sfdownhill

Greetings all, I'm just back from 5 weeks at the far end of a 40 mile long lake in Washington state [Lake Chelan] and am very grateful to Duc2V4 for keeping up with the communications while I've been off the map. Duc has also been maintaining and updating the master spreadsheet of all deposits received and orders placed for headers. I currently have 72 VFRD notifications to attend to; this post begins the next step of burrowing into the task of catching up on this thread and responding to all PMs. I'll briefly review the latest PMs for breaking news, then start at the chronological beginning of unanswered messages/posts. Here is the raw data about the current production run of headers: The bad news first: A miscommunication occurred with Wade [The fabricator] somewhere along the line. Around last December we thought we got a new lower minimum order quantity of six units, down from a past minimum 15 unit order to get a production run started. We accumulated 8 orders and deposits and took those to Wade [In June], where we were informed that the minimum order has always been 15, because that is the minimum job size Wade's mandrel bending subcontractor requires to set up his machinery to bend the tubes for our complex exhaust systems. At this point, I'll take the bullet for miscommunication. At some point I heard a new 6 unit minimum order was an option because I hoped that was a possibility. This misunderstanding cannot have fallen to Duc2V4 because he is not the one who brought the 'new lower minimum order' back to the forum members and this thread - I brought that mistaken information and take responsibility for it. I apologize most sincerely. Wade was understanding of the predicament I caused between he and all the people who placed orders, but was very clear in communicating that it is impossible for him to build production runs of 6 units unless he purchases tubing for 15 units and pays to have it all mandrel bent. Stocking mandrel bent tubing for the remaining 9 units would absorb storage space and business capital he has committed to other projects. This turn of events may understandably be too frustrating for some who have placed deposits to continue, and, if so, we are happy to promptly return any deposits in full. The not-so-bad news: We now have orders for 10 units [Maybe a couple more after I check PMs] and continue to build toward our next production run of 15 or more units. Our relationship with Wade remains positive and stable. I look forward to answering any questions and getting caught up on PMs and this thread.

Flya, you’ve hit on the difficulty in interpreting dyno charts - what do they mean to the way a motorcycle actually rides? If one is lucky enough to take the two motorcycles in question - Hammerdrill’s 6 gen and Samuelx’s 8 gen - out for a 100 miles or so that includes a bit of city surface streets, a bit of freeway, and healthy helping of one’s favorite twisty roads (I was exactly this lucky), the conclusion drawn would actually be that the 8 gen has more power, and certainly more grunt. This impression comes from the midrange, and my subjective opinion Is that unless we are riding our VFRs on a racetrack or our favorite twisty roads also include 1/2-mile or longer straightaways, we don’t get to tap into the top end power of our motorcycles very often at all. Midrange is where we reside and midrange is what gets us out of a corner. This header project has helped me develop a great respect for torque and hp numbers between 6000 and 10,000 rpms, and it’s taught me the value of professional dyno tuning to precisely and deliberately make both curves - torque and horsepower - smooth and linear so the motorcycle is very pleasantly and eagerly responsive In a predictable manner.

Gentlemen, our fellow VFRD member Hammerdrill has run into health problems that have forced him to hang up his riding gear. Sadly, in addition to losing a riding brother, his 6 gen [Named Lola] is now up for sale. This was our 6 gen test bike for dyno tuning on the header project:

RIGHT?!

Hi Jim - well, you've found a combination that will need a little more research. -The map for 6 gen was created with a PCV -We know it is possible to convert PC3 maps to be used on PCV -What we don't know [yet] is whether a PCV map can be 'downconverted' to work on a PC3 We did receive your payment for the map and will send the map as soon as it is determined whether [1] you will be able to use the 6 gen map for PCV with your PC3, or [2] you decide to opt up to PCV

Worth checking into! There will be NO critique coming from me about struggling to find info on this thread - I’ve been trying for the past two weeks to find the prices Wade quoted for 5 gen midpipe mufflers - they’re here somewhere...I KNOW they are, because I flippin’ posted ‘em! NICE Flya! Worth the wait. It really shows how careful and thorough you’ve been. Let us know how the ride is! You da man, capn! I’ll ping you to learn more about center stand bolting from the middle outward. I’m sitting here right now with a set of headers to go onto my 5 gen and the angst is palpable whether to install center stand or opt out. I look forward to learning how to make it an option instead of a major commitment. capn, check in w Duc2V4 on RB w autotune - he’s loving it on both his 5 gen (w WiLD headers) and his 6 gen (w WiLD headers standing by, about to be installed)

