ZenMoto

I came across the document below on the Bazzaz website. The VFR1200F products are on page 6 along with a couple of dyno charts which I assume are for the Z-Fi unit and not with the z-bomb also?

http://bazzaz.net/Z-notes/Bazzaz_Z-notes_ALL.pdf

Definitely NOT with the Z-Bomb. I was told they won't be posting dyno results with the Z-Bomb until they have production Z-Bombs ready to ship.

With the Z-Bomb, that giant hole below 5k rpm kinda' disappears! :)

There's a sensor at the shit lever that detects pressure,

most humans have that too

So are the results repeatable for the rest of us, or do I need to ship my bike to them to get a z-bomb. ;)

Ah, you guys are cracking me up! ...this is what I get for trying to get the info up before going to bed! lol

I don't really have any way of recording video while riding, so you'll just have to take my word that it's a LOT smoother; especially the off-idle throttle response. To test this, I went up one of my favorite local roads, ( Piuma Rd. ) which starts with a very tight, climbing hairpin turn; this is normally nearly impossible to do smoothly as it is strictly a 1st gear turn, and usually covered in dirt and loose rocks. Today, no issue whatsoever! The bike came under throttle smoothly, with no abruptness at all! :)

Until I get dyno results to post, there's not much more to say about the performance. I know it added a bunch of power in 1st & 2nd, but the bike is actually easier to ride in those two gears. I don't know that it added any / much horsepower in the higher gears, I just know the bike is smoother overall, and there are no dips in power, anywhere, at any throttle position!

Quick Shift: To answer the question, quick shift does basically the same thing you do when you up-shift without the clutch ...it just does it a LOT faster, and you don't have to back off the throttle to do it. There's a sensor at the shift lever that detects pressure, and when it does it interrupts the ignition for a fraction of a second, releasing the tension on the shift dogs (just like backing off the throttle does); once the ignition cuts, the bike just pops into the next gear and since you never had to let off the throttle, it continues right where you left off ...pulling like a freight train.

The Bazzaz QS is programmed differently for each gear, as you need less igntion cut as you go up in gears / speed. So the cut for 1st - 2nd might be long enough for you to really feel the ignition cut out (because it has to be) but 3rd - 4th and up is essentially instantaneous. There's simply no way you can cut the throttle manually, shift, and pick up the throttle even remotely close to how quick it is.

Here's the quick shift sensor hooked up:

The Z-Fi unit under the seat (held in with Velcro). ...I gave them permission to cut away some of the ribbing under the seat to fit it, as I put my fuse box in what would be the ideal location. In my opinion the under-tray is plenty strong to not need that rib all the way across anyway.

And here is the handlebar control cluster, which is actually upside down, as it was designed to mount above the bar on most (race) bikes, but the VFRs clutch reservoir is in the way ...I like how clean it looks under the bar, and the reservoir hides the cables, etc.. The 2-position toggle is to switch ignition maps, the dial is for how much / little traction control you want active.

Well, a truck from Bazzaz, with my bike in the back, showed up at my house this afternoon! :)

They are *still* waiting on ONE part to finish the Z-Bomb, but finished my bike off with a hand-built connector for the Z-Bomb on my bike.

I will probably get final dyno sheets next week sometime. ...in the meantime, here's my initial impression:

Z-Fi / Fuel mapping: ...perfect! Not an exaggeration, it is simply that better than it was stock; no humps in power, and no giant holes!!!

Z-Bomb: What can I say, I now have full power in 1st & 2nd, and you know what? ...it's very nice, and not the least bit "dangerous". In fact, the bike has completely lost its nervous throttle coming off-idle in 1st & 2nd; it's now VERY easy to ride smoothly in those gears, making 2nd my new go-to gear for my local twisties (with the occasional dip into 3rd). The bike is simply SAFER to ride now as it behaves much better in the lower gears!

Quick Shifter: ...this will take a little getting used to, but it is smoooooth! I didn't know if they were going to do it or not, but they did and it's awesome! As long as you're over 3000rpm you can just up-shift with no clutch, and it seamlessly clicks into gear without having to let off the throttle. I've never had a quick shift before, but I LIKE it! :)

Traction Control: This is another thing I didn't think they were going to do, but they did. It's really meant for the race-track, to allow you to dial in just the right amount of "slip" while putting the power down hard, but they tell me it will work just as well in the wet. ...obviously, I haven't had a chance to notice it working (and may not for some time), but it's cool that they developed it!

Handlebar Controls: This last bit was a total surprise! They mounted a control cluster under my left bar that has a 2-position toggle for switching between Map 1 & Map 0 on the Z-Fi unit, as well as a dial for adjusting the sensitivity of the traction control (currently set to mid-point).

Overall the whole thing is very clean and professional (what would you expect from Bazzaz) and the bike is, quite simply, transformed!

I'll try to get some pics of the little control cluster as well as the quick shift and Z-Fi, etc. to put online.

...tomorrow, I go riding!!! :)

Bazzaz is Badazz!!!

Any chance you could get Bazzaz to give you some dyno charts that you can publish here, especially a second gear run. Would be interested to see how well the z-fi addresses the torque dip in 1st and second and also how the results compare to the z-bomb and PC V. I came across the following dyno chart for a PC V map:

http://www.fullthrottlepowersports.com.au/system/dyno_image/image/0000/0020/VFR1200F_POWER_DROP_CURE_copy.jpg

http://www.fullthrottlepowersports.com.au/pages/dyno

The 3rd chart in the first post is 2nd gear with the Z-Bomb (unrestricted 1st and 2nd). I will see if they'll give me new charts, since my engine is fully broken in now, but it probably won't be vastly different.

