Sargent Seat Doesn't Fit...

[Guest]

My stock seat has the gap in the profile around the subframe/plastic as well.

While we're on the subject of seats, does anyone know whether the Corbin or the Sargent is more comfortable for a passenger? At this point, my ass is nearly immune to bad motorcycle seats but I'd like to find the best option available for the passenger, as I want to use the VFR for touring. I lean toward the Sargent because I had one on my last Ducati and was very happy with it so if anyone has particular feedback on that, I'd appreciate it.

[2thdr]

No seat on the VFR is going to be that great for a pillion unless they are a small person. If that is your main concern you may want to consider having a custom seat made up using the stock seat pan. A good winter project... Google custom motorcycle seats and you will come up with a few. I know there is a good place in Washington state (Rich's Custom Seats).

[adg44]

Also wanted to update this thread. Although I am still disappointed with how hard it is to install the seat (let's be honest, for $400 it should install as easily as the stock seat), I am warming up to the comfort. I rode 120 miles and had no discomfort at all. Still getting used to the different feel and slightly different riding position, but I'm starting to like it.

[L8Apex]

Ok, not to beat a dead horse, but my Sargent seat showed up at my house last week, and I had the same problems being described here with the initial fit.

What I found that worked for me is, on the bottom of the seat in the center, there are four black round rubber spacers (for lack of a better term), I temporarily removed these, and got the seat fully in place and latched for the first time, so it confirmed for me where the snag was, the brand new, uncompressed rubber spacers were not sliding forward when they made contact with the bar they rest on, the fresh rubber was just grabbing too much. I put a dab of water (could have used soapy water etc), but put a drop on each of the spacers, and the seat scooted all the way up and locked into place, no dremeling, cutting etc. as I really did not want to start guessing what might work best, but this worked great. Bike is an '06 btw.

Cheers

[VFR4Lee]

Someone tell Sargent to armor all those things at the factory.

[triharder]

My stock seat has the gap in the profile around the subframe/plastic as well.

While we're on the subject of seats, does anyone know whether the Corbin or the Sargent is more comfortable for a passenger? At this point, my ass is nearly immune to bad motorcycle seats but I'd like to find the best option available for the passenger, as I want to use the VFR for touring. I lean toward the Sargent because I had one on my last Ducati and was very happy with it so if anyone has particular feedback on that, I'd appreciate it.

My girlfriend rode from coast to coast with me on the back of my VFR. (She's 5'7 about 160ish lbs for reference). It has a corbin seat with the backrest. (although with a forward slanting seat the back rest was more of a "nice to know its there") then a useful feature. Also we used a carpet keeper (goes between carpet and hardwood floor) to keep her from sliding down the seat.

Took her from a 1 hour passenger to be able to ride all day. In fact i'd strongly suggest that carpert keeper to anyone with a passenger. Especially if they complain about sliding down the seat and there knees and legs aching after riding as passenger. Its small enough that it tucks around the seat and latches with the seat latch, its cheap and easy to remove/replace when not in use.

I can't speak on the sargent seat for a passenger. I have a sargent for the CBR1k but I don't use much since the VFR tours better. The sargent confines your seating position on the CBR and keeps me from moving about as easy as I'd like. Possibly more use would fix/break it in?

[adg44]

Ok, not to beat a dead horse, but my Sargent seat showed up at my house last week, and I had the same problems being described here with the initial fit.

What I found that worked for me is, on the bottom of the seat in the center, there are four black round rubber spacers (for lack of a better term), I temporarily removed these, and got the seat fully in place and latched for the first time, so it confirmed for me where the snag was, the brand new, uncompressed rubber spacers were not sliding forward when they made contact with the bar they rest on, the fresh rubber was just grabbing too much. I put a dab of water (could have used soapy water etc), but put a drop on each of the spacers, and the seat scooted all the way up and locked into place, no dremeling, cutting etc. as I really did not want to start guessing what might work best, but this worked great. Bike is an '06 btw.

Cheers

Great info! Thanks for sharing. After a few times of taking on and off the seat, it has gotten easier to install. I will try putting some coating over those rubber spacers and seeing if it helps.

