KevCarver

Nice presentation! Thanks for the "Pop Up Video" style info nuggets, too. Now I know why you're replacing the flywheel along with the stator. Not having a Vtec, I had no idea about the rotor upgrade.

I will admit that the Shorai packaging is a much better replacement option over the more DIY versions like MOTY. But I'm not sure why some people seem to be claiming the Shorai internally is a much better option. They are the same chemistry, no? I'm in no way suggesting you should have bought one over the other, just wondering why some are slagging the MOTY over the Shorai. Again, aside from packaging and ease of installation. Talking about day to day starting and riding.

As for the "get you home" aspect; I had my RC51 stator apparently die on my recently, as I noted in another thread. It must have started shortly before my final fuel stop, as it cranked slightly slowly but started. The ride home was probably an hour, after which it would not crank at all. This was the MOTY. After this, I re-installed the AGM and went for a short ride. Probably 30 or less. After that ride, it would not crank at all. Neither battery showed any decrease in performance while riding, although they were not allowed in that time to drain fully. Both were around 10v when I got back. Not nearly enough to spin the big Twin. I'd have to think the "get you home" factor is not much of a difference.

Well, I'm in no way qualified to determine whether or not the MOTY led to my Stator(s) failing. Buuuut, I've since removed them all. Including from the VFR which had no symptoms of impending failure. It is the only non-stock, non OE stator. Bought a new AGM yesterday, charged it up overnight, and stuck it in there today.

Again, the VFR had no problems with the MOTY. 1200+ miles over the 4 1/2 days of TMac. Strong charging, started every time, never below 13 at key on.

My R/R went out shortly after installing the MOTY, not sure if it was the cause but did not like the timing.

R/R's (all 3) are fine

I'll let ya know when it's finalized!

But I did find a left side engine cover including stator for the RC51. Was cheap, hopefully worthwhile...

wow...you are the STATOR KILLER..............

when we gonna work on 'em?

Got to find money for parts. Unfortunately I just found something completely unnecessary that I must have!

Soooo, when we gonna put your the '01 back together?

Well, I'm in no way qualified to determine whether or not the MOTY led to my Stator(s) failing. Buuuut, I've since removed them all. Including from the VFR which had no symptoms of impending failure. It is the only non-stock, non OE stator. Bought a new AGM yesterday, charged it up overnight, and stuck it in there today.

Again, the VFR had no problems with the MOTY. 1200+ miles over the 4 1/2 days of TMac. Strong charging, started every time, never below 13 at key on.

Seems pretty weird. Not sure how the battery would damage both stators though. Hope it's not a trend or I'll be letting you know soon when mine fails. I still have the stock regulator and stator in my 2001 VFR with 44k miles on it. The MOTY battery was put in about a month ago without any problems yet.

Otherwise, stator diagnosis seems pretty sound?

OK, so AC voltage checks out on both RC and PC. However, the book also suggests checking for continuity between the stator plug and ground. Should NOT be continuity. It seems as though both bikes DO have continuity to ground on all three connectors. Low continuity plus the AC voltage being ok leads me to surmise that the stators both charge, but not at full capacity. Which is where I'm at currently. Haha, currently! Get it?!

The VFR, by the way, with new Ricks stator has zero continuity on the plug. That tells me I'm performing the test correctly, at least.

So, seriously? I need Two new stators at the same time? The only similarity between the circumstances being the MOTY. Coincidence? Five years and over 55,000 miles difference in the two machines.

Thoughts?

Cool, I think I can manage that. I was thinking it was ohms and whatnot. That's the r/r?

Nah you can also do the ohms test, but I've had stators pass the ohms test but not deliver any AC voltage! Ergo, I think the ohms test is freakin' useless.

Ah, I see. AC voltage test it is, then. Will do shortly. Apparently you and I are the only ones interested...

So I'm left with coincidental simultaneous stator failures as a theory at the moment. If memory serves, the proper test procedure requires a slightly more advanced multi-meter than I have. Need to read up on that...

It just has to do AC voltage - the $7 unit I got from Tightwad does that!

Just disconnect the stator plug and start the bike. While it's running, check the AC voltage between pins 1-2, 1-3, and then 2-3 on the output of the stator. They should be about 18-22 volts, but all the same. Then rev the engine to 5,000rpm, hold it there and repeat the test. The AC voltage this time should be about 65 volts, but again they all need to read the same.

If you get different voltages on the three readings (any more than, say, a volt or two), then the stator is stuffed.

Cool, I think I can manage that. I was thinking it was ohms and whatnot. That's the r/r?

Too soon to blame MOTY? Or did the MOTY's somehow compromise my charging systems?

Unlikely that the MOTY compromised the charging system. If anything, it would be the other way around. Most likely your stator and/or reg/rec has crapped out and it's drained the MOTY dead.

