Why Dont Motorcycle Cops Wear Gear

[SA2360]

Here is an interesting link to US Dept of Transportation on planning/establishing/implementing law enforcement motorcycle patrol units including a piece on selective gear and clothing.

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/People/injury/ped...03/planning.htm

A good site for additional information and forums on similiar topics:

http://www.motorcops.com/

From my perspective, all police agencies, like most businesses, have standards and policies regarding dress code, gear, etc. In departments where motorized units are utilized, their policy dictates the standard or minimum requirements for the bike, the basic and yearly training requirements for their motor officers as well as the standard or minimum gear they are required to utilize. As most departments, their uniform decision will require a standardized cross-the board uniform. You can imagine what the motor unit would look like if everyone dressed according to their own comfort levels. Basically the uniform has to be functional and non restrictive for duty applications as well as providing protection. From agency to agency, country to country, the types of motors utilized varies greatly as do the gear the officers wear. Uniforms simply comes down to risk management decisions (what is functional, what doesn't hinder their ability to do their job effectively and provides safety) and I'm sure a bit of tradition comes into play as well. What I have noticed is the fact that most non-US motor police units wear more high visibility gear along with better overall safety gear (jackets, pants, boots, gloves) and full faced helmets.

The best resource to answer the topic is to do what some of you had already done......talk to a motor officer and get their perspective....who better to answer the question but the person who rides for a living.

[chewa]

Over this side of the pond they wear full leather trousers with High Viz jackets and full or flip front helmets (genrally ARAIs or BMW system)

They ride ST 1100's or ST1300's (although the speed on those has been restricted in some forces due to a frame cracking resulting in the death of the officer), or BMW's .

'course, they don't carry guns over here so the glove issue doesn't arise.

[Baileyrock]

Yeah, my sense from other civilized parts of the world is they wear flip-up helmets and proper jackets. Our boys are riding better bikes, though. Lots of BMWs and STs. Still some Kawi police models. I don't know if any large departments still ride Harleys, even though word is Harley gives them the bikes for free.

In the Daytona, Fl area I only see Harleys so far, but I expected that. However, I talked with a officer a few years ago and he informed me that they do not get the bike for free but the police department rents them for $1/year each. After a year or two the bikes go back to the dealership.

TN is all HD's from what I see, Troopers & Metro Nashville.

All the old timers want to keep the HD's and all the newer Raiders(bike cops) want better bikes. Local HD dealers either offer free bikes or free Maint. to the Police Depts. and no other bike seller is willing to match that. :blink:

not much gear here on them, but they do wear knee high boots. :unsure:

[SA2360]

how do you expect them to wear heavy bulky gear and still be able to draw and quickly shoot a fleeing Perp??? its how you know im packing while riding

Found a picture of fixer out on a nice Sunday ride with Mrs. fixer...ATGATT = All The GUNS All The Time :lol:

[Flightar]

Well my department uses Harleys and they do so because of a very favorable lease and maintenance plan. The gear issue is simply this...Officers in uniform are instantly recognizable as officers. The public can easily see the face of the officer with a half helmet and issuing orders is clearer as is the hearing of the officer (no helmet if the way). Also MOST agencies like the high boots and other calvary derived elements of the motorcycle officer uniform. As for gloves all of our motor officers wear gloves but they are very tight to accomidate writing and shooting...most likely would do little to nothing in a crash BTW.

Saftey does take a back seat to image in this case.

[Trace]

Perhaps the better question to ask is, with all the attendant problems of ATGATT vs. shooting guns vs. bulletproof gear vs. hot climates vs. "official looking, CHP-style" tradition ........why have motorcycle cops at all? Other than the purely ceremonial function of escorting funerals and VIP motorcades, their true law enforcement work is from a bygone era, just as cops walking a beat in a city is also ancient history. Cops are now in cars, with tons of electronic stuff (IT and communication) and support stuff (shotguns and all the stuff in their trunks) and the ability to sequester and transport suspects.....which means that a motocop is operating without all the stuff a "normal" cop has.

Why endanger an obsolete motocop with ceremonial work?

