High Beam Causing R/r Issues?

[DVIII]

Bike: 2006, 18K miles, has tan connector meaning new Harness installed by factory.

Story: 5 hour ride on Sunday, on the ride it cut out once on the ride home right before I got on the freeway. No issues the freeway and street ride home.

Tuesday, jump on her to go to work, starts right up, rides fine for 8 minutes till I get to some traffic lights and it shuts off at every traffic light with no throttle input. It also cuts out on rolling stops with no throttle.

I limp home. Park it. Hook it up to the battery charger. Cage it to work.

After reading forums, jumping links all over the place, diagnosing the stator, battery, R/R, pricing out new items, researching diagnostic methods, it's finally time to head home and I dive right into the bike, fairings come off, taking apart connectors and checking connections, checking grounds. I turn off my high beams, hook up my multimeter and start running through the Electrosport flow chart.

Initial simple Stats:

Charged Battery showing 12.7V

13.8V at idle, 14.2-5 at 2500RPM - Everything's normal! WTF

I remembered I switched my high beams off, and I ride with high beams on 100% of the time day or night.

Aha! this yields 13.2V at idle, and never goes above 13.5V at any RPM

To rule out the stator, I checked and it is putting out ~20V at idle from each wire (AC). No, I did not check I at 5000RPM... I should have, I know. But by this time I got tired of it. I will have to do this tomorrow...

My renewed search on High Beams impact didn't turn anything up except ground issues, shorting issues, and bad connections.

I believe I ruled all those out. So now I am left wondering if the R/R (which looks fine, no burnt connectors, no melted wires) is bad, and only bad when I use my high beams....???

All connections were clean, no melted wires or connecters anywhere.

Anyone got a clue?

I need to run through the Electrosport flow chart again and record the additional figures for testing the output of the stator, but I was getting readings all over the place and got frustrated since some were in spec and some were not.

So I'm here wondering if I am any closer to determining if the R/R is bad....

[gll429]

you need a multimeter to check your voltage while the highbeam is on..

pm sent..

[Bad Boy]

You have not found the smoking gun here. The voltages with the high beams on are not too low and would not cause the bike to stop running.

Determine if the stalling was accompanied by low voltage or is there a different cause. You could install a voltmeter on the bike to determine if the voltages are stable.

Ride it some more

[spud786]

Bike will run fine without a working stator and fully charged battery down to about 10.5 volts(wont start on ten volts but will run), but will not run at all with a flakey battery if the output amperage is unstable, or halts. If you didn't lose the display or clock reset, battery is probably okay, but if you have original battery (that should be suspect). Otherwise , there's a pulse generator coil, which could cause running issues, or fi issues with sensors.

Maybe use the procedure to see if any codes getting generated

fully charge the battery and completely disconnect the low beams and ride for 30 miles or so, if it acts up I say battery or fi issues, ground, or pulse generator coil. But this doesn't sound like typical charge circuit failure. Normally on a charge circuit failure, bike will run fine until a good battery is no longer able to generate any output, down to about 10.5v or lower.

BTW, a fully charged AGM battery that's reading 12.7 volt in a rested state, is on its way out the door.

[DVIII]

Ok, fully charged the battery to 12.9, sat overnight and ended up at 12.6

start the bike, puts out 13.5 at idle and then cuts off after 15 seconds

I hear an audible click, the dash lights back up, and I can restart. This repeats (all on low beam btw) every time.

I'm completely confused, and I am back from suspecting the battery to suspecting the R/R

.......

[Switchblade]

tough one .. any mods ? When did it start doing this, after any work , maintenance ? You could pull the headlight fuse but really dont think that's the problem ..

[Bad Boy]

Ok, fully charged the battery to 12.9, sat overnight and ended up at 12.6

start the bike, puts out 13.5 at idle and then cuts off after 15 seconds

I hear an audible click, the dash lights back up, and I can restart. This repeats (all on low beam btw) every time.

