Help! F.i. Light On And Off With Brakes, Headlights, Increases In Speed... No Difference In Performance...

[Guest]

Hey guys,

Took apart the harness today and cleaned and greased the fork type connectors in the earth block... personally they were clean already and I can't imagine that did it... however I cleaned and greased every other plug connector in sight... so far the light is off?

Will keep everyone posted...

~mikeym

Took a 10 minute ride since re-assembling and the light is off... this happened the last time i disconnected the battery though... next nice day I'll take her for a 50 mile ride and bring back a report... hopefully positive...

~mikeym

[Guest]

Fingers crossed for you.

Hope to did all the RR and stator conectors as well.

[Tightwad]

I hope the issue is solved! Cleaning the connectors and beefing up the wiring is the best thing you can do...and keeping them cleaned and greased each time you take it apart is important. Dialectic grease (not Dilectric actually) is indeed NOT a conductor of electricity, its job is to seal the connection for outside contaminants.

[moose76]

I was having this exact problem when I read this tread. I pulled the "earth cluster" apart and cleaned all the contacts. Put every thing back together and the problem is gone. Bike seems to running better as well. Could just be me though.

[Guest]

So far no F.I. lights since... I recommend everyone who has had this problem take apart your connectors and clean them good!

Good deal, VFRD rocks.

[Guest]

So far no F.I. lights since... I recommend everyone who has had this problem take apart your connectors and clean them good!

Good deal, VFRD rocks.

Well well... problems back...

No problems for a week after I did the cleaning... This past weekend I took at 6 hour ride (300 miles) straight up to Mass to visit my girlfriend... parked the bike for 3 days and took a 6 hour ride back home... about 25 minutes from home I noticed the F.I. light when applying the brakes coming into a toll booth...

I rode the bike today, and while its better than before... it still shows up periodically...

SO...

I severely doubt its the earth cluster from dirt as I just cleaned it and re wrapped it tight and waterproof... It could be the R/R and Stator connectors as I rode in the rain on the way up and it may have flung dirt/grease/etc. onto those connectors... need to re-clean and inspect them....

I'm thinking I may need to add a ground connection here somewhere maybe from the earth connector, because I know its not because it got dirty... I think it just needs beefing up... is this what the VFRness is? Also does the VFRness come with detailed instructions... I'm not so confident about cutting into wiring on my bike without knowing what I'm doing... I don't know if this will fix the problem but its definitely a ground issue in my book...

~mikeym

[FireHorse]

Just thought I would throw what I've learned from my experience -- very similar problems/symptoms, but mine came from a bad connection at the switch connected to the kickstand. I was going nuts trying to figure out the problems I was having, ran through all the same steps and the problem still persisted!! Finally I read somewhere on this forum about the cut out switch at the kickstand causing some issues. Never even thought about that!!! Clean the bugger and problems solved. FWIW... good luck!

[Guest]

Just thought I would throw what I've learned from my experience -- very similar problems/symptoms, but mine came from a bad connection at the switch connected to the kickstand. I was going nuts trying to figure out the problems I was having, ran through all the same steps and the problem still persisted!! Finally I read somewhere on this forum about the cut out switch at the kickstand causing some issues. Never even thought about that!!! Clean the bugger and problems solved. FWIW... good luck!

Biked randomly died on me tonight at a stopsign... I went to restart but I got no neutral light or fuel pump prime... then I turned her off for 3-4 minutes and turned back on and she fired up... (can't remember if I put the kickstand down or not in that time) All the way home I had almost a solid red light...

I was riding it a lot around town with a buddy and she was pretty warm 215 degrees or so... I have oiled the chain not to long ago and I did notice it throws oil on that switch... especially when its hot and the chain heats up...

I have noticed that this could be a problem... Is there a way to bypass this switch? Like cut and tie some wires together?

As of lately I don't want to take my bike out for fear she won't run...

~mikeym

[Guest]

A friend with a 5th gen had a no start problem caused by bared (shorting out periodically) wire leading to a barometric pressure sensor located on the right hand side under the rear bodywork. Caused by poor factory routing of the wires which rubbed through on a bolt. It didn't cause an FI light but it caused the bike to die suddenly, then fuel pump would not prime and bike would turn over but not start. He's had no problems since he found the bared wire and corrected it. It's worth a look under there.

[Guest]

When my problem was really bad, the bike would cut out, and I found that flicking the kill switch off and then on again reset the system. At one time I replaced the sidestand switch, as the glow from the FI light would increase with the stand movement. I'd still be inclined to suspect the earth cluster, as I cleaned mine many times in the hunt for the problem.