[Guest]

Perhaps the better question to ask is, with all the attendant problems of ATGATT vs. shooting guns vs. bulletproof gear vs. hot climates vs. "official looking, CHP-style" tradition ........why have motorcycle cops at all? Other than the purely ceremonial function of escorting funerals and VIP motorcades, their true law enforcement work is from a bygone era, just as cops walking a beat in a city is also ancient history. Cops are now in cars, with tons of electronic stuff (IT and communication) and support stuff (shotguns and all the stuff in their trunks) and the ability to sequester and transport suspects.....which means that a motocop is operating without all the stuff a "normal" cop has.

Why endanger an obsolete motocop with ceremonial work?

Same reason that we use bikes to commute, the ease of getting through traffic.

[AvalonRacing]

Perhaps the better question to ask is, with all the attendant problems of ATGATT vs. shooting guns vs. bulletproof gear vs. hot climates vs. "official looking, CHP-style" tradition ........why have motorcycle cops at all? Other than the purely ceremonial function of escorting funerals and VIP motorcades, their true law enforcement work is from a bygone era, just as cops walking a beat in a city is also ancient history. Cops are now in cars, with tons of electronic stuff (IT and communication) and support stuff (shotguns and all the stuff in their trunks) and the ability to sequester and transport suspects.....which means that a motocop is operating without all the stuff a "normal" cop has.

Why endanger an obsolete motocop with ceremonial work?

Same reason that we use bikes to commute, the ease of getting through traffic.

In that case maybe they should be on Super Motos

[jstanwood]

Perhaps the better question to ask is, with all the attendant problems of ATGATT vs. shooting guns vs. bulletproof gear vs. hot climates vs. "official looking, CHP-style" tradition ........why have motorcycle cops at all? Other than the purely ceremonial function of escorting funerals and VIP motorcades, their true law enforcement work is from a bygone era, just as cops walking a beat in a city is also ancient history. Cops are now in cars, with tons of electronic stuff (IT and communication) and support stuff (shotguns and all the stuff in their trunks) and the ability to sequester and transport suspects.....which means that a motocop is operating without all the stuff a "normal" cop has.

Why endanger an obsolete motocop with ceremonial work?

:blink: While I do like the traditional aspect, I have to agree with you. As a matter of fact, the last time I was in a funeral procession with motorcycle escorts, they were not even police officers. They were "safety officers". (Screen-printed "badges" as opposed to real patches were the give-away.) Nevertheless, they still wore the tall boots, weird skin-tight pants, and short-sleeve shirts. :o Maybe they had dates at the Blue Oyster Bar* later. :unsure:

The excuse of not being recognizable while wearing protective gear is BS, along with the other excuses Skuuter heard. I'm sure Aerostitch would be happy to get material in the right colors and sew patches on the suit. Flip-up helmets would be fine, too.

*Not sure if I got the movie reference right or not.

[Dutchy]

Dutch m/c cops are ATGATT

for times when they dump their bike in the bush....

Or just to look cool B)

But the new and improved kit looks like

[Baileyrock]

Dutch m/c cops are ATGATT

for times when they dump their bike in the bush....

Looks to be a Honda at least! :unsure:

[Guest]

I ride for my Department. We are issued Boots, Leather jacket, Half Helmet. We are required to wear a helmet, leather gloves, leather boots and eye protection. In the summer, i usually ride in shirt with the vest on it is very hot, even when you are moving. As far as riding with all the gear all the time, i do on my 02 VFR. however, with a vest, duty belt, helmet glasses, gloves etc some personal safety has to be sacifriced for mobility. any traffic stop can end up in a gunfight, i need to be prepared. As far as being outdated, imagine trying to get to a crash with a patrol car, with 1 or 2 miles of backlog and people who don't use their rearview mirrors and don't hear a siren. I can't imagine using a flip-up helmet, glare and possibly having to flip up the helmet to fire a round, not too mention with a full helmet your peripheral vision is cut way down. By the way, we ride Harleys, our Department must use american made vehicles. I have given significant thought concerning using a VFR. There is a lack of space for a radio in the dash, additionally, finding space on the bars for all the accessories would be tough. Trust me, if I could ride a VFR, i would. It is so much more stable at speed.

