De-Cat Pcv Autotune.

[smergy]

looks like the actual distance between the headers is about 65mm, 45mm will require some extra work, going to get it fabbed from scratch I think.

[cutback]

great, thanks for the response, I contacted JetEx about it, for reference the distance between the center of the 2 holes they said is 45.50 mm. Probably pick one up and see how it goes. I'll report back. Does anyone know the actual distance between the center of the 2 inlets? I'll take a look with some calipers today, although it would be easier to mesaure once its cut off.

I'm confused..... The schematic provided by the link, shows dimension (E)104 mm from OS to OS, minus pipe diameter, dimension (F) 44.5 mm = 59.5mm C to C. At 65 mm, that would be 3.2 mm or 1/8" difference per side. If I'm reading this right, I think it would need very little adjustment.

[dynajohn]

great, thanks for the response, I contacted JetEx about it, for reference the distance between the center of the 2 holes they said is 45.50 mm. Probably pick one up and see how it goes. I'll report back. Does anyone know the actual distance between the center of the 2 inlets? I'll take a look with some calipers today, although it would be easier to mesaure once its cut off.

I'm confused..... The schematic provided by the link, shows dimension (E)104 mm from OS to OS, minus pipe diameter, dimension (F) 44.5 mm = 59.5mm C to C. At 65 mm, that would be 3.2 mm or 1/8" difference per side. If I'm reading this right, I think it would need very little adjustment.

I measured the cat I removed and the C to C is 59.5 mm for the two pipes coming into the cat.

[cutback]

great, thanks for the response, I contacted JetEx about it, for reference the distance between the center of the 2 holes they said is 45.50 mm. Probably pick one up and see how it goes. I'll report back. Does anyone know the actual distance between the center of the 2 inlets? I'll take a look with some calipers today, although it would be easier to mesaure once its cut off.

I'm confused..... The schematic provided by the link, shows dimension (E)104 mm from OS to OS, minus pipe diameter, dimension (F) 44.5 mm = 59.5mm C to C. At 65 mm, that would be 3.2 mm or 1/8" difference per side. If I'm reading this right, I think it would need very little adjustment.

I measured the cat I removed and the C to C is 59.5 mm for the two pipes coming into the cat.

Thanks John, Great info! It looks like the Y-pipe is about perfect. Please post up if anyone has ordered this...........

[cutback]

Well, I just ordered the Y-Piece so, we'll find out......

[smergy]

Think your right, 45.5 mm doesn't sound right, given the inlets are 44.5mm, that would mean they would be pretty much touching at 45.50 mm C to C.

From Jetex:

REF U905145/R

The distance between centres is 45.50mm

edit: here is the technical spec, yeah, that number they gave me is definately wrong:

http://www.jetex.co.uk/website/images/catalogues/customparts/technical/u905145_with-dimensions.jpg

[smergy]

Lined up a fabricator and some 1-3/4" + 2" pipe from partsource. The exhaust goes in for surgery monday, I'll post pics of how it turns out

[f3racer]

i know its been a couple months but.....how did it turn out?

[Auron]

Does the cat itself decrease noise, or just the pipe?

[hvfrdave]

Hi Auron, I dare say it would be slightly louder removing the cat, but I have not noticed it, and I run with the LeoVince end can, without the baffle.

[Vfr88]

Y-Piece Jetex REF U905145/R is almost a perfect fit.

I was suprised that there is very little change in sound level. I measured it before and after with a mobile phone app to give an idea. It didn't see any difference. The note is a little different (lower).

[texdgl]

How much trouble is it to remove the header pipes? I always figured it would be a pain on a V-4.

[Vfr88]

How much trouble is it to remove the header pipes? I always figured it would be a pain on a V-4.

Not difficult at all. There is a workshop manual downloaded somewhere which helps and shows how to do it. Maybe 2 hours when you do it the first time. Manual says remove the radiator but that is not necessary. Just loosen it to generate some space to get to front cylinder bolts.

The reason it is not difficult is that the back cylinder pipes are made from two parts. It is not necessary to remove the one that is bolted to cylinder head.

[Auron]

Hi Auron, I dare say it would be slightly louder removing the cat, but I have not noticed it, and I run with the LeoVince end can, without the baffle.

I was thinking I'd like to keep the stock pipe, remove the cat and get an autotune. Does that sound like a good setup for anyone that wants it to remain quiet?

[hvfrdave]

The problem is, the standard rear exhaust can, restricts the exhaust gases, hence, when you fit any after market can, you gain between 4-6bhp, all I can suggest is you open up the standard can, and de-baffle it, and weld it back together again, it will be a little noisier, but its a compromise.

[Auron]

Hmmm, I've had pipes on several of my bikes but I'm thinking I'm going to stick with stock from now on. The fueling was the only thing I didn't like about the 1200 I test rode, will a stock exhaust and auto-tune cure all the issues?

Thanks!

