Another Frankenviffer

[Guest DonnyBallGame]

Well, i still have a long row to ho. I just got a front end from a 98 Yamaha R1. Now I need to get a bottom and Top Triple Tree Clamp. I am not having any luck on Ebay. Does anyone have a good place to buy these parts? Am I thinking right, I am looking for a 2000+ CBR954 setup or a RC51 setup, is that the closest to working? Thanks I will document this well.

IMGP0541.JPG

Edited December 8, 2006 by DonnyBallGame

[Veefer800Canuck]

Need RC51 SP1 lower triple and a CBR 929 or 954 upper triple.

the RC51 SP2 lower triple won't work, the steering stem is too large in diameter.

Can you please measure the length of the R-1 forks from the center of the axle to the top of the forks, not including the adjusters and post up?

[The Phantom]

You can use a 929/954 lower if you're prepared to mod or move the oil cooler.

Vfrrider is your man, he's just about got his sorted.

[SAFE-T]

You can use a 929/954 lower if you're prepared to mod or move the oil cooler.

Swiffer 'curved' his oil cooler using a press he cut out of wood. Lower triple just touches the rad hoses on 5th and 6th gen. bikes with the CBR lower triple. IIRC, Swiffer used an RC51 lower triple/CBR upper and it still touched the oil cooler on his '94.

[Guest DonnyBallGame]

Need RC51 SP1 lower triple and a CBR 929 or 954 upper triple.

the RC51 SP2 lower triple won't work, the steering stem is too large in diameter.

Can you please measure the length of the R-1 forks from the center of the axle to the top of the forks, not including the adjusters and post up?

29.25 give or take 1/32 is what my Stanley Tape is giving me right now. The hunt continues. Thanks for the comments guys. Please keep me in mind if you see anything.

[The Phantom]

Donny,

If you are using the R1 front wheel you will need to make or source spacers for the axle - the R1 tripleclamps are 210mm fork centre to fork centre, whereas the CBR/RC51 triples are 214mm.

You'll need a 2mm spacer for each side of the front wheel. The axle diameter is 22mm.

It follows that you also need to space the brake calipers* in by 2mm on each side so they line up with the rotors.

* I'm using the radial brake R1 front end so I need to space the rotors rather than the calipers.

If you are using the VFR front wheel then spacers etc. are a whole new, err, ball game :lol: That's where Vfrrider might be able to help you out (I'm not sure whether he's gone for the whole R1 kit).

Rob, the 2004-06 R1 forks are 725mm, or 28 5/8". I'm pretty sure that 929/954 Helibars or ST3 bars are my only option, there won't be any fork left above the triples for clip-ons. Will know for sure tonight :thumbsup:

Edit - whoops, fixed mistake (I said Donny would have to space the calipers out, rather than in).

[SAFE-T]

If you are using the VFR front wheel then spacers etc. are a whole new ball game

If you want to use the VFR front wheel, try sourcing a set of Ducati 320 mm rotors - they can be redrilled to fit directly on the VFR wheel (see vfrmonkey for this one) - at least on the 5th/6th generation models.

As far as the bearings go, I'm pretty sure you can just change over to a different bearing size. This is what you do when putting a VFR or Marchesini front wheel with a set of RC51 forks, since the outer bearing diameter and width is the same. Then you use the correct axle for the forks and either modify or make your own inner/outer bearing spacers.

Others have taken more difficult paths before they figured out an easier way later <_<

Next you will need a single-nut Ducati rear wheel :goofy: which is a very easy mod for your bike. Imagine a set of these on your veefer !

[Guest DonnyBallGame]

WOW, Thanks for the attention guys. I am looking at using the VFR front wheel with my conversion. I am going to start measuring and disasembling things this weekend. This is going to be a fun project.

Safe-T, Thanks for the link on the wheels, you are a bad, person for planting that seed in my head. It has always been there, but you made it grow even bigger now.

Whoa! 320 mm rotors!? Holy Crap. I am all over that. There goes my budget build. I can't wait until I get done with this.

Edited December 8, 2006 by DonnyBallGame

[SAFE-T]

320 mm rotors!? Holy Crap. I am all over that.

OK, but now that I read your original post again I see you are using '98 forks. I think these use 298 mm rotors. The later models used bigger ones - 310mm, then 320mm. The VFR's rotors are 296mm so you should be able to use the front wheel and rotors as-is, with spacing of the calipers/rotors as necessary.

If I remember correctly, this is what vfrrider (Larry) did on his bike.

[Guest DonnyBallGame]

OK, but now that I read your original post again I see you are using '98 forks. I think these use 298 mm rotors. The later models used bigger ones - 310mm, then 320mm. The VFR's rotors are 296mm so you should be able to use the front wheel and rotors as-is, with spacing of the calipers/rotors as necessary.

If I remember correctly, this is what vfrrider (Larry) did on his bike.

Well, looks like I am back on budget. :lol: I thought I had read elsewhere that the rotors were 298mm also. Oh well, they will have to do.

