Guest rapsidy Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I am looking at a new bike between the vfr 1200 or zx-14 12 model I really want the vfr but there are a lot of negatives i hear about (i have reasearched a lot on the net) The biggest for me in Oz is a $26k price tag, plus i dont want to spend that money to then have to turn around and do the 1&2 gear mapping etc.. especially when the bike has sold so poorly in australia that we are not even getting the updated 2012 model,with all the fixes the bike should have had originally. I prefer the looks, v4, bags colours over the zx14 but the zx seems to have everything the vfr should have but better and $5k cheaper here they are $21k So ok all things being equal and they were priced the same (the vfr may come down in price other wise they are going to rot on show room floors here) which is the better bike Is the vfr as bad as they say can i live without doing the 1&2 gear fixes or would i be better off buying the zx I have ridden an 06 zx and liked it so an 12 will only be better I test rode the vfr 12 about a year ago for a brief ride and have really forgotten i just remember not being that overwhelmed by it, at the time it didnt feel much different to my vfr 800. But it was a short ride not long enough but it is nigh on impossible to find a demo where i live. Any thoughts would be appreciated cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interceptorrider Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Tough call as I am sure the ZX is a phenomenal bike. I like my VFR1200 very much. It is my favorite street bike (and I've owned many). 1st & 2nd gear is an easy and inexpensive fix with a Bazaaz Z-Bomb. $71 US w/shipping in the states (add a few bucks for international shipping). In December 2010 I paid $9999 for my 2010 VFR1200F w/402 miles on it (plus bags). The bike is smooth, refined, comfortable, very powerful (not in ZX league, but how much do I need?), and incredibly agile for its size (not a ZX6R, but I don't expect it to be). As a total package......the bike is complete. I can't speak for the ZX other than to say......Kawasaki builds good bikes. They seem to advertise it as being about the engine, so I wonder how "complete" the package is. I have never ridden one though. I imagine I would be happy with either bike. Good luck and ride safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headhunter Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I looked at a ZX14 yesterday and it was damn nice looking. VERY comfortable riding position and seat. If I didn't have my VFR already, I would be all over it. But, I LOVE my VFR and am ordering the Z-Bomb today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Thanks for the replys The power isnt the concern so i know the vfr would be plenty enough Can you live with the bike with 1&2 as is? is it that much of an annoyance that you need the bazzaz bomb fix? as i really like gear indicators and dont want that to be stuffed up on a $20k odd bike.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 I have right at 13,000 miles on my stock VFR1200 for me the 1st & 2nd gear "issue" is a non issue maybe if you where going wide open all the time snapping through tight cornners but for my ridding I just use a little more rpms every once and a while in 1st or 2nd but even that is rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interceptorrider Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 The time that the 1st & 2nd issue is an actual "problem" is pulling out to pass a car and in 2nd. You are better off up a gear in 3rd in that situation. I don't feel like having to keep that in the back of my mind. Otherwise, it is more of an annoyance. A liveable one. Yet still an annoyance. I much prefer the linear power I have now with that inexpensive fix. Easier to live without the 1st & 2nd gear indicator than work around that annoyance for my style of riding. Just my observation. The bike is great though. A really nice, well sorted motorcycle. Mark PS. I probably ride a little sportier than most. Ride safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Oh ok so when you pass car in 2nd does it hit redline and engine lose power? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Yokel Posted March 25, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 25, 2012 Oh ok so when you pass car in 2nd does it hit redline and engine lose power? Only time the engine redlines in 2nd is at almost 100mph. Passing a car in 2nd would be a low-speed overtake to even see the fueling issue. In 1st and 2nd with the stock map, the power is only slightly off under 6k revs. Here's my two bits about this fueling thing, having experienced it first-hand and deciding to fix it (Mark hit it on the head with his response). There was (to me anyway with my riding style and what-not) a notable "surge" that would hit at about 4500 rpm when the engine decided to "spool up" if you will. It always seemed to hit me mid-turn and was slightly surprising when it popped up. Even in its bone-stock format the engine has plenty of grunt at any rpm, really. What prompted me to fix it was that I didn't feel it was linear. In other words, I'd get a bump of power coming on when what I needed was smooth throttle response (mid-corner with sandy crap left over from salted roads). So, in short, I would rather have either ALL the power all the time, or the lesser power all the time... not an "unpredictable" combination of both. Was the stock mapping a problem? Yeah, in a way it was. If I didn't fix it would I still love this bike? You bet, I'd just be more cautious about lower-speed maneuvering. It wasn't for the additional power that I did the fix, it was about the bike being more predictable for me and my taste. By no means would I consider it a deal-breaker. Regardless of fuel map, when you want this bike to move it will flat fly... it's really only at speeds under 30mph in 1st and 2nd you see it at all, and even then, in truth it's minimal. Either the Kawasaki or the VFR would be delightful I'm sure... but for my money the Honda is the one I bought. Hell, when I bought it it was sight-unseen... I'd