Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted November 15, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted November 15, 2020 Just saw the Black Widow header listing on ebay; anyone happen to have one? Was curious about the installation, finish, fit, issues with side or center stand. And I saw on ebay that someone offered a stainless steel oval slip-on that had dual outlets....but now I am not able to find it. I do not know if Black Widow made it or someone else.....so once again, anyone here happen to know about this slip-on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careca Posted November 16, 2020 Share Posted November 16, 2020 I have a black widow system on my VFR 800 Fi ( 2000 ). Fits perfectly , quality looks good and it went together really easily and I never had to use any assembly paste. Works perfectly with the centre stand. I read many reviews and people were bitching about this that and the other, chinese made, ( which I don't believe ) copies etc etc . I thought it was very good value for money and I certainly have nothing negative to say about it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branditto Posted December 12, 2020 Share Posted December 12, 2020 Is there any reason this wouldnt fit on a 2006? For some reason the dealer says it wont fit VTEC models with underseat exhaust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted March 9, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted March 9, 2021 I still have not click the buy button on the BlackWidow exhaust header....just not able to get myself to spend the nearly $400. I did locate that dual outlet slip though, it is not made by BlackWidow,....thought I wrote the mfg down, appears I did not. And to answer the old question above...no the 94-97 VFR's exhaust is totally different from that on a 2006. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer jefferson Posted March 11, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted March 11, 2021 I think it was the Black widow that after I saw one of the pictures where one cylinders pipe T'd into another one I decided that wouldn't be a good one to get. Not sure if it was a Black widow or not, but look at all the pictures carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted March 27, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted March 27, 2021 You know....I saw that as well....at least in looking at the pictures it sure seems like there is a "T" joint where a front joins a rear tube. I will take a very close look at the pictures again and if that "T" is there.....I will be passing on them. Thanks your your reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer JZH Posted March 28, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted March 28, 2021 That was 20 years ago, before the company changed it name. I doubt they're still using the same jigs. Ciao, JZH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer jefferson Posted March 28, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted March 28, 2021 If that's true then they need to update their photo's. Everyone I see for sale on eBay has the t in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer JZH Posted March 30, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted March 30, 2021 Yikes! I take back my doubts. That's a picture from the company's current eBay listing. It's evidently a copy of the old Motad 3rd-gen RHS-exit design, which allows the OEM exhaust can, with its swivel feature, to be used with the Black Widow aftermarket full exhaust system. Oh, dear... FWIW, their later efforts (5th gen+) look a bit better, but it's clear that their headers for the RC36 (both 3rd and 4th gen) are still pretty ropey. [Btw, there's some interesting header information in the early part of this classic VFRD thread...] 😹 Ciao, JZH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted April 4, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted April 4, 2021 That picture does not appear to be the set I was looking at as the joint for the muffler is not correct for the 94-97 years. I looked and looked at the pictures on ebay; have convinced myself that the front to rear joint is not a "T"...but....not far from it. I also viewed pics of the stock system which to me looks to have about the same joint...almost a "T". Really having doubts that the Black Widow system flows any better than the stock....lighter, yes....so no "click" yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted April 4, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted April 4, 2021 Here is the system I have been looking at: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted April 27, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted April 27, 2021 Appears my comment did not make it. After looking and looking at the various pictures of this system, the suspect "T" joint is not a true "T", it does have some angle to it...about the same as the OEM system. Still have not clicked on the "buy it now" button....difficult to justify the $400 for unknown results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer ducnut Posted April 28, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted April 28, 2021 The Black Widow header pairs the cylinders as if it were a 360° engine (RC30/45, VFR12, etc). My ‘98 would not run with the BW header. I have an open airbox, PC5, and Staintune. Reinstalling the OEM header or the VFRD header, the bike runs perfect. BW asserts that my bike being modified is why it doesn’t run with their header and not the cylinder pairings(🙄). Your results may vary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careca Posted April 28, 2021 Share Posted April 28, 2021 I am not arguing here but I have never heard /experienced that . An engine wont run because of a random exhaust port configurations. I am not an engineer , but until