[skuuter]

I ride for my Department. We are issued Boots, Leather jacket, Half Helmet. We are required to wear a helmet, leather gloves, leather boots and eye protection. In the summer, i usually ride in shirt with the vest on it is very hot, even when you are moving. As far as riding with all the gear all the time, i do on my 02 VFR. however, with a vest, duty belt, helmet glasses, gloves etc some personal safety has to be sacifriced for mobility. any traffic stop can end up in a gunfight, i need to be prepared. As far as being outdated, imagine trying to get to a crash with a patrol car, with 1 or 2 miles of backlog and people who don't use their rearview mirrors and don't hear a siren. I can't imagine using a flip-up helmet, glare and possibly having to flip up the helmet to fire a round, not too mention with a full helmet your peripheral vision is cut way down. By the way, we ride Harleys, our Department must use american made vehicles. I have given significant thought concerning using a VFR. There is a lack of space for a radio in the dash, additionally, finding space on the bars for all the accessories would be tough. Trust me, if I could ride a VFR, i would. It is so much more stable at speed.

................ :thumbsup:

[jstanwood]

<snip> Trust me, if I could ride a VFR, i would. It is so much more stable at speed.

Like this?

[SA2360]

Perhaps the better question to ask is, with all the attendant problems of ATGATT vs. shooting guns vs. bulletproof gear vs. hot climates vs. "official looking, CHP-style" tradition ........why have motorcycle cops at all? Other than the purely ceremonial function of escorting funerals and VIP motorcades, their true law enforcement work is from a bygone era, just as cops walking a beat in a city is also ancient history. Cops are now in cars, with tons of electronic stuff (IT and communication) and support stuff (shotguns and all the stuff in their trunks) and the ability to sequester and transport suspects.....which means that a motocop is operating without all the stuff a "normal" cop has.

Why endanger an obsolete motocop with ceremonial work?

Due to the drawbacks of exposure to the weather, motorcycle patrols are more common in temperate urban areas with heavy traffic or on high-speed highways. The maneuverability of the motorcycle on crowded streets offer advantages not provided by larger, more traditional police vehicles.

The motor's relatively small size allows it to get to accident scenes more quickly when incidents like traffic accidents slow down access by four-wheel vehicles. They also consume less fuel than the larger police cars, which saves costs for the police departments that use them.

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Police_motorcycle

[Dutchy]

Dutch m/c cops are ATGATT

for times when they dump their bike in the bush....

Looks to be a Honda at least! :unsure:

Yep, it is a Pan European (or ST13 in murrican)

[Dutchy]

just as cops walking a beat in a city is also ancient history. Cops are now in cars, with tons of electronic stuff (IT and communication) and support stuff (shotguns and all the stuff in their trunks) and the ability to sequester and transport suspects.....which means that a motocop is operating without all the stuff a "normal" cop has.

:unsure: and not trying to bash ya

I am SO glad to live in a country where police maintains personal contact with the public, so yes patrol on foot and yes on mountainbikes.

Sure they carry a firearm and we do have armed response units if the shit hits the fan.

[Guest]

<snip> Trust me, if I could ride a VFR, i would. It is so much more stable at speed.

Like this?

Yea, something like that.

[Trace]

Same reason that we use bikes to commute, the ease of getting through traffic.

As far as being outdated, imagine trying to get to a crash with a patrol car, with 1 or 2 miles of backlog and people who don't use their rearview mirrors and don't hear a siren.

Due to the drawbacks of exposure to the weather, motorcycle patrols are more common in temperate urban areas with heavy traffic or on high-speed highways. The maneuverability of the motorcycle on crowded streets offer advantages not provided by larger, more traditional police vehicles.

The motor's relatively small size allows it to get to accident scenes more quickly when incidents like traffic accidents slow down access by four-wheel vehicles. They also consume less fuel than the larger police cars, which saves costs for the police departments that use them.

These three similar responses are generally true I'm sure, but I think it's a weak defense of the need for motocops. The way I see it 1) as a practical matter I'd venture to say that 98.5% of all 911 calls (in the US) are responded to by cops in cars. Most jurisdictions don't have motocops (or just a very few) and do their LEO work without them. I'd venture to say that the very next time any of us sees a wreck or some crime scene, it will be swarmed with "black & whites" and NOT with a single moto in sight. And 2) a cop car with lights and sirens gets through traffic pretty quick.....and MUCH safer for the officer who is coming up on panicked drivers who are darting every which-a-way to make room for emergency responders...particularly the ones that are big and painted red. The poor motocop is at high risk in this environment.....the fireman in his behemoth much safer, as is the cop in the Crown Vic.

