Member Contributer VFRMAN Posted August 4, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 4, 2021 I think I need new coils and maybe leads and plug caps, were is the best/cheapest place to get them? I presume the aftermarket has a solution, oem would be very expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Cogswell Posted August 5, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 5, 2021 There are some threads here if you search on changing to coil on plug setup. Reduces some clutter and weight while you're at it. IIRC a GSXR 750 coil was the unit of choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer ducnut Posted August 5, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 5, 2021 You’re best to take your coils and leads to a qualified shop who know how to test them, rather than throw parts at the bike in hopes of fixing whatever is causing you to question those components. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Tirso Posted August 5, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 5, 2021 IF after troubleshooting (Section 17-3 Service Manual ) and your coils are really done, here is another vote for coil on plugs (COP) On my 5th gen, I used Gixxer COP's and CBR COP wiring harness. Gixxer COP 06-07 GSXR600/GSXR750 Denso 129700-4800 CBR COP Harness 08-16 CBR1000RR I swapped the CBR plugs to black. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Set-4-CBR-...l-Connectors-Honda-Suzuki-Yamaha/221427973335 This post includes video: https://www.vfrdiscussion.com/index.php?/forums/topic/67684-5th-gen-coil-on-plug-setup/ This from adkfinns refresh, 2nd post down https://www.vfrdiscussion.com/index.php?/forums/topic/87690-adkfinns-5th-gen-20yr-refresh/page/2/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFRMAN Posted August 5, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 5, 2021 Thanks, so is Coil on plug set up like on the 6th gens a better job? Not sure where I could take coils here to get tested, buying new ones might just be cheaper anyway. been looking at these coils in the UK, not sure what's different between the 2. Hendler Ignition Coils Honda VFR800 Fi (RC46) 2001 - Motorcycle Products Ltd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Cogswell Posted August 5, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Saoirse said: Thanks, so is Coil on plug set up like on the 6th gens a better job? Not sure where I could take coils here to get tested, buying new ones might just be cheaper anyway. been looking at these coils in the UK, not sure what's different between the 2. Hendler Ignition Coils Honda VFR800 Fi (RC46) 2001 - Motorcycle Products Ltd. COP's are more compact and don't have HT leads that can degrade. Sixth gen coil packs do not fit your 5th gen and are not compatible with the ECU. Honestly, for a 23 year old machine I'd suspect the HT leads before the coils. As suggested I'd go with the troubleshooting routine above before purchasing any parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer ducnut Posted August 5, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 5, 2021 2 hours ago, Saoirse said: Not sure where I could take coils here to get tested, buying new ones might just be cheaper anyway. Where I used to work, we charged $6/each to test them. Any quality shop, motorcycle or automotive, can do them. Start by searching for the old-school guy who’s been working on stuff since the Lucas days. They’re usually the guys who still diagnose with real mechanic’s tools, before doing anything else. My last coil customer had convinced himself he had a bad coil and wanted me to ship a $174 coil to him. Over the phone, I convinced him to drive the ~1hr to the shop with both his coils, so we could test them, as we had doubts either were bad. When he came to the counter, he said he’d still take a coil for a spare. 🤦♂️ Our old-school tech (~50yrs turning wrenches) takes the customer back and demonstrates the testing process, where both coils jumped 1/2” gaps, for ~5 minutes. Obviously, the coils are good. The tech, knowing the specific bike, already knew the coils would be good, because the igniter is a known issue with that model bike. After quoting the customer $392 for an igniter, I asked if he still wanted to unnecessarily spend $174 on the spare coil. 😁 Please, get your coils tested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFRMAN Posted August 5, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 5, 2021 I had a guy look at it and he said the coil was shorting to the frame, he tested it with a screwdriver and could see it sparking off the frame when he shaded the area, bike is running just that bit off, like it's not firing cleanly, still going fairly well but I can feel it's not as it should be if that makes sense. I was thinking of smearing some dielectric grease over the coil to stop it shorting to the frame, I will try and find someone who knows how to test the coils. ht leads etc. thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFRMAN Posted August 13, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 13, 2021 Anyone know if it's essential that the coil is attached by the two 6mm bolts, (forward coils at your left and right knee) One of the 6mm well nuts failed and the 'nut' part of it fell down inside the alloy frame somewhere, the coil is held on now by the rear bolt and the bracket it attaches with also clips up to the inside of the side fairing, it's not going to fall off but I suppose I'd rather both bolts were holding it on, I swapped that coil for a second hand one but I can tell no difference, bike still seems to be running slightly bad, no one here has a clue about testing coils. I'm at a loss how to fix it, a small fault is harder to fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer raYzerman Posted August 14, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 14, 2021 You want to keep the coil from slopping around..... those rubber well nuts are simple enough to replace, or go to your local Home Depot/Lowe's/Ace.. if you can't find a 6mm right away, use a 1/4-20 for the time being...... Have you checked the resistors at the plug adapter end of things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFRMAN Posted August 14, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 14, 2021 No I haven't found anyone to check the coils, do you mean to fit a nut inside the rubber well nut I have? the little inside threaded part fell down inside the frame. I might try and see if a 6mm nut will fit inside it. I need to find someone to check to check the coils/plug leads, really frustrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFRMAN Posted August 16, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 16, 2021 I've been advised to fit new plug caps and to change all 4, guy reckons it's the most likely cause of the poor running, anyone know a good place to get them from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Cogswell Posted August 17, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 17, 2021 7 hours ago, VFRMAN said: I've been advised to fit new plug caps and to change all 4, guy reckons it's the most likely cause of the poor running, anyone know a good place to get them from? Do you mean this? Or this? If the latter, before doing that you might try putting some di-electric grease on the plug insulator and see if that quells the arcing to ground that may be bypassing the plug. Plug wires that are nearly a quarter century old do tend to degrade and allow arcing or don't conduct properly - replacing them is probably good preventive maintenance. On the other hand, as discussed above, you can eliminate that point of failure entirely by going to a COP setup. If you want OEM, Partzilla is usually a cost effective place to get them (if they're still available). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFRMAN Posted August 17, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 17, 2021 Thanks yes it's the long rubber plug boots that attach to the plug leads I've been told that need to be replaced, they are around 60 euros each here. 30700-MBG-000 - Parts For Honda Motorcycles - David Silver Spares guy doesn't know for sure if this will cure the problem but he reckons it's the most likely cause, he says if coil was gone the problem would be much worse and he says it's very unlikely to be the plug wire itself, bike mechanics are scarce around here so there's not much else I can do unless I bring the bike a long way to some bigger town. The COP set up would be good but it seems too complicated for me, I just want to get the bike back running as it's supposed to with the least hassle possible. Should I smear the dielectric grease on the outside of the rubber plug boot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Cogswell Posted August 17, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 17, 2021 Ok. The boot's main function is to prevent current from the coil taking the path of least resistance to ground rather than jumping the gap at the spark plug tip. If its degraded it may be less able to prevent that. If you take a tool such as a small screw driver or a stir stick and place some dielectric grease on it, you can apply a thin coating of it on the inside of each boot where it contacts the plug insulator. It can help prevent the current from escaping directly to ground. No need to go crazy with it. A thin coating is sufficient. It may do nothing but it's cheap and if it works you have an inexpensive fix. As for the cost, OEM parts are not cheap and that's a specialty item, so you may just have to go with it. However it seems to be guesswork on the mechanic's part and the issue does not seem to have been positively diagnosed. The only other option would be ebay for a used set, but that may be no better than what you've got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFRMAN Posted August 18, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 18, 2021 Thanks, pity I didn't see your post before I went working at the bike, I fitted a different coil and plug lead and cap to that front left cylinder, I had some dielectric grease so I smeared a light coat on the outside of the plug caps, anyway got her all back together, those damned fairing clips!! anyone know what size they are the ones with the centre push pin? 5 mm?? Bike seems to run better, it was raining this evening so I didn't get a proper run, hoping I've cured the problem, the coil and plug cap I fitted were second hand ones I bought. I might just get 4 new plug caps for her at some stage, maybe next winter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Tirso Posted August 19, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted August 19, 2021 41 minutes ago, VFRMAN said: Thanks, pity I didn't see your post before I went working at the bike, I fitted a different coil and plug lead and cap to that front left cylinder, I had some dielectric grease so I smeared a light coat on the outside of the plug caps, anyway got her all back together, those damned fairing clips!! anyone know what size they are the ones with the centre push pin? 5 mm?? Bike seems to run better, it was raining this evening so I didn't get a proper run, hoping I've cured the problem, the coil and plug cap I fitted were second hand ones I bought. I might just get 4 new plug caps for her at some stage, maybe next winter. Fairing clips?? https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HMZEXSG and well nuts just in case https://www.amazon.com/Rubber-Well-Nuts-M5-8-Length/dp/B0040D2P7E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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