[Alaskan]

I had a Sargent and didn't like the (lack of) support. I wanted to buy a Corbin, but my shop advised me to spend another 100 dollars and get a custom seat. Well, it turned out to be another 150 dollars, but it was worth it!

[kaldek]

My GOD people, I just read this thread and everyone is concerned about the "gaps in the plastic you can see from the side of the bike".

You guys do realise these are the HELMET LOCK holes, right? You're supposed to slip the D-ring of your helmet over the metal hook under the seat (on the subframe) and then you lock the seat down.

The design is actually a bit wrong because most helmets can't reach the hook, but to overcome this you carry around a couple of 13mm or 14mm spanners which are open-ended on one end and and closed-ended on the other. You slip the closed-end through the helmet D-ring and hook the closed end over the hook under the seat. Note the black tape around the spanner which stops it from rubbing on the paintwork.

[Rich]

My GOD people, I just read this thread and everyone is concerned about the "gaps in the plastic you can see from the side of the bike".

You guys do realise these are the HELMET LOCK holes, right? You're supposed to slip the D-ring of your helmet over the metal hook under the seat (on the subframe) and then you lock the seat down.

The design is actually a bit wrong because most helmets can't reach the hook, but to overcome this you carry around a couple of 13mm or 14mm spanners which are open-ended on one end and and closed-ended on the other. You slip the closed-end through the helmet D-ring and hook the closed end over the hook under the seat. Note the black tape around the spanner which stops it from rubbing on the paintwork.

IMG_20130926_1220591.jpg

What a dumb idea for a helmet lock. Who wants to take their seat off everytime they lock up their helmet?

[CornerCarver]

My GOD people, I just read this thread and everyone is concerned about the "gaps in the plastic you can see from the side of the bike".

You guys do realise these are the HELMET LOCK holes, right? You're supposed to slip the D-ring of your helmet over the metal hook under the seat (on the subframe) and then you lock the seat down.

The design is actually a bit wrong because most helmets can't reach the hook, but to overcome this you carry around a couple of 13mm or 14mm spanners which are open-ended on one end and and closed-ended on the other. You slip the closed-end through the helmet D-ring and hook the closed end over the hook under the seat. Note the black tape around the spanner which stops it from rubbing on the paintwork.

IMG_20130926_1220591.jpg

What a dumb idea for a helmet lock. Who wants to take their seat off everytime they lock up their helmet?

and yet it allows you the option of locking 2 helmets (one on each side) unlike the smart helmet locks where you insert the key to unlock your seat and then try to finagle the helmet so that it is not resting on the chain.

[adg44]

Ended up selling the bike. Seat is now for sale, only 1,000 miles on it. If anyone is interested, send me a PM.

[kaldek]

Ended up selling the bike. Seat is now for sale, only 1,000 miles on it. If anyone is interested, send me a PM.

Now that's an excessive reaction to seat fitment.

[adg44]

Ended up selling the bike. Seat is now for sale, only 1,000 miles on it. If anyone is interested, send me a PM.

Now that's an excessive reaction to seat fitment.

Haha - wasn't because of the seat! It ended up fitting fine after it was installed a few times and started to format to the bike.

[RobF]

Well, I was feeling pretty low that I couldn't properly install my new Sargent seat -- which is not unlike the feeling I might have if I purchased a set of floormats for my car, but was too poor a mechanic to properly install them. Then I found this thread. I still have the seat problem I started with, but at least my pride isn't quite so wounded. When I write that I am unable to properly install the new seat, I mean specifically:

a) there is a suspicious gap between the front of the seat and the tank

b) the rear of the new seat does not successfully engage the bike's latching mechanism

I guess I can just start filing and grinding various bumps and protuberances on the seat base. Still, it seems pretty odd that I would need to do this to a $400 seat for a ten-year-old bike from a manufacturer with reputation for quality. It seems unlikely that Sargent's dimensions would be out of spec, but maybe.

Here is the gap:

...which is not a big deal, but is a bit suspicious and suggests the seat is not coming forward far enough.