I'm completely confused, and I am back from suspecting the battery to suspecting the R/R

.......

What does the voltage reading at the battery do when it "cuts off"

Audible click? sound like a relay?

What does "the dash lights back up" mean?

Does not sound like R/R

Sounds more like a bad connection or relay.

Bad R/R or stator slowly drains battery over time because of low output. The bike keeps running on the power from the battery for quite awhile.

A sudden drop in power means something has disconnected or switched off.

[DVIII]

Ok, fully charged the battery to 12.9, sat overnight and ended up at 12.6

start the bike, puts out 13.5 at idle and then cuts off after 15 seconds

I hear an audible click, the dash lights back up, and I can restart. This repeats (all on low beam btw) every time.

I'm completely confused, and I am back from suspecting the battery to suspecting the R/R

.......

What does the voltage reading at the battery do when it "cuts off"

Audible click? sound like a relay?

What does "the dash lights back up" mean?

Does not sound like R/R

Sounds more like a bad connection or relay.Bad R/R or stator slowly drains battery over time because of low output. The bike keeps running on the power from the battery for quite awhile.

A sudden drop in power means something has disconnected or switched off.

voltage stays constant and drops from the 13.5 to the 12.6

yes, audible click both on and off

The power to the whole bike quits then comes back on a moment later. Complete loss of electricity

tough one .. any mods ? When did it start doing this, after any work , maintenance ? You could pull the headlight fuse but really dont think that's the problem ..

no flapper or PAIR mod, just pipes and K&N, I disconnected all accy's from the battery. Came about after a long ride into the desert and back... 5 hours, nothing too strenuous... or so I thought...

[spud786]

Ok, fully charged the battery to 12.9, sat overnight and ended up at 12.6

.......

That right there, says you've got a battery that's about to die, you could have other issues. But an agm on a fresh charge should hold over 13 volt for weeks, if its in good shape. when they begin to weaken they might see 13 volt but cant hold it a couple hours after charge, and drop a alittle. as long as no lower than 12.8v , but you've broken the gate of 12.7v and gone below it. You may have another issue, but you have a crapping out battery.

That will also exhibit, the intermittent complete momentary loss of electricity That's how failing agm's behave, your wasting your time till you have a Solid AGM battery in the bike.

I bet money your on the original battery, when agms are at end of life they get really flakey.

[jerritt]

Your first problem is driving with your high beams at night "YOUR BLINDING THE DRIVERS COMING TOWARDS YOU" they can't see and have to look awayfrom the road because your blinding them. To be considerate of others (and for your safety)turn off your high beams at night!!!!

[DVIII]

Ok, fully charged the battery to 12.9, sat overnight and ended up at 12.6

.......

That right there, says you've got a battery that's about to die, you could have other issues. But an agm on a fresh charge should hold over 13 volt for weeks, if its in good shape. when they begin to weaken they might see 13 volt but cant hold it a couple hours after charge, and drop a alittle. as long as no lower than 12.8v , but you've broken the gate of 12.7v and gone below it. You may have another issue, but you have a crapping out battery.

That will also exhibit, the intermittent complete momentary loss of electricity That's how failing agm's behave, your wasting your time till you have a Solid AGM battery in the bike.

I bet money your on the original battery, when agms are at end of life they get really flakey.

Previous seller said he replaced the batter, it is gray and Chinese made. Never seen anything like it before. No Branding. Kind of looks like this with no brand stamped on it:

Dammit, back to the replacing the battery first!!!!

[spud786]

Different type batteries will behave differently, and I don't know what technology your battery has if its been replaced or even if its reliable. Im very familiar with AGM type batteries and their numbers and how they live, and they are really the most hassle free type, unless of course your guinea piggin it with some unknown type and different technlogy.

I can only tell ya this, everything in the VFR Begins with having a quality battery, Preferred VFR battery is the st1300 AGM type, yuasa, or scorpion are proven technologies. Id stick with something that has a known good history.