Hi smokescreen. As Duc2V4 mentioned, the first run of 8 gen headers is sold, but we have started a list of deposits placed toward the next run. The fabricator only needs six orders to do production run, not the fifteen that were required earlier. Your 2014 with K&N HA-8098 air filter and Arrow slipon will rock with a set of headers. The 8 gen has a newer cam design that emphasizes midrange, and the headers really kick that into gear - 16% increase in both hp and torque at 7000rpm. Having a dyno in your shop is a huge bonus - you’ll be able to dabble with VFRD member Mohawk’s big airbox mod, and maybe a double velocity stack setup once you’ve opened up the airbox. Mohawk is definitely ‘Da Man’ (Actually he’s one of many Da Men here) when it comes to doing excellent work and getting a VFR to howl. 5, 6, and 8 gens share the same shape airbox, so these 5 gen mods could be done on your 2014: Oops - here’s part 1 of the velocity stacks thread:

Jawdroppingly gorgeous tubeset, ducnut. Fine work.

Cool beans, boOZZIE. Even simpler than the T-bolt clamp solution we were struggling with.

Hi MrSquiggle - between chuckles from enjoying your username, I can let you know we have a couple sets of 6 gen headers available from the last production run. I’ll PM you with more info.

We have run our 5 gen and 6 gen test bikes without the heat shield behind the right rearset with no problems.

Looks great - love the grey with gold wheels, boOZZIE! I've fired one up without mufflers...sounds like an NHRA dragster... VFR rightside up [2] 07 29 16.mp4

Thanks Jay! It’s been awesome to learn so much about the machines our community loves and get a much-wanted component out to the guys. Wouldn’t have happened if you hadn’t been gracious enough to let me ride your wonderfully harmonized 5 gen with its headers and a fantastic tune by Mike Velasco.

Looking great Ducnut!

Hi Maritan - got your PM and thanks for your interest. I’m writing from my phone just now, so I don’t have the dyno charts you requested, but will attach them to a PM when I get back to my laptop tonight. My subjective opinion is that the 8 gen benefits from the headers the most; more than 5 gen or 6 gen. This is due to the symbiosis between Honda redesigning the 8 gen’s cams to beef up the midrange and the headers’ increased breathing capacity. The resulting 16% increase in horsepower and torque at 7000rpm is a fun kick in the pants. In short, we are between production runs and sold out of 8 gen headers at the moment - sorry the timing is off for your project. We will be gathering orders for another production run as folks chime in for more headers. Wade the builder will do a production run when we have six committed orders, so the entry point is more easily reached than the previous minimum of fifteen orders.

That is hilarious - it really does look like your 6 gen is peering curiously into the header box!

Hey Flya - Vfr800witdawaffle is here...I just started a new PM and for recipient typed in vfr800wi and before I got to ‘waffle’ his username popped right up. Let me know if you have further difficulties tracking him down and I’ll see if I can get the two of you connected.

Update - we picked up the current batch of 5/6 gen headers earlier this week. Wade built 3 extra sets of 5/6 gen headers, so if anyone who already has headers and has installed them let a fellow VFR owner try their bike and it did for them what it did for me when I first rode a 5 gen with tuned Two Brothers headers, just point them over here. Yes, the previous sentence is a savage example of untethered run-on. Plus there are still 3 sets of 8 gen headers available. One of these 8 gen headers has been optimized for a front radiator conversion on a 5th or 6th gen. This one set of 5/6/8 gen headers has 2 additional O2 sensor bungs in OEM 5/6 gen locations. The seventeen headers for VFRD members were dropped off for passivating. Here they are on pallets, eagerly awaiting their refreshing nitric acid dip. Should be through the process in a week: Like the song says ‘And a little bit closer now’: Below are the J-pipes (rear cylinder primaries). The shorter J-pipes at the top of the photo are for cylinder #3 right rear, and the longer J-pipes at the bottom of the photo are for cylinder #1 left rear:

FYI Seb, six of the current production run of headers are intended for 6th gen VFRs. The sixth six gen’s sixth sick sheik etc etc