Good luck :pissed:

[Guest]

Just thought I would throw what I've learned from my experience -- very similar problems/symptoms, but mine came from a bad connection at the switch connected to the kickstand. I was going nuts trying to figure out the problems I was having, ran through all the same steps and the problem still persisted!! Finally I read somewhere on this forum about the cut out switch at the kickstand causing some issues. Never even thought about that!!! Clean the bugger and problems solved. FWIW... good luck!

I did throw a code once for a Baro sensor... however that was a year ago... and it seemed to be a freak incident... hmm...

[Guest]

I'm in FI light hell as well. :fing02:

I have a VFRness installed, new R/R, beefed up the battery ground, cleaned the earth cluster about 1 month ago. Everything was fine for a while. I rode 200 miles yesterday, started to get weak fluttering in the FI light once in a while. It usually happened when the bike is first started, and giving it a bit of revs would make the light go out. This morning I tried to leave for work, turn the key and everything seemed normal, but the bike would only fire while the starter button was pressed in. If I let go of the starter it would die. Solid, bright FI light, no fluttering. I pushed back into the garage, and quickly checked all the fuses, none were blown. Flipped the key back on and the bike started right up, but the FI light is fully on. Left it parked and took the F650 to work. I guess I should be glad I have a 2nd bike, but I kinda hate the BMW, so it wasn't much of a comfort.

I'm getting REALLY sick of dealing with the electrical system on this bike. I'd like to rule out the earth cluster once and for all. I was thinking of splicing in a 14 gauge wire across all the wires leading into the clip and grounding it under the R/R. My hesitations are 1) will I affect whatever is meant to plug into that clip and 2) which side of the clip to splice into. I figure that clip opens for a reason, like some sort of Honda testing tool plugs in there? If attach a new ground on the 'earth' side of the clip, I won't be bypassing the clip, but I'm not sure how to determine which is the 'downstream' side of the clip.

Anyone have thought's on this? I've had it up to the teeth with this bike being unreliable. I've got the green light from the wife to get a newer bike, and as much as I love my 5th Gen, I need a bike I can trust.

[Guest]

I cut all the wires off the earth cluster, joined 3 or 4 together, and then put them in an eye crimp. Same with the rest, then joined them all together with a bolt and nut, with an extra wire running to an earth point. So far in over a year, things have been fine. I also cut off the RR and stator conectors, and used household electrical blocks (screw type) to join them up. I also ran an extra lead from the RR out positive lead, through a 15amp fuse to the battery. All a bit makeshift but seemed to work well.

[Guest]

I cut all the wires off the earth cluster, joined 3 or 4 together, and then put them in an eye crimp. Same with the rest, then joined them all together with a bolt and nut, with an extra wire running to an earth point. So far in over a year, things have been fine.

Good to know, I'm going to try the same thing. I'm worried that clip is meant for some diagnostic tool to be inserted into the harness. I peeped around in the manual, couldn't find anything. Glad I'll be in good company when I chop that junk out and bin it.

Last night I jumpered my FI system and got 8 flashes, which claims the problem is the TP sensor. Of course, the bike seems to run fine. I'm going to attack that earth cluster, reset the diagnostic code, and hope it's all ok. If I get it running, I'll probably just drive to a cliff, so I can push the bike off. :biggrin: But maybe not. Something about the V4, driving it for more than 2 blocks usually makes me a lot less mad about whatever problem it was having.

[enzed_viffer]

This thread is very similar to my "WTF's Wrong Widdit?" thread, in that I'm having similar symptoms, but without the FI light ever being illuminated (except as normal, during the startup check).

I've had intermittent misfiring, initially only when the engine was very hot, but now any time. I had a few occasions when the engine cut out completely then restarted. Sometimes when I use the horn (standard horn plus 2 Fiamms), the engine will hesitate and almost die. Yesterday, I was accelerating hard onto the motorway (freeway) and it cut out abruptly at around 10k rpm for maybe a second or less.

So far I have:

- Changed the battery (it's charging fine, and voltages are in spec)

- Changed the plugs

- Disconnected/reconnected the PCII (problem remained)

- Checked and cleaned the connectors for the TPS (and broke the latch on the plug getting it back on), the barometric sensor, the MAP sensor, the fuel cutout relay, the main ground on the right frame, the ground on the battery, the ground cluster on the left, the plugs/pins on the ECU, the main gray connector on the left above the radiator, the sidestand cutout switch, the left side switches (horn and indicators). BTW - ALL the connectors were perfectly clean and free from any hint of corrosion, but I cleaned them anyway.

- Disconnected and reconnected the PAIR valves (apparetnly dirty PAIR vlaves can make the bike run badly).