never even sat on it until I already owned it. I looked at the Kawasaki, the BMW and a Ducati. I do not regret a single bit paying more for the Honda. Even after 5 months every time I ride it I like it more. To answer your question in your OP though, yes, the 1st, 2nd gear issue is very livable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Yokel thanks for great reply it all makes sense to me now and I have decided to get the vfr when the price comes down, its inevitable here in oz as they are just not selling due to price and are just sitting on floors and warehouses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Yokel Posted March 25, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 25, 2012 Best of luck to you Rapsidy! Let us know how it goes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer 2FAST4U Posted March 25, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 25, 2012 Something to consider is the cost of insurance. I've got a feeling the ZX-14 costs noticeably more to insure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 HEY I have had the VFR1200 for a year now, and with the weather as it's been, I rode the whole year. The VFR is a niche bike, I wanted power when needed for maneuvering, and didn't want to hear the engine screaming at 70 mph. The question you need to answer honestly to decide is what you want most, a sport bike for all out racing with your hair on fire; or a more conservative platform that can become quite a competitor once you hit 4500 rpm and start moving the bike. I went through a bunch of bike the past two + years trying to find the right one, please note they are all Honda's. The V-Twin's didn't have the power, cruisers didn't maneuver well enough. I jumped on an ST1300 and found it had all the power, but was top heavy, and very very heavy. The VFR was my answer. I use the VFR as my daily commuter and the mapping issue everyone talks about is more about there choice in a bike than the bike itself. It's not a sport bike exclusive, so Honda made sure it met an overall requirement. If your worried about maneuvering in the low end just do the old fashion way and down shift a gear and go for it, the bike will. The range of the bike has also been an issue for some. I usually stop at 140 or 150 miles anyway to stretch and relax for a bit, so getting gas then works for me. On my ST1300 which got awesome distance, I still stopped every 140 or 150 anyway, so really is range really an issue. The reason Honda for me is I have never felt the need to go anywhere else. If two bikes cost the same, or are close enough I'd still get a Honda. In the States I still see bikes flying by from the 70's and 80's, all Honda's. So quality and durability means a lot for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 The 1st and 2nd gear 'fix' just makes the VFR what it should have been all along, normally linear and quick. As for the lack of gear indication its not an issue on mph bikes as 1st is first and you can tell that pretty easily. In 2nd the tachometer marries with the mph i.e. 20mph = 2,000rpm, 40mph = 4,000 rpm etc. In 3rd it doesn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Great news they have just dropped in price here in oz to $19,900 so as soon as i sell my bike i will be getting one :) can't wait Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nasaorbit13 Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Bike week was here in Arizona about a week ago. I rode 4 bikes total and my favorite by far was ZX14. The bike is nimble, responsive, comfortable, and fast. The lady leading our pack was on a ZX10 and was definitely a spirited rider. On the twisties the bike was planted, on the straight-aways the bike pulls away with a beautiful grunt. The next day, I jumped on my VFR1200 and felt the difference. The VFR gets to the same speeds but with a different vocalization. On the twisties the VFR is more brisk than the ZX14. Also, the low end torque on the VFR is much better than the ZX14. I had to rev the ZX14 to above 6K to get the torque that I needed. I did notice that the VFR is being a little restricted around 1st and 2nd gear. However, 2nd gear is long and once I get it passed 5K it growled beautifully. I don't think the restriction is an issue. The other aspects are as follows: - The brakes on the VFR are better and stopping is unmached for the size. - The VFR is a shaft drive not chain like ZX14 - The VFR has a simpler instrument scheme with better finish - The ZX14 is longer than the VFR. At first I thought I was on a boat. - The VFR has a little better mileage. - The ZX14 does have traction control. However, the 2012 VFR1200 does have traction control (my 2010 does not) - The VFR just looks sexier than the ZX14 I most definitely like the ZX14 and maybe if I had the money and the garage space I would have bought it. Good luck with your decision. Nassar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auron Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 Easy there fella- The 14R is 2 inches shorter. 58.5 vs 60.5 The 14R gets over 40 mpg WHEN you actually twist the throttle Nothing is uglier than the VFR1200 by 90% of motorcyclists, so that automatically makes the 14R better looking by default. The 14R is waaay smoother and lighter too, The only thing it doesn't have is Honda fit and finish, a shaft drive, and a hole in the powerband (DCT) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiN Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 Easy there fella- The 14R is 2 inches shorter. 58.5 vs 60.5 The 14R gets over 40 mpg WHEN you actually twist the throttle Nothing is uglier than the VFR1200 by 90% of motorcyclists, so that automatically makes the 14R better looking by default. The 14R is waaay smoother and lighter too, The only thing it doesn't have is Honda fit and finish, a shaft drive, and a hole in the powerband (DCT) -Shorter wheelbase sure -Over 40mpg when twisting the throttle IDK. My C14 didn't get anywhere near that on the instant mpg gauge when I got on it. Maybe I'm wrong but I'd like to see some info showing that one. -Look are in the eye of who is writing the check for the bike. If 90% of motorcyclists were paying for my bike then I would care what they thought. -I wouldnt necessarly call 584.3lbs waaay lighter than 590lbs curb weight. If it was 7lbs lighter then maybe but 6lbs nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Easy there fella-The 14R is 2 inches shorter. 