Charging Question

[VFRMike]

I've got an 02 VFR with about 38k. Replaced the stock battery about a month ago. Yesterday went to the store and when I got back on the bike and it wouldn't start. The bike was acting like the battery was pretty much dead and the motor would only slightly turn over. So I pushed the bike and jumped it and rode it home. It rode home fine which although it was only a mile. When I got home I turned the bike off- it did not die on me. I mentioned to my fiance that I was going to test the bike out and I was off. Rode it for about 3 miles and then decided to do a u-turn. As the RPM's lowered (clutch pulled in) the bike simply died. When I tried to start it the dash would flicker and the head lights did turn on and stay on. It would not even jump start till about the 5th or 6th try and even then really bogged upon starting. I rode it home careful not to allow the RPM's to drop too much but it seemed as though the bike would have died if I had let the RPM's drop. Got home, coasted up the driveway and pulled in the clutch completly and sure enough the bike died- and would not re-start. This morning I charged the battery to 100% and put it back in the bike. It starts just fine. However, I used my voltmeter and noticed while the bike is running I'm only measuring 12 volts. I put the same meter on my truck and it showed just about 14 volts (not over 14). Last night I read through A LOT of posts regarding the electrical gremlins our bike may be plagued with but did not notice any burnt wires, discoloration, or any other obvious problems. Of course, I am not an electrician by any means- not even close. I don't even know what a volt is (let alone an amp) just that my voltmeter should read about 13.7 when the bike's running- right?? I believe I hd the altenator upgrade a while ago.

Any insight is appreciated.

Thanks,

VFRMike.

[spud786]

Obviously your battery is not charging, either you have corroded connections, bad stator or rectifier,

disconnect the 3 yellow wire lead from the stator and check to ground on highest OHM setting, there should be no continuity on any of the wires to frame.

[turtlecreek]

if you are always reading low voltage of 12V at 4k and above, it sounds more like your alternator is going out. look at this post:

http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.p...p;hl=alternator

basically, this is a generator that creates your voltage/power when it is turned by the engine. think of it like water and this is the pump. it builds up pressure to push the water (electricity) throughout your bike. if it doesnt build up enough 'pressure' (voltage), then your bike will try and get it from the battery. this can only go on so long, until the battery is dead.

the r/r is a voltage regulator (in the water example, a pressure regulator). a generator will continue to product more and more voltage/power as it spins faster and faster. but your bike only wants 12V at all times. therefore, the r/r modulates things so that no matter what speed your engine is running, the voltage is kept near the 12V (somewhere in the 13-15V range).

hope that helps some.

[VFRMike]

Hello Turtlecreek,

Is the alternator the same thing as the regulator rectifier? Thanks.

VFRMike.

[turtlecreek]

no, the r/r is fed by the alternator. alternator is generator that creates voltage, r/r keeps it at the right voltage.

[Stéphane]

Did you check this first?

02 recall

SG

[VFRMike]

I remember receiving the update letter and I think I had that update completed- it's been a while for sure. Assuming it was done under 4 years ago would the part(s) that were replaced still be under warrenty even though the bike is out of warrenty? I'll be calling the dealer for sure on Monday but any thoughts are appreciated.

VFRMike.

[Guest]

Mike,

I really think that a systematic approach to this problem is the best way to go. Not only will help you follow a logical step by step process, you'll end up understand your charging system more fully.

Start with the going to the "Downloads" section here on the site and getting the 2002 VFR Service Manual (or whatever year you have).

Section 1, Page 1-10 has the Battery/Charging System Specifications - always good to know what you are aiming for.

Section 17, "Battery/Charging System" has a complete trouble shooting guide beginning on page 17-5.

If you want supplement the Honda Factory manual you can try out the Electrex/Electrosport trouble shooting guide.

Finally - ask lots of questions, post lots of pictures. Everyone on the site is great, and chances are if you have a problem so does someone else.

[swas]

Hello Turtlecreek,

Is the alternator the same thing as the regulator rectifier? Thanks.

VFRMike.

VFRMike

The stator(alternator) produces 3 phase electricity in alternating current (AC) form. The regulator rectifier (R/R) rectifies (converts) this AC to DC (direct current) at the level required all the time, mostly read as 13.5 to 14.1Vdc with a voltmeter when the bike is running. The regulation is needed because the load on the electrics varies with speed of the engine as well as other junk which owners connect from time to time. No regulation and the voltage varies as this load changes. If the voltage is not controlled to tight limits too much power is let loose into battery, coils, motors etc which causes overheating and it's subsequent effects boiling, overheating.