- After reading the solution to the same problem on the UK VFR forums, I pulled all of the wired out of the ground connector on the left by the R/R, mashed all the pins flat, tied them in a bundle with some copper tape, filled it with solder and soldered a new ground to the bundle. I connected the new ground under the left side subframe bolt.

- Connected a new dedicated ground to pin B1 on the ECU, and the subframe.

- Took the resistors out of the O2 sensor lugs, checked their resistance (330ohm and 329 ohm), cleaned the plug, put the resistors back and retaped over the pugs.

- Checked the connection for the speed sensor wire, where I'd cut and extended it to connect to the speedo corrector (since expired). Why the ECU wants to know what speed the bike is doing, I dunno, but apparently it does. :laugh:

Thus far, the problem remains. :laugh: It's intermittent, there are no error codes and never have been.

However, there are still some more connectors/switches to check and clean:

- The bank angle sensor and other plugs behind the instruments, which I will do when I replace my blown headlight bulb.

- The connectors under the airbox (for the neutral switch, cam angle sensor, injectors and whatnot).

- The connectors for the ECT and IAT.

- I will try bypassing the sidestand switch.

- The ignition switch.

- The kill switch.

This is really ridiculous! Many of the things I've done (like cleaning connectors, putting in new grounds) are supposed to be THE cure for this problem, but have made no difference, or only a very shortlived (and therefore coincidental) difference. Soon I'm going to run out of things to check or clean, and I've lost faith that anything I can do will fix it, short of setting fire to the bike. All this work is starting to get me down, and it's making the fairing fasteners kinda tired (me too!)

I'm starting to make mistakes too, like last week I dropped two airbox screws into the black hole in the engine V, retrieved both, then dropped one again. Couldn't find it, so I gave up after searching and dismantling for nearly an hour.

It's waste of time paying a dealer to do this, as there are no fault codes to diagnose, and it will cost $$$$ to have them fruitlessly doing the same kind of things I've been doing (assuming they are even aware of any of these 'common' faults and fixes.)

[enzed_viffer]

UPDATE:

I've done some more work on the bike, and it didn't seem to make much difference. It's running really well, strong and fast, apart from when I'm tootling along on a constant small throttle opening, when it is not very happy, and runs irregularly, like it's got random hiccups.

I had to change the left-hand headlight bulb, and unfortunately some jackass tucked the wires for the new(ish) heated grips up under the front cowl in such a way as to make it difficult to access the left hand bulb. :biggrin: So, I pulled the front fairing, and cleaned all the plugs behind there. (And replaced the bulb).

On Friday, I removed the aircleaner, and cleaned all the plugs under there, apart from the one for the ECT. I also retrieved the screw for the PAIR solenoid bracket, which I dropped (twice!) during my last session. Ooops...

Just in case, I also relocated the dedicated ECU ground, gave the ignition switch a good cleaning with contact cleaner, and checked all the hoses and things under the fuel tank.

Where to from here? I have no idea.

I have to remove the forks again, and send them back for respringing and revalving. Apparently, the 0.95 springs Sonic's calculator recommends (as does Racetech) are too firm for NZ's goat tracks, and better suited for the racetrack or US road surfaces. In fact, Ohlins recommends 0.85 springs, considerably softer, and much closer to the stock 0.74s than what I had fitted. As a result, the valving is also too firm as it was carefully matched to the spring rate. It was better once I got the rear end dialed in during a LOOOONG ride on Friday, but then I got tired and confused, and ended up making the settings even worse. So, CKT Racetech are re-doing the work free of charge, apart from freight and a minor charge for the springs, as I didn't buy them from them in the first place. So, it means the bike will be laid up for a week, and any work I do won't be testable. Then I have to dial the rear shock in again, but at least I'll be able to ignore the front.

When I get it back together, I'll try disconnecting the PCII (just in case there was a problem there I overlooked), bypass the sidestand switch, run another couple of tanks of high-octane gas through, and hope for the best. Hopefully, somewhere in Interdweebland someone will come up with the same problem AND a solution I haven't yet tried.

[Guest]

UPDATE:

I've done some more work on the bike, and it didn't seem to make much difference. It's running really well, strong and fast, apart from when I'm tootling along on a constant small throttle opening, when it is not very happy, and runs irregularly, like it's got random hiccups.

I had to change the left-hand headlight bulb, and unfortunately some jackass tucked the wires for the new(ish) heated grips up under the front cowl in such a way as to make it difficult to access the left hand bulb. :cool: So, I pulled the front fairing, and cleaned all the plugs behind there. (And replaced the bulb).