[hvfrdave]

First of all, do you have a 1200F or a FD, the reason I ask is you do not have a lot of room to fit the Autotune o2 sensor, not a problem with the 1200F, but the FD, you have even less room, so you need to make sure the bos is welded in the correct place. I would recommend you have the VFR set up on a dyno, then the Autotune would work around your tailor made map.

[Jigsaw]

Hi Auron, I dare say it would be slightly louder removing the cat, but I have not noticed it, and I run with the LeoVince end can, without the baffle.

I was thinking I'd like to keep the stock pipe, remove the cat and get an autotune. Does that sound like a good setup for anyone that wants it to remain quiet?

Hi mate, I have a standard pipe that I decatted with autotune and a Dam exhaust, can't say that it is any louder just a different tone.

[dynajohn]

Dave this is somewhat off topic but I thought it would be interesting to you and other folks here. I had wondered about the differences between European (specifically English) VFR 1200F's and the US model. I had a conversation with Don Guhl today and he mentioned some surprising differences he has seen since receiving several ECU's from over there for re-flashes. To start with the 1st & 2nd gear restriction is present in both ECU's but the English ECU has less restriction in 1st & 2nd gear than the US version. 3rd gear in the English version is restricted somewhat where the US version has no restriction in 3rd gear. Both versions are speed restricted which comes into play in 5th & 6th gears. Another difference is that the English ECU has somewhat more aggressive ignition timing than the US version. Guhl is making steady progress in getting rid of the ECU restrictions and has found the speed limiting restriction which was the last restriction on the list of changes we requested he address in the re-flash. He thinks there is more to be had from the ECU both in HP and in the TBW control maps. Unfortunately we have not been able to find any US owner in the north eastern US with a F model willing to let him use they're VFR1200F to fine tune and beta test these ECU changes. The reason Don feels there is more to be had is based on his experience with other Honda motorcycle ECU's. He said Honda is very conservative and he has achieved significant gains in both HP and throttle response where he has had a motorcycle to work with on his in house dyno.

I sent my ECU back to Don today to have the ECU re-flash updated to remove the speed restriction. Guhl thought they had removed this speed restriction in the 1st re-flash but when I dyno tested the 1st re-flash it was still there. They found that there was a second separate speed restriction in another line of software code. This would never have gotten past and into the field if they had had a bike in their shop to beta test the version 1 re-flash. That being said all the other restrictions he removed work as promised. All together this is a amazing piece of work for not having a bike in house to work with. As soon as I verify the speed restriction is gone via a dyno test in 5th & 6th gear he will include this feature in his re-flashes if desired.

[Bizbat]

I sent my ECU back to Don today to have the ECU re-flash updated to remove the speed restriction. Guhl thought they had removed this speed restriction in the 1st re-flash but when I dyno tested the 1st re-flash it was still there. They found that there was a second separate speed restriction in another line of software code.

John, I am surprised to see you mention "lines of code".. Does Don actually possess the app source and is making actual code changes? I was under the impression he was updating mapped inputs into the application, i.e. at RPM "X" given throttle position "Y" and gear indicator "Z", set fuel/timing to some value..

Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk

[Tamworth]

I sent my ECU back to Don today to have the ECU re-flash updated to remove the speed restriction. Guhl thought they had removed this speed restriction in the 1st re-flash but when I dyno tested the 1st re-flash it was still there. They found that there was a second separate speed restriction in another line of software code.

John, I am surprised to see you mention "lines of code".. Does Don actually possess the app source and is making actual code changes? I was under the impression he was updating mapped inputs into the application, i.e. at RPM "X" given throttle position "Y" and gear indicator "Z", set fuel/timing to some value..

Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk

It's all lines of code. Applications that come with Powercommanders and such only represent it as you indicated above. Don's app, which he has developed, displays things at a more basic level

[lshark]

Dave this is somewhat off topic but I thought it would be interesting to you and other folks here. I had wondered about the differences between European (specifically English) VFR 1200F's and the US model. I had a conversation with Don Guhl today and he mentioned some surprising differences he has seen since receiving several ECU's from over there for re-flashes. To start with the 1st & 2nd gear restriction is present in both ECU's but the English ECU has less restriction in 1st & 2nd gear than the US version. 3rd gear in the English version is restricted somewhat where the US version has no restriction in 3rd gear. Both versions are speed restricted which comes into play in 5th & 6th gears. Another difference is that the English ECU has somewhat more aggressive ignition timing than the US version. Guhl is making steady progress in getting rid of the ECU restrictions and has found the speed limiting restriction which was the last restriction on the list of changes we requested he address in the re-flash. He thinks there is more to be had from the ECU both in HP and in the FBW control maps. Unfortunately we have not been able to find any US owner in the north eastern US with a F model willing to let him use they're VFR1200F to fine tune and beta test these ECU changes. The reason Don feels there is more to be had is based on his experience with other Honda motorcycle ECU's. He said Honda is very conservative and he has achieved significant gains in both HP and throttle response where he has had a motorcycle to work with on his in house dyno.