[SAFE-T]

Well, looks like I am back on budget. :lol: I thought I had read elsewhere that the rotors were 298mm also. Oh well, they will have to do.

The R1's monoblock calipers are the shiznit. Yamaha used the same calipers on the R1, R6 and FZ1 making a used set easy to find for around $50. I particularly like the ones with the gold inserts.

[Guest DonnyBallGame]

The R1's monoblock calipers are the shiznit. Yamaha used the same calipers on the R1, R6 and FZ1 making a used set easy to find for around $50. I particularly like the ones with the gold inserts.

You are right again. I saw them on ebay. I also saw a pair that were silver, I believe they were off a V-Star Warrior. I got the blue ones for $47 + shipping on ebay. The other colors were a rairity and were going for twice the price. So far, I am watching a bottom clamp and disassembling my bike. Also on the lookout for a Top Clamp. I am going to take a look at my Clip-ons when I get them off to see if there is any room in them to take ny material out of the hole to make them work with the R1 Forks. 41mm to 50mm is "only" 4.5mm per side. If there is room i will bore them out. If it gets thin, I will not endanger myself or the public to that. Once I figure that out, I may be on the look-out for some Heli-bars.

[Guest vfrrider]

OK, the forks you have are from the 2000 era R1, and they used 300mm rotors, so the present front wheel and rotors from the VFR are possible.

Problems.

1. The axle. R1 azle is 25mm, VFR bearings are 22mm. No known bearings from 25mm ID that fit the VFR wheel. Have axle turned down to 22mm, easy for a good mechanist.

2. Spacers. I ended up with one small VFR on right and left. Added a cut down on right. Had to go back to add 1/8" spacers to each side to make a good tight fit.

3. Need to wait to last to measure and adjust calipers. May not need to do anything. I had "adjusted" mine, and now have to readjust them. Otherwise they bolt on. Should be real close stock.

4. You'll have to clearance the forks to the fairing support frame at the top. I cut some off and paite it black, looks stock.

5. Bars. Your choice, I'm running Ducati ST3 stock bars under the RC51 upper clamp. Works so far.

6. Needed longer cables and hoses. running Hayabusa master cylinders so I had to change them anyway.

7. Front fender. I used an R1 painted to match bike. Looks great.

8. Oil cooler, you have to clearance it to clear forks. I ended up with a 3 row from an 86. Looking for 2x4 oak to cut template and curve it per instructions. Should bolt right up.

Oh, length of fork is same as length from VFR upper clamp top to axle, so a toss.

Details as I get time to finish. Pics on completion. Looks bitcthin so far.

Larry

VFRrider

[Veefer800Canuck]

I am going to take a look at my Clip-ons when I get them off to see if there is any room in them to take ny material out of the hole to make them work with the R1 Forks. 41mm to 50mm is "only" 4.5mm per side. If there is room i will bore them out. If it gets thin, I will not endanger myself or the public to that. Once I figure that out, I may be on the look-out for some Heli-bars.

In the immortal words of the Penguins from Madagascar:

"That's not gonna fly!"

MAYBE, MAYBE, you could take them out to 43mm and use them with conventional upside-right forks like from a Blackbird or a VTEC VFR, but I'd never feel comfortable going further than that.

Look at some Helibars for a 929 or 954. They are 50mm.

The ones I used were for a Duc 900SS and I had to mod them but I chose them because they had the tallest rise of all the 50mm bars that Heli makes.

[SAFE-T]

I am watching a bottom clamp and disassembling my bike. Also on the lookout for a Top Clamp.

I have a CBR929/954 lower triple in perfect condition. Might also be willing to part with my billet upper triple - the VFR ignition bolts right in.

Other than that I would just buy a set of 929/954 forks with triples and sell the forks. Easier than trying to find the top triple seperately these days. THIS is a good example.

No known bearings with 25mm ID that fit the VFR wheel.

Larry worked out the details on this setup, which I had originally planned to do on my bike. I had the same experience looking for 22x47x12 bearings for my Marchesini's - no one makes them. BUT....Honda uses 22x47x14 bearings in the RC51 - pretty much the closest thing out there and certainly would have been easier than the $60 custom spacers I had made.

I would check the sizing on a set of CBR929/954 or other Honda bearings before I turned the axle down - could be they're a fit. Larry will spit up on his computer if this is true.

[Guest DonnyBallGame]

OK, I got my VFR Fork Ass'y off. Yah! That is the good news. After Safe-T's last post I was a little hopeful, here is why. When I got my R1 Forks, I grabbed my digital Starrett calipers and started measureing them. Here are the numbers I got.

Top Clamp: Ø49,97mm

Bottom Clamp: Ø53,94mm

Axle:Ø21.91

So, when Safe-T told me that the VFR Axle was 22mm, I was like :thumbsup: . So I got off my duff and ran out to take the front tire off and slip it into the new front end. I like to do things like that to have something to do. Anyway, I pulled out my VFR front axle to see something different. My VFR Axle is at Ø18,97 (19mm). Dang it. Oh well. Now I need to get the spec on my wheel bearing to see if I can get one with the correct OD and have a 22mm ID. And I thought this was going to be easy.

