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ShipFixer

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Everything posted by ShipFixer

  1. I highly recommend ordering studs and flange nuts in advance and not counting on some or all of your existing ones to work out. None of mine were even close to seized in the block, but most of them were seized to the flange nuts. May be better post pandemic, but I ended up ordering from three places and waiting to see what arrived first and sort of quickly.
  2. Yep, it does. Answer is...there's no other way to close that loop I can think of. Till I learned about the key switch sequence I thought it was just the limitations of early ECUs and whatnot. Like I have seen some examples where the steps in an older engine controller are "big" so things suddenly and noticeably change over a few hundred RPM. That's sort of what the VFR always felt like to me when it was stepping the fuel up and down at cruise and I wrote it off as the limits of the day. And some people notice it, and some people don't, so it was also probably down to the tolerances of each bike and whatever the sensitivity of that rider is. Now what I think is the behavior between O2 sensors active or not is so arbitrarily close, it's probably really an open loop algorithm in implementation if not outright design, and Honda just tipped the scales overall towards emissions and efficiency. We know the manufacturers have always done this with lean mixtures at cruise RPMs to meet mandates, this is just like Honda went the extra mile when they didn't have to and it's super annoying. They might have even had O2 eliminators in mind, and wanted to do things to protect the longevity of the cat, etc.
  3. There is a way to see what your bike is like without the closed loop mode with the O2 sensors, discovered by that other forum. Turn ignition key "ON" and then kill switch "ON." Let pump prime (whining noise). Turn ignition "OFF." Turn ignition "ON" and hit starter before the whining noise and dash light/pattern ends. For one reason or another, this puts the bike in a completely open loop mode without the O2 sensors, riding to a fixed map. Haven't ridden a 5th gen enough to know if it's noticeable, but a shitty thing about the 6th gen is there is clearly open loop logic on top of the closed loop control, where even with eliminators it will still dial back mixture in a noticeable way. Whether the key/switch dance is an intentional bypass built in by Honda, or a flaw that faults out that logic, we don't know. But it works.
  4. I would check the over/under on the cost of a new ECU and making it work to include using the catless 98/99 headers or VFRD headers, vs. just buying a Rapid Bike Racing and fixing and upgrading it all at the same time.
  5. Yeah but the RBR also skips all those manual steps, or the need for dyno testing... 🙃
  6. I had an exhaust shop expand my Delkevic pipe to match the VFRD header. I gave them $20, it took them five seconds and they didn't want anything for it. It's way easier for them than any of the home-expanders. The one I picked up gave up before the Delkevic pipe did.
  7. In those scenarios I'm just on and off the clutch more probably, so don't notice. I think it's probable that's what the engine braking adjustment in RBR should do, but the translation in both the GUI and the manual leave a lot to be desired so I haven't messed with it. Somewhere between "reduce engine braking" and "slipper clutch" is where your answer lies if you want it to ride differently right around zero throttle. The other thing to look through is how the throttle bodies and starter valves in VFRs interact. Googling this and the other forums will give you lots of information on things that will affect your off-idle throttle behavior. Some in the manual, some tribal lore. Unlike some other things, closed throttle = closed throttle bodies, and the starter valves are providing the air at between zero and a few percent throttle. Some people attribute the abrupt nature of on and off throttle behavior in the VFR to that "fully closed" position in the butterflies. You will also see some discussions of re-balancing the starter valves from zeroed out balance across all four, to something like the 5th gen with 10 or 20mm difference Mg across different ones. Some people believe doing that improved their off-throttle behavior so they balance theirs that way. I like mine balanced as per the manual, I think the bike is overall smoother that way. I've balanced them the other way(s) and it wasn't bad, just not better across RPM range, etc. I don't discount the opinions of people specifically looking for the same thing you are and saying it helped them, though.
  8. One observation that might help - when I look at my map its about what I think it should be. Plusses in the mid range and mid throttle region and then some minuses at high RPM and high throttle. It's smoothing rather than just adding everywhere. There are some discussions on FB where people are trying to essentially push the map "up" to get more something. Like accept the changes and open the aperture, repeat. This will get you past the recommended +/- quickly and probably just dump fuel, if that. Unless you are seriously modding, the RBR is probably already giving you a really good answer and I would not overthink it. I have a full exhaust, new plugs, and fresh injectors and I have left mine alone other than checking on it. OBTW get your injectors cleaned if you haven't. Worth it!
  9. 1.) I haven't looked in a while, but ignition timing is automatically tuned in advancement just like fueling. There is a "base map" for the 6th gen and then it auto tunes off that +/- constantly. The 6th gen has more ignition advance timing range than the 5th gen but there is a limit in the bike (forget, someone else knows what it is though). "Probably" more true to say it's already advancing as much as it can within what it sees from the stock narrow band sensors. I don't remember seeing my ignition map advanced all the way up to either the software limit or the bike limit. You can adjust the limit just like you can shift the fuel map limit beyond +/-8 but it doesn't seem necessary. Without wideband sensors really unlikely to be useful to shoot in the dark here. 2.). Last time I checked no. The software for your PC is regularly updated though. Seems like every time I turn that laptop on. 3.) If you mean full closed vs just closing it a bit, then no, you are slamming the butterfly valves closed and "see starter valve discussion" applies. If you just mean there is more engine braking than you would like, then maybe? User experience gets hard because all of us will have different observations in proprioception. Some people really can't stand the surge/lag in the stock ECU for emissions at cruise and love that the RBR finally fixes it. Then a large number of people don't notice it at all and think "How Honda intended it" is perfection or something. I can tell you if I shut my throttle a lot and open it with the engine clutched in, yeah, its rough. But I also just don't do it that often and do use engine braking plenty without problems. Whether that's 20 years of VFR adaptation on my part or a problem...dunno. Zero difference before and after RBR on that front if that's what you're really asking. Have not played with engine braking functions but answer is "maybe," someone else has. I didnt find the settings in the software easy to understand at all. A slipper clutch may also be the thing?