[DVIII]

Yup, I just ordered the MotoBatt MBTX9U and for the hell of it the ElectroSport ESR438 R/R

Now to sit and wait a week.........

[DVIII]

I think I found my issue!

Now what the hell is this thing called, and how to fix?

The small section of wire looks like a smaller gauge, I think i'll solder in a new thicker guage and try to work the receptacle out of the fuse holder to reuse it.

Other suggestions?

[DVIII]

Do I just replace the fuse holder with this?

http://www.amazon.com/Pico-0969PT-In-Line-Maxi-Holder/dp/B003DFIW1S/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t

[gll429]

trace the burned wire as far back as the melting can be seen. either replace it or cover it with shrink wrap...

cut off the connection block and solder it other wire.

[Bad Boy]

This fuse holder is a common problem and I have replaced it with a high quality automotive fuse holder with 30 amp fuse that looked similar to the one posted. The fried connector next to it looks like it needs replacement too.

Another connector to check is the 3 yellow wire connector between stator and rectifier located under right side fairing above the clutch. I found this works well.

http://www.wiremybike.com/vfr-specific-parts-2000-2001-vfr-parts-stator-hardwire-kit-p-693.html

After putting about 90k miles on my first 6th gen. these were the weak links, when I replaced the bike I did these fixes as preventive maintenance.

[DVIII]

New fuse holder in place, but the elctrosport flow chart indicates I have a bad positive connection, which may be the reason my fuse holder melted.

Should I just get the vfrness and get it over with?

[spud786]

The fuse holder generally melts cause of resistance through that connection itself( that heat build up melts the connector). I have all original wiring and connections well over hundred thousand miles, but I do periodicaly check and prep my connections. mainly measuring continuity through the connector looking for less than .2 ohm and utilizing wd40 for corrosion protection and it doesn't hender conductivity as many have discovered with dielectric grease.. But your connection is now trashed so you'll have to change it, but the rest of the connections are saveable as long as in good shape, but they need to be prepped and checked. That particular wire melt, I think is you charge line from the rr, if so it would hurt your charge capability, but not running capability as long as the battery had a good charge on it.

If you have a connection issue on the main 30amp line that would cause running issue

[DVIII]

Yea I tested the rr and got 0.25V on low beam testing negative battery to positive rr, and 0.35V on high beam.

I don't really know what the figures indicate, but according to electrosport flow chart this is a bad positive connection.

Testing the negative side of the rr was in spec...

I did cut out that bad connector with the fuse replacement btw.

[5232eagle]

Looks like you found your problem alright.

Just to comment about testing R/R. I have had several go bad and still could provide good voltage .

I have found a good test is to remove the negative battery cable with the engine running about 3000-4000.

If the R/R is good then it will keep running fairly smooth and the head light flicker a little from bright.

A bad regulator will have a dim headlight and the engine will either quit or misfire terriable and maybe even backfire.

[spud786]

The bikes runs good now or still have issue?

[DVIII]

Well it runs, I'm just worried about the issue happening again as I feel like I haven't addressed the issue, I've just fixed the effect of the issue.

[DVIII]

As a resolution I've ordered the vfrness and a digital voltmeter to monitor the situation.

Thanks for the responses, ill post up if any issues recur

[nearfreezing]

You might want to clean (using contact cleaner) and Oxgard other connectors, too. After doing this to the 3P stator-to-R/R connector and the connectors from the R/R to the battery, the VFR bumped from a battery voltage of 13.8V to a steady 14.3 across the rev range.

Well it runs, I'm just worried about the issue happening again as I feel like I haven't addressed the issue, I've just fixed the effect of the issue.

I think you did address the issue. Though it hasn't been conclusively demonstrated, but it seems connectors become dirty over time, building up resistance, which causes them to burn. By replacing the connector you've resolved the problem (though other connectors might also need attention). As spud786 mentioned, cleaning the connectors regularly will help ensure this doesn't happen again soon.