Thanks for the help guys. I am also open to any suggestions. Feel free to chime in whenever.

Edited December 10, 2006 by DonnyBallGame

[SAFE-T]

I need to get the spec on my wheel bearing to see if I can get one with the correct OD and have a 22mm ID.

I think you are getting me and Larry confused... :unsure: He told you the R1 axle was 25mm and the VFR's was 22mm.

Anyway...

Ducati wheel bearings are 25x47x12

RC51 wheel bearings are 22x47x14

CBR929/954 bearings 25 mm ID. No idea what their OD and widths are, but probably 47/14 or 47/12.

Unfortunately I don't keep as good track of this stuff as someone like Rob (veefer800canuck) but I do remember the Duc/RC bearing specs because I was looking for a 22x47x12 bearing to mate Ducati wheels on RC51 Ohlins forks. There is no such animal available from any manufacturer anywhere on the planet.

I don't know as much about the 4th gen front wheel, but the 5th/6th gen front wheels are the same, and since RC51 bearings fit in them, their OD must be 47mm.

So....try a set of Ducati wheel bearings. Or almost anything else that went on inverted forks, since 25mm was a fairly common size axle.

Lastly, according to this guy the front wheel bearings for the VFR750 and 800 are the same.

[tok tokkie]

OK, I got my VFR Fork Ass'y off. Yah! That is the good news. After Safe-T's last post I was a little hopeful, here is why. When I got my R1 Forks, I grabbed my digital Starrett calipers and started measureing them. Here are the numbers I got.

Top Clamp: Ø49,97mm

Bottom Clamp: Ø53,94mm

Axle:Ø21.91

So, when Safe-T told me that the VFR Axle was 22mm, I was like :thumbsup: . So I got off my duff and ran out to take the front tire off and slip it into the new front end. I like to do things like that to have something to do. Anyway, I pulled out my VFR front axle to see something different. My VFR Axle is at Ø18,97 (19mm). Dang it. Oh well. Now I need to get the spec on my wheel bearing to see if I can get one with the correct OD and have a 22mm ID. And I thought this was going to be easy.

Thanks for the help guys. I am also open to any suggestions. Feel free to chime in whenever.

The 5G & 6G VFR axle is 20mm and uses a standard 47x20x14 bearing available from any bearing distributor. The RC51 axle is 22mm & uses a 47x22x14 bearing which you will only get from Honda. That is what Safe-T said & it is correct. I assume the 4G axle is the same 20mm as the later bikes.

[Guest DonnyBallGame]

I think you are getting me and Larry confused... :unsure: He told you the R1 axle was 25mm and the VFR's was 22mm.

Sorry for the cunfusion guys, but I am as confused as you are. It doesn't really matter thou, I have what I have, and need to get it rolling by March, so, onward and forward we go.

Safe-T, I just reread your post above about the Triple Clamps. PM me a price you are happy with and I may buy the lower from you. Does it have all the bearings? Thanks

[Guest vfrrider]

Safe-T,

WTF, Ducati bearings would work? If so, DBG will have a much earier time than me, but I did reuse the VFR spacers, kind of...

Live and learn. When we all get done, we ned to amass ay Frankenviffer database with all the pertinent data so others will have an earier time.

Who knows, maybe Honda might even rear how easy it would be to do USD to their most popular bike. Oh, forgot, discontinued in 2007 after 20+ years of success.

Larry

VFRrider

Oh, learned yesterday that after reassembling the front end, while everything is together, BUT NOT TIGHT, drop bike down on front wheel and bounced it to "seat" everything. Than tighten.

[SAFE-T]

Safe-T,

WTF, Ducati bearings would work? Live and learn.

When we all get done, we need to amass a Frankenviffer database with all the pertinent data so others will have an easier time.

Found out you could use various bearings in different wheels AFTER I went to the trouble to have a custom spacer/adapter made for mine <_< Guess we're both members of the "figured out an easier way to do things after first doing it a more difficult way" club.

I must have ground through at least three sets of RC51 outer spacers trying to get mine right :huh:

[SAFE-T]

We need to amass a Frankenviffer database with all the pertinent data so others will have an easier time.

You have mail

[Guest vfrrider]

I did my part.

Pass it around and someone start a section in the mods for this. Put a post it note for future Frankenviffer fools.

Larry

VFRrider

[SAFE-T]

I did my part.

Pass it around and someone start a section in the mods for this. Put a post it note for future Frankenviffer fools.

Larry

VFRrider

'Frankenfool'....I like it :lol:

I think it should go in 'Featured Modifications' but I can't start a thread in that area. Bueller ?

[Guest DonnyBallGame]

Wohoo, got my brakes today. 2004 R1's. I will post some pics when it gets more worth while. So far the bike is sitting with no front anyting on it. Looks pretty pitiful. The one thing that makes me mad is, I could have rode it this weekend and completed my task of "Riding in every month" this year. Dang, I guess started this too soon. Oh well, there is always next year if i get done in January.