someone can 100 % prove to me that you can stop an engine from running because you joined the exhaust header pipes of cylinders 2 & 3 + 1 & 4 together instead of 1 & 3 + 2 & 4 I am not accepting this. You join corresponding cylinders to each other, so that after 1 fires its gasses leaving the header help scavenge the gasses of the next one to fire. I get that an engine might run crap if you just randomly connect cylinders together but I have never heard of it stopping an engine from running. On a side note, i have the 5 th gen Black Widow headers and exhaust and I have only good things to say about it . Regards, Nat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careca Posted April 28, 2021 Share Posted April 28, 2021 This is a link to their website and for the record I am in no way connected at all . https://www.blackwidowexhausts.co.uk/vfr800f-vfr-800-1998-2003-rc46-exhaust-collector-downpipes-228-p.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted April 28, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted April 28, 2021 I compared photos for the BW header and the OEM for my 4th Gen....they have the same cylinder pairs connected; #1 goes to the bottom tube at the rear which is #1; #4 goes to the top tube at the rear which is #3. Going from pictures, did not remove the fairings off my bike to really check. Did not look at the VFR800 one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer ducnut Posted April 29, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted April 29, 2021 11 hours ago, Careca said: I am not arguing here but I have never heard /experienced that . An engine wont run because of a random exhaust port configurations. I am not an engineer , but until someone can 100 % prove to me that you can stop an engine from running because you joined the exhaust header pipes of cylinders 2 & 3 + 1 & 4 together instead of 1 & 3 + 2 & 4 I am not accepting this. You join corresponding cylinders to each other, so that after 1 fires its gasses leaving the header help scavenge the gasses of the next one to fire. I get that an engine might run crap if you just randomly connect cylinders together but I have never heard of it stopping an engine from running. On a side note, i have the 5 th gen Black Widow headers and exhaust and I have only good things to say about it . Regards, Nat. I could get it started, it wouldn’t idle, it would run like shit off-idle up through ~5000rpm, then, it would clean up. At higher rpm, I’m not 100% sure it was running as clean as I think it was. I put the original header back on and it ran perfectly. When my VFRD header showed up, I swapped it onto the bike, and it still ran perfectly. I assure you, that’s exactly what happened. If I would’ve had a dyno available, I would’ve liked to have seen how the A/F ratio looked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careca Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 I am not doubting you , but I have never heard of this and feel its all very strange that's for sure. Perhaps any engineers on here can enlighten us ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Mohawk Posted April 29, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted April 29, 2021 I assume you rebalanced the starter valves or carbs if you changed the exhaust ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer ducnut Posted April 30, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted April 30, 2021 6 hours ago, Mohawk said: I assume you rebalanced the starter valves or carbs if you changed the exhaust ? No. I’m not sure how the starter valves would be affected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted April 30, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted April 30, 2021 Starter valves..????....please explain.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted May 5, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted May 5, 2021 I emailed Black Widow, asking about the header...was told that it is simply a replacement of the stock system, not a performance system. So only reason to get one would be should the stock system develop holes from corrosion....which is not likely where I live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer ducnut Posted May 5, 2021 Member Contributer Share Posted May 5, 2021 On 4/30/2021 at 1:18 PM, Lannyl81 said: Starter valves..????....please explain.... The ‘98-‘99 models have a rack of starter valves, which basically are valves that control air leaks. One is the control circuit, the other three circuits are vacuum-adjusted to the control circuit. So, these bikes have a “choke” lever on the left clip-on. That’s actually an enrichener lever that slide the rack of starter valves and closes off the air leaks/airflow, enrichening the mixture. It’s a fairly primitive EFI system, but, it works. This pic shows the rack, with the 2nd one from the left being the control circuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Lannyl81 Posted May 6, 2021 Author Member Contributer Share Posted May 6, 2021 Ahhhh....got it....on the 5th Gen VFRs. Might have to get me one of them 5th Gens one of these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moroseduck Posted May 7, 2021 Share Posted May 7, 2021 On 5/5/2021 at 3:51 PM, Lannyl81 said: I emailed Black Widow, asking about the header...was told that it is simply a replacement of the stock system, not a performance system. So only reason to get one would be should the stock system develop holes from corrosion....which is not likely where I live. I've been looking at these for my gen 3 - they describe the system as having an "improved lighter design" - is this just bs then? Or at least not enough of an improvement to make them worth swapping out a functional original system for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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