  10. Hyperpro spring kit by itself will get both ends pretty close to "really good" for not much money. I did that before a full rear shock and RaceTech valves up front and it was really good. Especially if you full-service the forks at the same time.
  11. The RBR is one of the most "noticeable" upgrades I've ever done, right up there with getting correct springs the first time. Headers open up the top end with it, but the RBR you will notice all day long at low RPM and midrange. And getting rid of bad closed loop behavior is the best!
  12. Not sure if serious. 😉 But...yes, the API label that matches what your manufacturer says is what protects those things. Your manufacturer does not recommend the API label that says "energy conserving," which is no longer in use since 2016, and the why is because of friction modifiers. At nautical grad school, we go pretty deep into the "why" :lol:
  13. All of that 😂 And that perhaps reducing friction in a device that is designed around a specific coefficient of friction isn't a good idea, as it will ultimately reduce static friction force and load capacity of said device. I tested some ceramic coating on a small corner of my tile floor the other day. I slid sideways pretty easily. The floor works better at a higher static friction coefficient. I do not have a lab where I can test for different surface treatments, nor do I have a design specification for a minimum coefficient of friction to match load capacity of the floor to foot system. I cannot predict when I might slide even if I don't slide all the time or haven't yet. So I left that alone and followed the label on the bottle that basically says "LOL no don't do that."
  14. The API certification for "Energy Conserving" was canceled in 2016. Bob Is the Oil Guy forums have a lot of discussions about them, between professional nerds in that industry. It's a discussion about additives though. Adding: there are still many oils out there with similar friction modifiers. I would Google up some professional references, including journals. They all concur on one thing...
  15. Yeah but there's no People of Walmart in this adventure. Should get a discount!
  16. I think Wal-Mart is one of the reliable sources for 10W-40, but I don’t think it’s in Canada? Your bearings, rings, and other lubricated surfaces are designed around a specific viscosity. But 10W-30 will work, as will 15W-40 if you can find it. 10W-30 is called out as an alternative in my manual with its own temperature range. The downward push on viscosities and why you can’t find it is a corporate average fuel economy thing. It’s kind of like shaved tires. It’s a cost savings and/or cost avoidance for the vehicle manufacturer, and they transfer far future risk to you that is unlikely to materialize while yo own the car so no one cares. It’s understood in engineering land that this is happening but unfortunately vehicle consumers don’t broadly know.
  17. My audiogram is the same at 45 as it was at 22, despite a previous life in diesel engine rooms and my last office sitting under the three-wire on an aircraft carrier 😉 I know what loud is like and generally avoid it (hence my audiogram results). It's a high point of the VFR and Shoei for me that they're relatively very quiet. Better believe I was ready to shove as much extra baffle length in the Delkevics to get to "manageable!"
  18. I have the Delkevic 8" pipes. I have heard them next to another 6th gen that also has the VFRD headers with gutted stock mufflers, and I prefer the Delkevic sound. It's got that throaty V-8 rumble at low RPM and idle, but shrieks like a superbike up high. Has caused several beginner riders near me to panic (not intentionally!). Agree the gutted stock option sounds tinny and odd, Delkevic is a great option. Couple notes though, with the headers, it was too loud for riding without earplugs even with baffles. Delkevic does sell a "quieter" baffle which gave me the extra 3dB I need. Bike is louder without being obnoxious now. If you Google around you will find other people have home made even quieter ones by extending the baffle further. It may be fine with the cat installed but with the straight pipes, 8" just doesn't muffle well by itself. The Dekevic intermediate pipe that connects to the header is sized for the stock header. When you get the VFRD header, it's wider (hooray!) so be prepared to take it to a shop to have it expanded a tiny bit. The do it yourself expander broke, it's strong enough (also hooray) that it needs a proper hydraulic expander.
  19. I did not remove my center stand to replace my 6th gen headers. Bike stayed on the center stand the whole time. I don't recall thinking it would make a difference, either. The header comes in three pieces - the front exhaust exits and merges as one piece, and then the two rear exits are separate pieces, but they route around the center stand. The post-collection exit to the up-pipe for whatever muffler system you have (Delkevic pipe shown here) routes through the middle of the center stand. You can see it in this photo of my bike right after I finished the install. Note the springs fastening the two rear cylinder exhaust pipes to the main header assembly, and where the header connects to the up-pipe heading to the mufflers. If and when another group order comes together, if your bike has some miles on it, I would consider pre-ordering the studs and nuts for the exhaust flanges from Honda ahead of time. At least a few of the nuts on mine were fused to the studs, which of course is better than fusing to the engine block I suppose. And of course, they were backordered everywhere. This added a week or more of downtime to my install, and I ended up ordering from three different places and waiting to see which ones would get here first. There is someone on eBay in the UK who sells stainless VFR exhaust flange studs, but doesn't ship them to the US.
  20. The headers take a bit of patience. You won't be slapping these on as quickly as a slip on. It takes a combination of ratchet extensions on a torque wrench to get the rear exits seated correctly, and as you methodically tighten each lug down a bit at a time, all around the bike, to the final number, you also have to make sure the header is not contacting the frame (I used wood shims). There is nothing particularly difficult about it, it's just a little fussy. You will want a garage or spot where the bike can be worked on for at least several hours, maybe a few days depending on your pace. And one or two universal joints and an extension set for those rear pipes. Also...it's totally worth it 😁 The bike is waaaaaay more open above 7K RPM.
  21. What did he do to make them decide he shouldn’t have access to header buys, that’s the question… 😜
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