Here is the seat bed from which I have removed an FZ1 Fuzeblock in order to assure myself I don't have anything obstructing the proper installation of the seat:

Here is an almost indecipherable photograph taken by lifting the rear edge of the seat and shining a flashlight underneath:

What it is intended to show is that the the little U-shaped tongue extending downward from the Sargent seat base is engaging at the very rear-most edge of the VFR's latch slot. This is additional evidence that the seat is stuck too far back. Further, it explains why Monk had some success earlier in this thread grinding away the front bit of spacer from the inside of that U-shaped tongue, since that is likely where the VFR's latch aligns.

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/gallery/image/37256-dsc00056jpg/

Note: The tip of the wooden pointer in Monk's photo (link) points to the rear-most spacer inside the tongue, but what has actually been ground away is the *opposing* spacer on the front-most inside edge of the tongue.

Lastly, here is a photo of the Sargent's right-side center hook:

Note the hump on the inside edge of the hook.

Either I'm doing something wrong, or the Sargent's dimensional specs for the 6th gen VFR's seat fitment are off by 1/2" to 3/4". The fact that there are so many VFR owners completely happy with their Sargent seats suggest the first explanation. The fact that there are VFRD members who need to grind away bits of their new Sargent seats before they fit suggest there might be some merit to the second explanation.

[rhoderage]

Comparison shot of my Corbin... same gap at the side, though mine hugs the tank nicely. It also takes the correct 'alignment' to latch/lock into place - very easy to do, and I expect minor alignment variances with aftermarket parts so not something I've ever worried about. Love the quality and comfort, though it is a heavy bugger by comparison to stock/Sargeant.

[Conedodger]

My bike is in storage for the winter right now, so I can't verify this, but I think I removed some of the rubber bumpers from the bottom of the seat to get it to latch.

[RobF]

My bike is in storage for the winter right now, so I can't verify this, but I think I removed some of the rubber bumpers from the bottom of the seat to get it to latch.

Ok, not to beat a dead horse, but my Sargent seat showed up at my house last week, and I had the same problems being described here with the initial fit.

What I found that worked for me is, on the bottom of the seat in the center, there are four black round rubber spacers (for lack of a better term), I temporarily removed these, and got the seat fully in place and latched for the first time, so it confirmed for me where the snag was, the brand new, uncompressed rubber spacers were not sliding forward when they made contact with the bar they rest on, the fresh rubber was just grabbing too much. I put a dab of water (could have used soapy water etc), but put a drop on each of the spacers, and the seat scooted all the way up and locked into place, no dremeling, cutting etc. as I really did not want to start guessing what might work best, but this worked great. Bike is an '06 btw.

Conedodger got me thinking about this as a vertical fitment issue instead of as a purely horizontal issue as I had been. L8Apex had the same idea, but I missed it the first time through this thread.

Prompted by their suggestions, here is what I think is happening with some Sargent seats and 6th Gens...

There are four rubber feet (A) under the center section of the Sargent. These are likely a bit too thick and grabby. Possibly the Sargent folks were trying to anticipate eventual wear and compression. Because the feet are too thick, they elevate the center of the seat too much with the result that the Sargent's center latch hooks can snag the bike at their lowest plateau (B), but then get stuck against the edge of the secondary locking plateau (C ). This gives the seat a bit of high-center camber which tilts the rear edge of the seat cowl (if attached) down into the tail plastic of the bike. Also, the stuck latch edge (C ) keeps the seat from sliding forward that last 3/4 of an inch. This leaves the latch loop (D) at the rear of the seat too far rearward to properly align with the VFR's latch.

In the end, I used a dremel sanding bit to remove about 1/8" of rubber from each of the four center feet (A). After that adjustment, the seat moved into place with no more than the usual bit of finagling required of even the stock seat. Given the small amount of rubber removed, folks might be inclined to conclude that the unaltered seat could just be settled with simply a firm hand. I will say that before I made the fix described, I rode the bike several hundred miles with the rear unlatched. My riding weight and the forward momentum of normal braking during the trip was not enough to settle the seat sufficiently for the latch to engage. That makes me doubt this could have been solved by just pushing more resolutely.