58.5 vs 60.5 The 14R gets over 40 mpg WHEN you actually twist the throttle Nothing is uglier than the VFR1200 by 90% of motorcyclists, so that automatically makes the 14R better looking by default. The 14R is waaay smoother and lighter too, The only thing it doesn't have is Honda fit and finish, a shaft drive, and a hole in the powerband (DCT) Length isn't important. Weight isn't too. The VFR proofs that by feeling way lighter and more agile. Of course the VFR is as beautiful as an Italian bike. Both bikes will get over 40mpg IF you are cruising slowly. Both bikes can get under 30mpg if you twist the throttle. Both bikes WILL get under 20mpg IF you really twist the throttle. Whoever says something else just did not use the bikes potential, at least not through a full tank. Talking about the shaft drive, the chain of the 14 makes a very ugly oil spot, burning into the hot parts of the exhaust system. Talking about Honda fit and finish, my former 14 lost parts of its fairing at top speed melting around the manifold, had several electrical failures (cockpit off and one time even engine off out of nothing), bend some parts in the transmission causing it to hop out of gear at ~4th gear 120mph full throttle and finally blew up it's engine. Might have been a lemon or the Kawa engineers didn't take into account, that someone would use its ability to go 190mph. But yeah, the 14 is way more powerful and its engine is silk smooth, no doubt it's superior in that one point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dae Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Have owned several Kawasaki 1986 Ninja 600, 1993 ZX11 & 2007 ZX14 Honda 1984 V65 Sabre, 1993 CBR 900, 2007 CBR 1000 If you’re a younger guy I would get 2012 ZX14, if you’re alittle older like me VFR 1200. Bottom line this isn’t going to be your final purchase. Just ride safe and wear gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiN Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 I know its not the exact same motor but it was relatively the same motor just tuned for better mileage on my old C14 and it was probably geared different at the rear since it was shaft vs chain. Mine got 42-43 average mpg. The best I could get instant mpg was 47-49 but that was going down a big hill with the wind at my back. When I got on it, it was low 30's and balls to the wall it was high 20's. They got that motor update in '12 so it might be a little different now. Motor was silky smooth whereas the VFR is more rumbly. The I4 motor was very wide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 My riding mate has a September 2011 ZZR 1400, we both previously had CB1300's. On the CB's he could leave me behind if he wanted to, he's a more experienced and better rider. Now, with him on his 14 and me on my VFR I'm pushing him on anything even close to being a twistie, I can carry more entry speed, hold a tighter line and get the power down much earlier out of the bend, his 14 just wants to go straight. My VFR is on the rubbish Bridgestone BT021's his 14 is on the very soft BT014's. Last Sunday we did a hard 380 miles of fantastic mixed A and B roads all around North Wales and back home via the Cat & Fiddle (youtube it to see the type of bikers road it is), the only time he started to pull away slightly was on a couple of big dual carriageway sweepers taken at speeds approaching mid triple digits, and I am talking MPH! Every time we filled up our fuel consumption was almost identical much to the amusement of our other riding buddy on his ZX9R who consistently got a fair bit more MPG than we did. I had the Honda re-map done on my bike last week and now won't bother with the Z-Bomb, the fueling is much improved, I don't have any issues with it suddenly feeding in loads of extra power and it trundles through traffic when filtering so much better than it did before. I've not felt compromised when overtaking in 2nd I just crank it open and go and boy does it go. Get the VFR after all it is a Honda! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auron Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Weight does matter and if the VFR carried it's weight the same way AND weighed 100lbs less, the handling would be unreal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zRoYz Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Great news they have just dropped in price here in oz to $19,900 so as soon as i sell my bike i will be getting one :) can't wait Just make sure your getting the 2012 upgrade, you might find the discounted price will be old stock without upgrade as there just not selling in AUS so Honda MPE would have unsold stock in the warehouse. Before you buy make sure your getting 2012 build date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 23, 2012 Share Posted April 23, 2012 I havent ridden the new VFR but the 14 is a quality bike. I like the fit and finish of it. The VFR is kind of boring to look at. Both will do what you need them to do. I've been sitting on the fence looking at the 14 for a year...time to take the plunge... The VFR is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY over priced!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 24, 2012 Share Posted April 24, 2012 I demo rode the ZX14R at Daytona Bike Week. It was incredibly fast and very well built with great fit and finish. However, the fun would only be for shorter distance rides as I don't think it is as comfortable as the VFR1200F and would not work as well for touring and having fun in the twisties. I have a Kawasaki Concours 14 that is the BEST for touring and some sport riding. All-in-all, the VFR1200F is the best bike for both worlds, sport riding and shorter touring distances. That's why I bought it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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