect the same or similar to the 3:1 ratio on the 5th gen. So 3mm of shim results in 9mm of height increase. This is made from a stainless washer that I cut with a dremel. You can of course use whole washers, but then you have to drop the shock completely out of its upper mount to get them on the threaded mounting shaft. This way you can just loosen it and slide the shims in. BTW, the rear wheel must be off the ground so the shock drops to slide them in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer auggius Posted April 9, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 9, 2015 I went to an auto shop and they gave me a couple of shims for free. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer MadScientist Posted April 9, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 9, 2015 Good to know. Do they look about like what I posted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 9, 2015 Author Share Posted April 9, 2015 Good tips, thanks. As I am a noob at this, how much should I shim the rear up? Should I start with 9mm final ratio and adjust from there? Should I go for the final number being 10 instead of 9? Also, does anyone recommend returning the forks to stock, or should I leave them at 10mm raised? In which circumstance would I notice the reduction in clearance? Would it put my pegs a little closer to the ground leanded over or is it a bump thing? On the track last month, I was hitting pegs with everything in stock position. I now know I can get lower off of the bike and push the bike up to reduce lean angle, but maintain or increase speed. Let me know. I do like the better/quicker steering I have now, and if I can raise the shock and end up with the same result, even better. I just done want the front to get out off whack. I'm starting to read this as well. http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/showthread.php?122865-Suspension-changes-and-trackside-notes&highlight=suspension%20setup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer auggius Posted April 9, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 9, 2015 Good to know. Do they look about like what I posted?Looks like this but without the flipped up ends. They come in different thicknesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFRpwr Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Hey Lint, Was able to get three flat washers on mine for a total of 6mm total shim on top of the shock (OK, all I could find in the various misc parts bins were three of the right sized flat washers). Possibly could have gone four but there might not have been enough thread left out the top of the lock nut to bite. I went the route of dropping the shock down and going in through the frame/chain guard with the washers. Went through with the extra effort as I wanted to double check the triangles for correct positioning after some late night reading on the site where, if I recall correctly, should they be installed incorrectly this would change the ratio/ride height. All was good and now, shimmed up, even more gooder. This would be now in the neighborhood of 6-8mm less trail on the front steering geometry? If this wasn't such a PITA I'd like to run with varying numbers of washers. Can always experiment with dropping the triples/raising the fork tubes........ Let us know what you think of the change - am very interested to hear. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 9, 2015 Author Share Posted April 9, 2015 I will. Charging my Dremel... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyZ Posted April 9, 2015 Share Posted April 9, 2015 Charging? Damn I still have to plug mine in. Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 9, 2015 Author Share Posted April 9, 2015 Charging? Damn I still have to plug mine in. Lol Plug in is better. Power cords don't need charged! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 10, 2015 Author Share Posted April 10, 2015 Well, I haven't yet raised the rear, but I was able to partake in exuberent riding this afternoon and I am in love with the raised forks/lowered triples. A certain turn that I enjoy suddenly became a revelation with the new setup and I was able to determine that the bike is stable at speed, something I was uncertain if it was going to be, having had about 5 years scared out of me on a borrowed GSXR that got a full lock tank slapper at 145 many many years ago. I look forward to Latigo, as it is a very tight left right canyon road that should be substanially more fun now. I do remember that the very first time I rode the bike around my apartment complex, I had the sensation of sittin in the bike, versus on it. I was surprised at such a small change altering how the bike felt in the cockpit. I look forward to shimming the shock this weekend. The utter ease of negotiating curves now is something to behold! The speed through the turn is up, the apexes and exits are hit so effortlessly, it's amazing! I am really starting to dream about upgrading the suspension after finding the correct setup with shims and drop. The trackday bug is calling. Man, why didn't I do this earlier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer MadScientist Posted April 10, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 10, 2015 Mine is dropped up front and shimmed in the rear. I don't think you will be able to go too far up in the rear, given the length of the OEM shock mount threads. You might want to bring the front up to OEM, then lower it in small amounts to get the turn-in that you desire. The rake and trail of the VFR is fairly conservative, and I haven't run into any instability issues. I know I'm up 27mm (9mm shims) in the back on the 929 shock and I thought the front was down 10mm, but I would have to double check. You do give up a bit of ground clearance by lowering the front though so it is preferable to get where you want by raising the rear. It does bother me a bit sometimes by the extra lean angle when on the kickstand, but sometimes it helps when parking by a curb where the road curvature would make you loose some of the lean (like how my bike is in my avatar). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Duc2V4 Posted April 10, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 10, 2015 Lint, once you know what rear height you want, you can probably just have JD build your shock to the length you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 10, 2015 Author Share Posted April 10, 2015 Good idea Duc! Thanks Mad, that's along what I am thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 12, 2015 Author Share Posted April 12, 2015 I rode up into the canyons today and I definitely like the change. Easier to tip into the turn, finer control. I dare say I may possibly have gotten lower? I have to wait for the pics tho. I definitely want to raise the rear, so with that said, what size washers should I be looking at, I.D. and O.D.? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer MadScientist Posted April 12, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 12, 2015 I'll measure when I get home on monday if nobody fields this before then. I think that was a stainless 1.5" fender washer with a 3/8" center hole, but maybe it was 2" & 7/16". I'll check for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Mohawk Posted April 12, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 12, 2015 It does bother me a bit sometimes by the extra lean angle when on the kickstand, but sometimes it helps when parking by a curb where the road curvature would make you loose some of the lean (like how my bikepics is in my avatar). That's because your bike has a left side stand which being made in Japan, where they drive on the left side of the road, is perfect. If you try parking as per your avatar, but with the bike pointing back down the against the flow as if you were riding on the left ! you will see what I mean, that dip at the edge of the road increases the lean angle ! Works here in the UK too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer MadScientist Posted April 12, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 12, 2015 Just to detour from the topic for a minute, since this was once an item of my curiousity. Almost all kickstands are on the left hand side of the bike. There are many theories behind the reason for this ranging all the way back to the practice of mounting a horse from the left while wearing a longsword. Looking at possibly the first kickstand, designed for a bicycle in 1869 by the Frenchman Alfred Berruyer, it is shown in his illustrations as operating on the left side of the bike. However, when we look at the first modern, U.S. patented kickstand (1926, Eldon Henderson) the kickstand operates on the right hand side of the cycle (his patent covers motorized and non-motorized cycles). As was noted, this would be more compatible with the road crown in countries where traffic operates on the right side of the road. If you are curious about that, crowned roads (and storm drains) go all the way back to Roman times or earlier. Why then was it kept on the left hand side? I've never found a satisfying explanation but could have to do with kickstarters or which way a side mounted carburetor leans when the bike is at rest. Either one of those reasons, if valid, would require totally different castings and assembly for different markets; thus making two possibilities of kickstand orientation as financially unfeasable. Ok, back to our regularly scheduled programming... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer mk3dub Posted April 13, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 13, 2015 Lint, once you know what rear height you want, you can probably just have JD build your shock to the length you want. Alternatively, good aftermarket shocks are adjustable. I can speak for the Penske only, but that has the ability to lengthen the shock by about 12 mm. Very easy to do with a 1" wrench on the center stand... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 14, 2015 Author Share Posted April 14, 2015 I have to admit to liking the suspension changes. Links to pics.http://shop.rockstorephotos.com/p254841810/h4221fd31#h4221fbf1http://shop.rockstorephotos.com/p254841810/h4221fd31#h4221fd31http://shop.rockstorephotos.com/p254841810/h4221fd31#h4221fe05http://shop.rockstorephotos.com/p254841810/h4221fd31#h4221fe27http://shop.rockstorephotos.com/p254841810/h4221fd31#h4221fef9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer MadScientist Posted April 14, 2015 Member Contributer Share Posted April 14, 2015 Damn my memory is pretty good, yep it was a 3/8 x 1.5" fender washer. Full disclosure - a 3/8" washer has a 13/32" center hole to give some clearance, I measure .410 which is slightly larger than 13/32. The bore looks unadulterated, so I didn't enlarge the holes with a file or anything - probably just mfg tolerance or the $10 caliper... Edit - I just checked the bore diameter on an M10 washer and it should be 10.5mm or .413". I suppose I could have found a 10mm stainless fender washer, but this is HIGHLY unlikely given the hardware stores around here would most likely not stock that size. However if you find a M10 x 38-40 mm fender washer, that will work too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted April 14, 2015 Author Share Posted April 14, 2015 Thanks Mad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lint Posted May 5, 2015 Author Share Posted May 5, 2015 i went to an alignment shop and they had a couple of old alignment shims. I only needed one, as it was 4mm thick. I have some washers that will fit, if I ever want to raise it more, but it's so much quicker turning now! It really feels like a different bike! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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