I sent my ECU back to Don today to have the ECU re-flash updated to remove the speed restriction. Guhl thought they had removed this speed restriction in the 1st re-flash but when I dyno tested the 1st re-flash it was still there. They found that there was a second separate speed restriction in another line of software code. This would never have gotten past and into the field if they had had a bike in their shop to beta test the version 1 re-flash. That being said all the other restrictions he removed work as promised. All together this is a amazing piece of work for not having a bike in house to work with. As soon as I verify the speed restriction is gone via a dyno test in 5th & 6th gear he will include this feature in his re-flashes if desired.

hey i have a 2010 F (manual clutch ) and i live about 150 miles from Don... i hope to do the re flash when i have the cash but that's not right now...any idea how long he would need the bike for ??

[Bizbat]

I sent my ECU back to Don today to have the ECU re-flash updated to remove the speed restriction. Guhl thought they had removed this speed restriction in the 1st re-flash but when I dyno tested the 1st re-flash it was still there. They found that there was a second separate speed restriction in another line of software code.

John, I am surprised to see you mention "lines of code".. Does Don actually possess the app source and is making actual code changes? I was under the impression he was updating mapped inputs into the application, i.e. at RPM "X" given throttle position "Y" and gear indicator "Z", set fuel/timing to some value..

Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk

It's all lines of code. Applications that come with Powercommanders and such only represent it as you indicated above. Don's app, which he has developed, displays things at a more basic level

Surprised to hear there is actual source code and a build environment involved. This implies Honda makes available an SDK for their ECU product.. or...

Searched some keywords and found this:

http://forums.openecu.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=5879&p=27874&hilit=honda#p27874

Very cool!

[dynajohn]

Dave this is somewhat off topic but I thought it would be interesting to you and other folks here. I had wondered about the differences between European (specifically English) VFR 1200F's and the US model. I had a conversation with Don Guhl today and he mentioned some surprising differences he has seen since receiving several ECU's from over there for re-flashes. To start with the 1st & 2nd gear restriction is present in both ECU's but the English ECU has less restriction in 1st & 2nd gear than the US version. 3rd gear in the English version is restricted somewhat where the US version has no restriction in 3rd gear. Both versions are speed restricted which comes into play in 5th & 6th gears. Another difference is that the English ECU has somewhat more aggressive ignition timing than the US version. Guhl is making steady progress in getting rid of the ECU restrictions and has found the speed limiting restriction which was the last restriction on the list of changes we requested he address in the re-flash. He thinks there is more to be had from the ECU both in HP and in the FBW control maps. Unfortunately we have not been able to find any US owner in the north eastern US with a F model willing to let him use they're VFR1200F to fine tune and beta test these ECU changes. The reason Don feels there is more to be had is based on his experience with other Honda motorcycle ECU's. He said Honda is very conservative and he has achieved significant gains in both HP and throttle response where he has had a motorcycle to work with on his in house dyno.

I sent my ECU back to Don today to have the ECU re-flash updated to remove the speed restriction. Guhl thought they had removed this speed restriction in the 1st re-flash but when I dyno tested the 1st re-flash it was still there. They found that there was a second separate speed restriction in another line of software code. This would never have gotten past and into the field if they had had a bike in their shop to beta test the version 1 re-flash. That being said all the other restrictions he removed work as promised. All together this is a amazing piece of work for not having a bike in house to work with. As soon as I verify the speed restriction is gone via a dyno test in 5th & 6th gear he will include this feature in his re-flashes if desired.

hey i have a 2010 F (manual clutch ) and i live about 150 miles from Don... i hope to do the re flash when i have the cash but that's not right now...any idea how long he would need the bike for ??

Depends on what you want him to do. If you just want a standard re-flash with an existing Dynojet map just send him your ECU and he will turn it around in a couple of days and send it back to you.

If on the other hand you want to let him use your bike to develop and test with, which is really what is needed at this stage, I don't know you would need to contact him. I would expect at least 5 days minimum since he has many projects going at the same time as well as answering phone calls. Ideally he would need a stock bike with both the stock muffler assembly and a good slip on to dyno test with. This would allow him to refine existing fuel maps for both the stock muffler and a slip on. He would also be able to play with the stock ignition mapping to see if there is anything to gain by tweaking ignition maps. He told me he thought there also was improvements to be had in the TBW mapping. All of this requires a bike in his shop for however long it takes to beta test fuel mapping, ignition mapping and the TBW map. What you would get out of it is the first VFR 1200F with a fully developed re-flash and the satisfaction of helping the whole VFR 1200 community if that means anything to you.

[hvfrdave]

Thankyou dynojohn, for all your input, as it is I am more than happy with what I have achieved with my VFR1200 project, my bike runs a lot smoother, is more responsive, and is very quick, the top speed restriction, does not bother me one iota, I could loose my license very easily, as it is. I am just at the final stages of my suspension upgrade, once that's sorted, it will be BST Carbon fibre wheels, and a brake line upgrade, because that's all the brakes need, I will run standard Honda pads, because the brakes on the VFR1200 are first class.

Can we keep this thread, as the title, we seem to be getting yet another ECU re-flash thread, with respect I have shared all my expertise with you all, and I know it works, so please show this thread the same respect.