I'm not against the concept of motocops (just like I'm not against beat-walking cops in some places like downtown areas or horsie-mounted cops in Washington DC for crowd control--VERY effective!) but perhaps they SHOULD be only for ceremonial functions, when they're safer traveling in a group in a controlled or controlling environment. Or....they should wear full gear. But--to return to the original point of this thread--half-helmets, slacks, short sleeves and "finger gloves" is simply crazy for a guy who lives on a moto day and night. That sort of thing is simply a throwback to a different era, when lead was in paint, seatbelts didn't exist, Little League batters didn't wear helmets (just their caps!), smoking was permitted in airplanes....and people didn't kill cops during a simple traffic stop.

Maybe Jon28 will chime in here...since he can speak with authority and experience on this matter.

[Bent]

Same reason that we use bikes to commute, the ease of getting through traffic.

As far as being outdated, imagine trying to get to a crash with a patrol car, with 1 or 2 miles of backlog and people who don't use their rearview mirrors and don't hear a siren.

Due to the drawbacks of exposure to the weather, motorcycle patrols are more common in temperate urban areas with heavy traffic or on high-speed highways. The maneuverability of the motorcycle on crowded streets offer advantages not provided by larger, more traditional police vehicles.

The motor's relatively small size allows it to get to accident scenes more quickly when incidents like traffic accidents slow down access by four-wheel vehicles. They also consume less fuel than the larger police cars, which saves costs for the police departments that use them.

These three similar responses are generally true I'm sure, but I think it's a weak defense of the need for motocops. The way I see it 1) as a practical matter I'd venture to say that 98.5% of all 911 calls (in the US) are responded to by cops in cars. Most jurisdictions don't have motocops (or just a very few) and do their LEO work without them. I'd venture to say that the very next time any of us sees a wreck or some crime scene, it will be swarmed with "black & whites" and NOT with a single moto in sight. And 2) a cop car with lights and sirens gets through traffic pretty quick.....and MUCH safer for the officer who is coming up on panicked drivers who are darting every which-a-way to make room for emergency responders...particularly the ones that are big and painted red. The poor motocop is at high risk in this environment.....the fireman in his behemoth much safer, as is the cop in the Crown Vic.

I'm not against the concept of motocops (just like I'm not against beat-walking cops in some places like downtown areas or horsie-mounted cops in Washington DC for crowd control--VERY effective!) but perhaps they SHOULD be only for ceremonial functions, when they're safer traveling in a group in a controlled or controlling environment. Or....they should wear full gear. But--to return to the original point of this thread--half-helmets, slacks, short sleeves and "finger gloves" is simply crazy for a guy who lives on a moto day and night. That sort of thing is simply a throwback to a different era, when lead was in paint, seatbelts didn't exist, Little League batters didn't wear helmets (just their caps!), smoking was permitted in airplanes....and people didn't kill cops during a simple traffic stop.

Maybe Jon28 will chime in here...since he can speak with authority and experience on this matter.

:blink: Word for word.

Not gonna go further on this thread...nope, not gonna do it.... :unsure:

[skuuter]

Same reason that we use bikes to commute, the ease of getting through traffic.

As far as being outdated, imagine trying to get to a crash with a patrol car, with 1 or 2 miles of backlog and people who don't use their rearview mirrors and don't hear a siren.

Due to the drawbacks of exposure to the weather, motorcycle patrols are more common in temperate urban areas with heavy traffic or on high-speed highways. The maneuverability of the motorcycle on crowded streets offer advantages not provided by larger, more traditional police vehicles.

The motor's relatively small size allows it to get to accident scenes more quickly when incidents like traffic accidents slow down access by four-wheel vehicles. They also consume less fuel than the larger police cars, which saves costs for the police departments that use them.

These three similar responses are generally true I'm sure, but I think it's a weak defense of the need for motocops. The way I see it 1) as a practical matter I'd venture to say that 98.5% of all 911 calls (in the US) are responded to by cops in cars. Most jurisdictions don't have motocops (or just a very few) and do their LEO work without them. I'd venture to say that the very next time any of us sees a wreck or some crime scene, it will be swarmed with "black & whites" and NOT with a single moto in sight. And 2) a cop car with lights and sirens gets through traffic pretty quick.....and MUCH safer for the officer who is coming up on panicked drivers who are darting every which-a-way to make room for emergency responders...particularly the ones that are big and painted red. The poor motocop is at high risk in this environment.....the fireman in his behemoth much safer, as is the cop in the Crown Vic.