I'm sorry to read that. I'll hold out hope that someday, a package will appear on your doorstep, or someone will finally say that they are ready to have you come back for an installation.. good things come to those who wait.

Actually, I had sent another email (1st in over a month) and got a response back from Chris at Bazzaz. ...turns out Ron, who I was dealing with, no longer works there and they will be taking my bike again next week. They still don't have connectors for the Z-Bomb (apparently, Honda did a great job of making it unobtanium) but they will be putting in the Z-Fi unit and making sure my bike is tuned correctly.

It's disappointing that it's taken so long, but at least it's getting done, and I certainly understand how R&D can take a lot of left turns on you, so I'm not the least bit upset over the deal. ...it is what it is.

Hopefully, this is a sign that they will have product on the market for VFR riders in the very near future!!! :)

looks like I'm going with a PC V since Bazzaz says another month before they will sell one to the public. :(

Well, you've heard more than me then. ...at this point, I'm giving up on Bazzaz. They had my bike for a month, and all I have to show for it is 200 dyno miles on my bike and not being able to ride it for a month when it was brand new. :(

I understand it can be hard to get connectors, etc., but you'd think an occasional email to say "hey, we're still working on it" wouldn't be too hard.

Ah well, live and learn.

They really were all super nice, but they are a tiny facility, and probably overwhelmed with actual race stuff this time of year. ...I just think 5 months should be plenty of time.

D

Super interesting Z-Bomb claim... I'm hoping DynoJet will follow suit with an Ignition Retard Controller Module, and some members actually post dyno runs of the Z-Bomb and other fixes, not just claims from manufacturers...

That graph of the Z-Bomb isn't a "claim" it was my bike, on the dyno, with their prototype Z-Bomb. ...and my engine has noticeably broken in a bit since it was there (according to my butt-dyno) so the overall numbers might be slightly better than that.

...now if only they could source the connectors!!!

I might have been in 1st gear, can't remember for sure. But there was a big lag.

Do you know anything about the map Bazzaz is using? And will they have traction control and/or auto tune?

Thanks

I do believe they will have an auto tune. Their stock maps will be based on a totally stock VFR and one with an akropovic skip on; they are very thorough with their dyno tuning though, and those maps should be very good.

There will not be traction control. I was told that to make it work on the VFR it needed to be super sensitive and it was just more trouble than it was worth.

Keep in mind that Bazzaz' traction control is not for bad weather or slippery roads, but rather for racetrack purposes, getting the absolute most drive possible while still deep in a turn and leaned over; the odds of making it kick in under street conditions would be nearly impossible (and probably very unsafe). lol

Hey Zen,

Is your bike the standard model?

Yep, the standard 1200F (vs. the 1200FDual clutch).

Alang, if you're drag racing from a rolling 15 you REALLY want to start in 1st gear. It's a short gear, but it's not that short. 2nd at 15 mph is waaaaay at the bottom of the rev counter; no wonder it felt slow as hell building steam! lol

I believe these are all with the stock pipe, and it's not clear from the naming what's going on in the first image; it may be just their baseline runs overlaid. ...if anyone understands "dyno lingo" let me know. lol These runs were done a while back when my bike had only 1700 miles on it. I can tell that the motor has woken up a bit since then so I'm looking forward to getting it back on the dyno with it fully broken in and the Akro pipe installed.

Stock mapping (maybe the black line is with the Z-Fi unit and map):

1st gear with (black) and without (red) the Z-Bomb (removes 1st & 2nd gear limitations):

2nd gear with (black) and without (red) Z-Bomb:

I'm told they have all the connectors for the Z-Fi unit, but are having some issues getting the right connectors for the Z-Bomb (hoping to be resolved in the next couple weeks).

All this reaffirms what my butt tells me every time I hit the twisties (mostly all 2nd gear) ...WTF was Honda thinking with this BS limiting of the 1st & 2nd??? The way the power sags then comes on just SUCKS. For most of the twisty roads I've found in Southern California, 1st is just too short and 2nd is on the lugging side, which means you have to ride through that horrible trough constantly, usually pulling out of the apex of a turn. I can do it in 1st and stay up in the power band, but man talk about needing a LOT of throttle control! lol

It's really a shame that Honda did this to cripple what is an otherwise very easy to handle 140-150hp bike. ...it really is borderline dangerous, and I can't wait to get it fixed permanently, even if it means having the gear indicator on the dash not working correctly anymore.

OMG. What is it with Honda and their fairings, lately? Waaaay too complex.

Actually, once you've done it once or twice, the new fairings are quite easy to take apart, and I love that there are no obvious fasteners. I'm amazed at the creativity of the engineers that put this thing together. It actually seems easier to work on than the 4th and 5th gens I had.

Hoping to see the Bazzaz dyno chart!

Yeah, they've been pretty non-communicative since I picked up the VFR (my KTM 950 Adventure is taking up space in their shop though). ...they've been great in person, but not so much on the correspondence side of things. I'd asked again for the dyno charts, but never heard anything back. :(

I'm sure when the production bits are ready, and I drop off the VFR again I'll be able to get the charts printed out. It will be interesting to see if my VFR makes a little better power now that it's *really* broken in (5000 miles vs. 1700 when I dropped it off).

...here's hoping I hear from them soon. :)

Yep, delays. ...they have some of the connectors, but are still waiting for others. I've asked for a printout / screen shot of the dyno charts, but haven't been given anything yet. As soon as I have something, I'll be sure to report back.