The battery is just there hanging on the electrical system soaking up some excess volts ready to feed them back in, as in when starting and is usually the reason we get maybe an hours+ running after the electricity generation system fails. Yours sounds to be partly ailing, not yet failed, and so what seems to be a battery prob is intermittent, so far.

Several things on our beloved VFR's contribute to this lack of correct operation of the electricity generation and storage and they are described in the many excellent posts around VFRD.

Crook earthing, wherever it happens, or crook sense wire, or crook battery connections leads to the DC volts being too high, the R/R gets fooled and allows too much through.

Low volts, which you have, can be many things. Stator faulty(source of supply), loss of volts between stator and R/R - check the plug and socket joint. Faulty R/R, if all volts and ohms measurements are OK in the circuits from stator to R/R it will most probably be the R/R. Wiring between R/R and battery - check the connections of all your plugs and sockets especially those around the main fuse adjacent to the battery.

The fixes in the VFRD posts are aimed at finding the above and also eliminating the problems before they happen. Don't stop when you have found the present problem, keep going and fix 'em all whilst you are in there.

Go where talus has suggested for voltage levels to measure at different places and ohms readings to obtain round the bike. Post these values and the collective wisdom will pinpoint your problem if your own investigation fails to spell it out for you. Don't be shy electric problems can be obscure to those not familiar with it.

Good luck

Mike

[VFRMike]

I appreciate all the information thus far and I am picking up some of it. I am a mathematician (not an electrician) so all this is new to me. Yesterday I went out and noticed the voltmeter indicating 12 volts and when I start the bike it read just slightly under 12 volts- so changes there. Then I notice a bit of white smoke coming from the right side of the tank. I immediatly shut the bike off (it was still running fine) and then notice a smell like a cat urine. The smell seemed to be coming from the front of the bike just behind the headlights. I have smelt burning wires before and do not remember them smelling like this. I'm off for the summer (teacher) but am planning for my wedding which is to occure in 11 days- or else I'd be much more aggressive in figuring this out. Tonight I plan to take the plastic off and maybe I'll see something- but the smoke and the smell doesn't sound too good. This is the first bike that I did not buy the extended warrenty on- bummer. The previous VFR and the RC-51 never had a single problem- I guess you never know.

VFRMike.

[jeremy556]

If you are showing under 13 volts on the voltmeter with the bike running you have a charging problem. Most likely the R/R or stator. Go through the electrical system troubleshooting to find the culprit.

[shayne]

I appreciate all the information thus far and I am picking up some of it. I am a mathematician (not an electrician) so all this is new to me. Yesterday I went out and noticed the voltmeter indicating 12 volts and when I start the bike it read just slightly under 12 volts- so changes there. Then I notice a bit of white smoke coming from the right side of the tank. I immediatly shut the bike off (it was still running fine) and then notice a smell like a cat urine. The smell seemed to be coming from the front of the bike just behind the headlights. I have smelt burning wires before and do not remember them smelling like this. I'm off for the summer (teacher) but am planning for my wedding which is to occure in 11 days- or else I'd be much more aggressive in figuring this out. Tonight I plan to take the plastic off and maybe I'll see something- but the smoke and the smell doesn't sound too good. This is the first bike that I did not buy the extended warrenty on- bummer. The previous VFR and the RC-51 never had a single problem- I guess you never know.

VFRMike.

Sounds to me like you have found it. Find where that smell is coming from, and that could be the answer.

[VFRMike]

So I take both side plastics off and start looking for clues. I notice one of the plastic "bottle shaped" proctecitve covers has a black/yellow burn mark on it from the radiator hose and upon inspecting the hardware inside that piece I notice a bit of yellow/green acid where one of the prongs plugs in. Not enought to think it'd cause a problem however. More interestingly I also determined that on the right side of the bike one of the two black rubber hoses (with wires inside) running alone the frame and radiator hose has a bit of dark brown fluid dripping out (maybe 6-8 drips came out) and the other black rubber hose has a little light-brown powder coming out. I will probably take it in and have the mechanic start their process with those hoses and the wires within those hoses. I am curious if water from the radiator have caused the damage. If I had another bike to enjoy I might call this interesting but since I don't I say this sucks!!

VFRMike.