The thing with the MOTY batteries is that their amp/hour rating is lower than for a similar SIZED lead acid battery (even though they weigh less), but they have more cranking power per rated capacity. What's likely happened is that your charging system has died and it has drained your MOTY battery flat, which takes a lot less time than it would for a lead acid battery. Pretty sure the stock batteries are about 10 amp/hour, but the MOTY is 4 amp/hour. At 1 amp of drain, the MOTY will last a lot less time than the stock lead acid battery.

And hence the problem. If your bike has an unreliable charging system, the MOTY batteries aren't necessarily the best option because they may not get you home. Pretty sure a VFR with its headlights on is going to be pulling at least 10 amps consistently (2 x 55 watt globes = 110 watts / 12 volts = ~10 amps, more if you add in your fuel pump, ECU, injectors, dash, and accessories).

What I think is still "up for debate" is what effect a MOTY battery (or other LiFePO4 batteries) have over a long period of time (say, 10,000 miles or more) on a charging system that uses a regulator which dumps current into the stator when its regulating. Does the charging system have to do more regulation more often? Does this heat up the stator more than with a lead acid battery? Does this then burn up the stator? Only time (Edit: and a lot of miles spread across many different people with these batteries) will tell if a pattern emerges.

Ok, so here's my answer to this. The SP1 had, from the day I bought it (2.5 years ago), a strong charging system. The PC800 was pretty good until the r/r plug started arcing. So I replaced it with a MOSFET FH010 and wired the dc output direct to the battery. With a voltmeter wired in to the accessory plug, I had reading of mid to high 13's at idle. Same with the RC, stock charging system, measured at the battery via multi-meter.

Both with AGM batteries.

Swapped with the MOTY units at the beginning of the year, pretty much the same numbers but higher resting voltage.

Saturday, 90% of the day was incident free. Last gas stop the battery sounded slightly low and was unable to start the bike after another hour of highway riding. Swapped to old AGM and was unable to start after a short ride- 20-30 min. Load tested that battery today, and it tested fine. MOTY is holding it's charge since I recharged it Saturday.

The PC is able to restart itself, but the voltmeter readings are low 12's to mid 11's now. That's into discharge levels. Same numbers- AGM and MOTY.

I swapped r/r's between the VFR and PC today with no changes in either.

So I'm left with coincidental simultaneous stator failures as a theory at the moment. If memory serves, the proper test procedure requires a slightly more advanced multi-meter than I have. Need to read up on that...

I guess my best bet at this point is swap the r/r's in the PC800 and VFR, since they are the same connectors. Again, no issues from the VFR at this point. So if the PC charges and the VFR doesn't I'll have something.

It's always possible that both my remaining AGM batteries are dead. They're not new, although I've kept them on the float chargers since removing them. Had that problem with the VFR. Battery was fine, then I took it all apart for all my work over the winter. When I reinstalled it, it failed. Despite showing a full charge and being on the charger.

The SP1 has OE stator and r/r.

The PC800 has likely the OE stator and I replaced the r/r with a FH010 from a ZX10, which is essentially the same as the MOSFET FH012 from the R1. Plus I wired the DC output direct to the battery.

It's wierd to me that both bikes, nearly simultaneously, developed the same symptoms.

The '99 VFR has a FH012 wired to the battery like the PC800, and a brand new Ricks stator. Still running the MOTY with zero trouble.

Too soon to blame MOTY? Or did the MOTY's somehow compromise my charging systems?

Unlikely that the MOTY compromised the charging system. If anything, it would be the other way around. Most likely your stator and/or reg/rec has crapped out and it's drained the MOTY dead.

The thing with the MOTY batteries is that their amp/hour rating is lower than for a similar SIZED lead acid battery (even though they weigh less), but they have more cranking power per rated capacity. What's likely happened is that your charging system has died and it has drained your MOTY battery flat, which takes a lot less time than it would for a lead acid battery. Pretty sure the stock batteries are about 10 amp/hour, but the MOTY is 4 amp/hour. At 1 amp of drain, the MOTY will last a lot less time than the stock lead acid battery.

And hence the problem. If your bike has an unreliable charging system, the MOTY batteries aren't necessarily the best option because they may not get you home. Pretty sure a VFR with its headlights on is going to be pulling at least 10 amps consistently (2 x 55 watt globes = 110 watts / 12 volts = ~10 amps, more if you add in your fuel pump, ECU, injectors, dash, and accessories).

What I think is still "up for debate" is what effect a MOTY battery (or other LiFePO4 batteries) have on a charging system which uses a regulator which dumps current into the stator when its regulating. Does the charging system have to do more regulation more often? Does this heat up the stator more than with a lead acid battery? Does this then burn up the stator? Only time will tell.

Hmm, I only had time for a quick read through because I'm getting ready to head to work. But, your first and last paragraphs seem to be at odds with each other.

Interestinger and interestinger...

PC800 with the AGM I originally got with it shows basically the same voltage as the MOTY did. Running, it shows about .4 lower on the volt meter than the readout on my multi meter direct on the terminals.