I'm not against the concept of motocops (just like I'm not against beat-walking cops in some places like downtown areas or horsie-mounted cops in Washington DC for crowd control--VERY effective!) but perhaps they SHOULD be only for ceremonial functions, when they're safer traveling in a group in a controlled or controlling environment. Or....they should wear full gear. But--to return to the original point of this thread--half-helmets, slacks, short sleeves and "finger gloves" is simply crazy for a guy who lives on a moto day and night. That sort of thing is simply a throwback to a different era, when lead was in paint, seatbelts didn't exist, Little League batters didn't wear helmets (just their caps!), smoking was permitted in airplanes....and people didn't kill cops during a simple traffic stop.

Maybe Jon28 will chime in here...since he can speak with authority and experience on this matter.

Word for word.

Not gonna go further on this thread...nope, not gonna do it.... :goofy:

Go ahead "Mr. I've never met a cop I liked"......contribute a little................ :goofy:

[Guest]

Same reason that we use bikes to commute, the ease of getting through traffic.

As far as being outdated, imagine trying to get to a crash with a patrol car, with 1 or 2 miles of backlog and people who don't use their rearview mirrors and don't hear a siren.

Due to the drawbacks of exposure to the weather, motorcycle patrols are more common in temperate urban areas with heavy traffic or on high-speed highways. The maneuverability of the motorcycle on crowded streets offer advantages not provided by larger, more traditional police vehicles.

The motor's relatively small size allows it to get to accident scenes more quickly when incidents like traffic accidents slow down access by four-wheel vehicles. They also consume less fuel than the larger police cars, which saves costs for the police departments that use them.

These three similar responses are generally true I'm sure, but I think it's a weak defense of the need for motocops. The way I see it 1) as a practical matter I'd venture to say that 98.5% of all 911 calls (in the US) are responded to by cops in cars. Most jurisdictions don't have motocops (or just a very few) and do their LEO work without them. I'd venture to say that the very next time any of us sees a wreck or some crime scene, it will be swarmed with "black & whites" and NOT with a single moto in sight. And 2) a cop car with lights and sirens gets through traffic pretty quick.....and MUCH safer for the officer who is coming up on panicked drivers who are darting every which-a-way to make room for emergency responders...particularly the ones that are big and painted red. The poor motocop is at high risk in this environment.....the fireman in his behemoth much safer, as is the cop in the Crown Vic.

I'm not against the concept of motocops (just like I'm not against beat-walking cops in some places like downtown areas or horsie-mounted cops in Washington DC for crowd control--VERY effective!) but perhaps they SHOULD be only for ceremonial functions, when they're safer traveling in a group in a controlled or controlling environment. Or....they should wear full gear. But--to return to the original point of this thread--half-helmets, slacks, short sleeves and "finger gloves" is simply crazy for a guy who lives on a moto day and night. That sort of thing is simply a throwback to a different era, when lead was in paint, seatbelts didn't exist, Little League batters didn't wear helmets (just their caps!), smoking was permitted in airplanes....and people didn't kill cops during a simple traffic stop.

Maybe Jon28 will chime in here...since he can speak with authority and experience on this matter.

Word for word.

Not gonna go further on this thread...nope, not gonna do it.... :goofy:

Dwight "Spike" Helmick, was the head of the CHP for many, many years and had 36 years as a Motor Officer, and was an acquaintance of mine. He often spoke whistfully about the "good ole days", cloth frame caps (These semi Nazi hats also carried with them a 50% death rate in officer crashes), leather Jackets and Daner Boots (Those are THE GUYS that make cop boots) topped off by a pair of Ray Ban Aviators). They used to love having the old night stick cross frame under the tractor look a like, three spring seat and a sap in the top of your boots. Talk about intimidating. Safety, that was for mere mortals. By the way CA, WA and several other states have official training tracks and I have been on both the CA and WA tracks. The WA track is waaay cooool. Three miles with a 1/4 mile skid pad, watered down for even more fun! Routine pursuit training hits 130+. As for the motor officer in WA, they have to lay the bike down at 90 or better to pass the course. They go through a set of tires every three days on the cars!