Update - the current production run of headers has been completed! Wade is finishing off by adding the last few bungs, and we will head up to his shop to pick them up next Monday, then drop them off at the passivators. Thanks to everyone for their patience and support. Cogswell - thanks for the excellent weight comparison. Those of us who have installed the new headers have all been reveling in the throttle response and torque - here’s a quote from VFRD member Vfr800witdawaffle after he installed his 8 gen headers: ”So guys....I rode the bike today with the new headers and my lord!!! My bike is literally scary now. I feel like I have to hold onto the bars for dear life as this demon of a bike growls and propels me forward with the speed of a space X rocket. Traction control constantly kicks in if I try to gun it in first and second gear. Now I have trouble trying to accelerate in 1st and second. Also I don’t have the rapid bike module yet and it’s running super rich but It might have adjusted. When I first started the bike a whole bunch of I unburnt fuel was spraying out the headers for a little and then it calmed down. I’m also running it straight piped right now but I’m going to buy the module before I ride it again so I don’t mess the engine up. Thank you guys so much for being the ones that made this all happen!” Rock on Vfr800witdawaffle!

Update - more 5th/6th gen headers will be available on the current production run. We connected with our fabricator Wade yesterday, and there is good news. He is building a few extra sets of headers for 5th/6th gen VFRs, so they are available if anyone was thinking about the next production run. The company Wade uses to do the mandrel bending of tubes bent a few extra sets, so Wade ordered the tubing merge assemblies and hardware needed to complete them. These are part of the current production run and will all have 3 bungs for O2 sensors, which means your options are open as far as 2 OEM O2 sensors, one autotune O2 sensor, one O2 sensor for dyno tuning, etc. Passivation - an acid bath for the headers [described in depth earlier in this thread] remains an option - $90 if you want it.

Hi rlindquist, There is a production run of headers for 5th gen and 6th gen being built now; those headers fill orders guys placed a couple months ago. From your VFRD profile, it appears that you have one of the beautiful 2007 red, white, and blue anniversary 6th gens - good choice of ride. To get a set of headers, place a deposit by making a $200 paypal transfer to the paypal account of vfrheaders@gmail.com. You'll be #2 on the next order we place [A production run achieves go status when we have orders for six or more headers] - Be sure to send the transfer 'SENDING TO A FRIEND' so paypal doesn't take out 5% - In the note section of the paypal transfer, include [1] your VFRD username [2] which generation of VFR you'll be putting the headers onto [3] your real name [if different than the name on your paypal account] [4] your shipping address [5] whether you want to have the headers passivated [Passivation is detailed in the PM we sent you]. PM us if you have any questions. Cheers!

Header production update - I spoke with Wade today, and learned that the current run of 15 sets of 5/6 gen headers will be completed in two weeks. He had a small delay related to the company that supplies tubing merge assemblies for our headers. Add one week for passivation, and we are 3 weeks from shipping. Thanks to everyone who been staying in touch about this production run.

VFR members JZH and Duc2V4 prompted me to take Dusty's instructions out for a test spin. The info below is also posted on the 5th gen forum. The software is indeed intended to act as interface between a technician and a Dynojet dyno, but the program was free to download and came in a 123.88mb zip file. Power Core version 2.1.1 loaded easily onto my PC and includes four applications for operating and using a dyno for tuning. The Dyno Control app within the Power Core suite opened and under the support tab, the app was indeed ready to 'send data file', but I don't have a Power Commander V here to test the procedure. So the software and process are available, free, and viable, but we'll need someone with a 2000-2001 5th gen that has a PCV installed to verify that the patch file actually saves the day.

Dynojet now provides a patch that enables Power Commander V [PCV] to work with 2000-2001 5th gen VFRs! It's true! At least Dynojet says it's true. Dynojet is the company that manufactures Power Commander and has provided the file along with instructions for downloading it to a PCV. We haven't put it to the test yet, but are eagerly looking forward to doing so. Thanks to VFRD member Rob916 for poking us with a stick about this topic and getting us to post this info. Last week Jozef helped connect us with Dusty Schaller at Dynojet [Some might recall that Jozef is the dyno tech at Attack Performance where we did all the dyno testing/tuning of the new performance headers]. Dusty is the product manager of Power Commander and sent the attached file along with these instructions: "You need to update the PCV to this datafile [the file attached below]. The only way to do this currently is with Power Core software using Dyno control. Open Dyno control and go to Support – Send data file. To get Power core go here - https://www.dynojet.com/downloads/power-vision-3/ Scroll down to Software" Here is the file: B16-005.02.ddat If anyone gets a chance to try this before we run it on our 2001 5 gen test bike, please post your procedure and results here as soon as possible.