RC with it's AGM again runs great, but no installed meter. Again came home and it would not re-fire after a minute.

Too soon to blame MOTY? Or did the MOTY's somehow compromise my charging systems?

Perhaps I spoke too soon on my other MOTY installed bikes...

I just went to the store on the PC800. Mid to low 12's at key on, which is a full volt lower than any other time previous to this. Running and at speed was barely 12, in the 11's most of the time, and into the 10's with brake lights on...

I suppose the 15 year/67000+ mile old stator could be an issue, but it's quite a coincidence!

Need to swap that battery out for the old AGM and take a ride, I suppose.

By the way, the meter is wired into the original equipment accessory plug provided in the harness for the optional radio. Don't know if that makes much difference to whether it could be charging system or battery issues. Thoughts?

Checked it today: lights came on and fuel pump primed, but no start. 10 volts at the battery.

Swapped out for the AGM and it fired up and has 12v at idle. All R/R connectors are fine.

MOTY went on the Battery Tender (I know not recommended, but not much to loose at this point) at was nearly 13v. So I took it off and will check back tomorrow to see if it's holding.

This was the one I had in the RC51, which is set up nearly identical to the 5th Gen as far as battery and R/R location in relation to the rear cylinder head. The tail on both the RC and 5th get very hot under the plastic.

Rode all day- zero issues, then the last fuel stop before home the starter was slightly weak but started. Concerned at the time, but not overly so because: it did start easily, I was wearing earplugs (hard to get a good read on the sound), and big twins are a bit tough to get spinning anyway.

When I got home the battery would not turn the starter at all. Never a hitch on the final leg. Didn't get a look at the headlights, cause it didn't occur to me to look.

It is the only bike I have with the stock R/R, but like I mentioned it ran 100% issue free.

Last day of TMac was similar circumstances and ambient temperature with my 5th Gen, but it is fine. The three full days at Tmac before that were cooler out, but still full days of riding with no problems with that MOTY.

The third one is in my Pacific Coast which does commuter and grocery getter duties. Warm out, but pretty short trips. 20-30 minutes at a time, usually.

VFR and PC800 have voltmeters, and they read fine at all times. 13+ at key on, good charging voltage when running. I haven't yet put a voltmeter on the RC because it has always been a strong charger at idle checked with my multi-meter.

I'll need to get out there and start it up with the AGM battery and check it over first, of course, but it is not looking good for the MOTY...

HS

Could you take some close up shots of how all of these parts attach to your plastic. For some reason I just can't visualize it. Would this work on the 03 models as well?

I'd be interested in seeing some close up "fairing off" pics too. I can't quite visualize how these things work. But it's a great idea!

It's pretty simple! If you get some from KurveyGirl, don't get the rivet type. Get the clip style, and they clip part slips over the inner fairing. Just have to remove the well nut first, and maybe drill out the hole on the outer fairing. If you have a step bit, one more step does it. The fastener has a ridge on it in order to hold a washer. That keeps it "captive" on the outer fairing, should you choose. I don't on my ABS fairings, cause it's kinda tight. Works great on fiberglass race bodies though.

KG sells two length- 12 and 14mm. I used 12 on the sides, but needed 14 on the top beside the tank. This is on the 5th gen, by the way. That has a metal tab that holds the well nut, plus the fairing, and the inner fairing piece. So extra material is too thick for the 12mm.

KurveyGirl DZUS

HS had a write up for the big side bolts, where he used the pull apart quick release key chain to use as fasteners. Don't know if that is still around, or how long he kept using them. Seemed like a good idea. Pretty much the same as the Sargent quick release pinss used on the 5th gen "Frankenbolts."

We'll have to talk at TMac, I'm wondering about the single nut axle. Specifically if you can get a second made, and at what cost...

Let's get the '01 finished up, I've got ideas for other spare parts you have laying around in the garage!

The '10 CBR1000RR has rotor outer surface to outer surface distance of 138mm measured by me. That works out to 133mm center to center with 5mm rotor thickness. This should be the same for '08 onwards and the axle is Ø25mm and rotors are Ø320mm. Hope this helps

For what it's worth, I measured the RC51 from the outside edges of the rotors and got 141-142ish.

Very cool! I'm a fan of the CB wheel, but I figured it would have fit straight away.

Yesterday I started with this:

Almost done!

You're way ahead of Cornercarver! I don't think he's going to allow me over anymore. Every time I go to his house more stuff comes off his bike. There's not much left to take off...

Is it me or does the headlight look like it's pointed WAY too far down to be any good at night? The bike looks good.

I picked up the Buell Headlight because of the angled style. The bulbs and the reflector inside the lens are angled to almost be squared off with the forks. The flyscreen makes it look worse than it is.

I had the same thought, but the head on pic shows the bulbs basically dead level horizontally.

BTW, cool idea for the tank grip pad!

Cool looking wheel! Usually pics are way too big, not these...

Have you had any chance to do anything more? If you go ahead with your tail idea, give me first crack at your Sargent?