As for ATGATT, nothing beats Germany. On the Autobahn they have these 6'6" Tutonic Titans in full one pice green leathers, full face helmets, Glock or H&Ks strapped to the waists and just scare the hell out of you just mmeekly driving by at 55 KM! They dwarf their BMW's making them look like pit bikes! :goofy:

[tharkun]

Funny, the differing views across the country on motor scouts & gear, and the purpose of the motorcycle mounted LEO. Interesting topic...too bad we don't have more LEOs on the board who ride/did ride as a part of the job...

Lot of LEOs do buy their own stuff when they can afford it , and/or get away with it. But a lot don't. I know I did...cause that was the only way could get some of it.

As to gear when I rode, since I knew and had seen what would happen when I hit/got hit, I wore a lot of stuff others did not when I did my motor scout thing for about 11 years on Goldwings....(best bike for the work I ever road & I tried a few of 'em). The boots I wore were every bit as protective of anything I wear now...based on the comparative technology from then to now. I wore my ballistic vest and contrary to some comments previously expressed here, and after seeing results in the ER, body armor vests are highly impact protective for the chest area, more so than anything on market today...(however are too bulky for street/racing use and very hot...) except for maybe full GP level chest protectors in suits. I wore full leather gloves that were fairly close to what we wear now (similar to most sport/race gloves but w/o the impact plastic guards or ballistic stuff)..a 3/4 open face helmet plus the LE gear. Realistically, I had more gear on than 90% of the hard core ATGATT people riding then.

I watched Superbikes on SPEED the other night and they showed the Instructors from a state (can't remember which one) LEO motorscout school doing high speed stuff on bikes with what looked to be minimal gear...something I would never do now...and would have been leary of then.

[theoxmole]

Perhaps the better question to ask is, with all the attendant problems of ATGATT vs. shooting guns vs. bulletproof gear vs. hot climates vs. "official looking, CHP-style" tradition ........why have motorcycle cops at all? Other than the purely ceremonial function of escorting funerals and VIP motorcades, their true law enforcement work is from a bygone era, just as cops walking a beat in a city is also ancient history. Cops are now in cars, with tons of electronic stuff (IT and communication) and support stuff (shotguns and all the stuff in their trunks) and the ability to sequester and transport suspects.....which means that a motocop is operating without all the stuff a "normal" cop has.

Why endanger an obsolete motocop with ceremonial work?

Funny you asked but our paper just did an article on our State Highway Patrol about how they've just bought a bunch of motorcycles. They cited fuel consumption related to gas prices (as opposed to their standard issue cars and Suburbans), maintenance and maneuvarbility. Do I agree? Yes. With those points. If they bought Hondas. They're getting a bunch of Harleys. I agree with you about the ceremonial aspect. Why use them at all? Besides, they're a little harder to spot in the median. :goofy:

I looked at it this way. Their purpose is kind of ridiculous but if it helps to raise the public's awareness of bikes . . . :thumbsup: And we can ALL outrun a Harley! :lol:

And Toledo uses horse mounted officers for crowd control at the baseball games and concerts downtown. And they wear helmets, gloves and boots. . . same as the bike cops. Their top speed is probably 2.7 mph if you leave the stadium with a beer. Get the bike cops some gear and MAKE them wear it as standard issue.

[vfrqqq]

I just thought this sentence from http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/People/injury/ped...03/planning.htm under the Motorcycle Patrol Officer Riding Equipment is hilarious

And I quote...

"Many motorcycle patrol units also require that officers wear long sleeve shirts year round. (This is the kicker) The sleeves offer some protection in the event of a crash or fall; and also offer protection from the sun."

What is that!?! Like, Ooooo, not ONLY are you offered SOME protection in the event of a fall, but it conveniently offers a sensible amount of sun protection. You might as well add that it provides adequate ventilation at speed so as not to leave officers with pit stains, or perhaps that it improves public relations by making the officer appear more astute and professional. That's an excuse I would've given my mother to justify not wearing leather jacket when I first started riding at 17!!! That's about the stupidest thing I've ever read.