On Friday, I removed the aircleaner, and cleaned all the plugs under there, apart from the one for the ECT. I also retrieved the screw for the PAIR solenoid bracket, which I dropped (twice!) during my last session. Ooops...

Just in case, I also relocated the dedicated ECU ground, gave the ignition switch a good cleaning with contact cleaner, and checked all the hoses and things under the fuel tank.

Where to from here? I have no idea.

I have to remove the forks again, and send them back for respringing and revalving. Apparently, the 0.95 springs Sonic's calculator recommends (as does Racetech) are too firm for NZ's goat tracks, and better suited for the racetrack or US road surfaces. In fact, Ohlins recommends 0.85 springs, considerably softer, and much closer to the stock 0.74s than what I had fitted. As a result, the valving is also too firm as it was carefully matched to the spring rate. It was better once I got the rear end dialed in during a LOOOONG ride on Friday, but then I got tired and confused, and ended up making the settings even worse. So, CKT Racetech are re-doing the work free of charge, apart from freight and a minor charge for the springs, as I didn't buy them from them in the first place. So, it means the bike will be laid up for a week, and any work I do won't be testable. Then I have to dial the rear shock in again, but at least I'll be able to ignore the front.

When I get it back together, I'll try disconnecting the PCII (just in case there was a problem there I overlooked), bypass the sidestand switch, run another couple of tanks of high-octane gas through, and hope for the best. Hopefully, somewhere in Interdweebland someone will come up with the same problem AND a solution I haven't yet tried.

Took mine to the dealer this past week and they claimed it was fine just ride it with the F.I. light on... I paid 90 dollars for nothing... obviously the F.I. light is not supposed to go on and off and blink and stuff... gah! I was going to tear back into the ground block but i don't know...

Mike

[Guest]

Took mine to the dealer this past week and they claimed it was fine just ride it with the F.I. light on... I paid 90 dollars for nothing... obviously the F.I. light is not supposed to go on and off and blink and stuff... gah! I was going to tear back into the ground block but i don't know...

Mike

You mean this grounding block: :cool:

[enzed_viffer]

Took mine to the dealer this past week and they claimed it was fine just ride it with the F.I. light on... I paid 90 dollars for nothing... obviously the F.I. light is not supposed to go on and off and blink and stuff... gah! I was going to tear back into the ground block but i don't know...

Mike

You mean this grounding block: :cool:

Yeah - that's him. Stupid bloody thing. :wheel:

What's the other plug (or plugs)? R/R?

[Guest]

Yeah - that's him. Stupid bloody thing. :cool:

What's the other plug (or plugs)? R/R?

Yep. My R/R went tits up a couple months ago (~50K miles). In finding that, I also found the clip between the R/R and the stator was crispy. I now have 4 extra ground wires, a VFRNess, and the ground block removed. No flickering FI light, no flickering anything. At idle when the bike is hot voltage will still drop a bit, my aftermarket voltage warning light goes yellow sitting at a stop and will event turn red if I have the Zumo and a turn signal all fired up while stopped. I think adding thicker wires from the stator to the R/R would resolve that. But driving, I'm getting no warnings, and everything seems to be back to 'normal'.

I could post up some pics of the work I did to chop out the ground block, but there's not much to see at this point, it's all wrapped in e-tape. Still, if anyone thinks it would help, I'm happy to snap some pictures. There were 8 green wires and 6 green w/black wires running through the block. I chopped it out, and grounded all of them. Now all 8 green connect to each other, with a 14ga wire grounding them to where the subframe attaches to the main frame on the rider's right. Did the same for the 6 green only, with their own ground to the frame in the same way. I noticed one of the ground wires in the VFRNess was turning black at the connector, so added another ground from the R/R to the frame while I was at it. On the battery, I have 3 x 14ga wires bundled together, going from the minus terminal to where the subframe attaches to the main frame on the left side. It was a bit of a hassle, but I think getting rid of that ground block and doing the beef up them wires work is a must for anyone with a 5th (and maybe 6th?) generation VFR.

Too bad my suspension needs help... Guess I have to have some reason to pull the bike apart :laugh: :fing02:

[Guest]

whelp gents... i took the ground block apart again... i individually wrapped the 6 pin connector and 8 pin connector in copper wire and ran the wires out both sides of the ground block (see photo) and then over to the stock ground point on the bike... I put fork connectors on the end and cleaned everything good... i then wrapped the block and wires in electrical tape so they are watertight...

put it back together and va-la... no f.i. light monkey business so far... but then again this happened before... we'll see how long it lasts until the light comes back :blush: ... i think the dash lights are brighter now...