Member Contributer sfdownhill Posted February 9, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted February 9, 2020 Dynojet now provides a patch that enables Power Commander V [PCV] to work with 2000-2001 5th gen VFRs! It's true! At least Dynojet says it's true. Dynojet is the company that manufactures Power Commander and has provided the file along with instructions for downloading it to a PCV. We haven't put it to the test yet, but are eagerly looking forward to doing so. Thanks to VFRD member Rob916 for poking us with a stick about this topic and getting us to post this info. We also posted this information on the 'New Performance Header" thread, but thought it worth reposting here in the 5th gen forum in case it can be of use to anyone not watching the header thread. Some may recall that a number of owners of 2000-2001 5th gen VFRs have tried Power Commander V on their motorcycles and found that with PCV, their engines ran very poorly, exhibiting rough, erratic power output and misfires. 1998-1999 VFRs seem impervious and are able to use PCV with no problems. Now, in theory at least, there is a theoretical solution. Last week Jozef Tomasovich helped connect us with Dusty Schaller at Dynojet [Some might recall that Jozef is the dyno tech at Attack Performance where we did all the dyno testing/tuning of the new performance headers]. Dusty is the product manager of Power Commander and sent the attached file along with these instructions: "You need to update the PCV to this datafile [the file attached below]. The only way to do this currently is with Power Core software using Dyno control. Open Dyno control and go to Support – Send data file. To get Power core go here - https://www.dynojet.com/downloads/power-vision-3/ Scroll down to Software" Here is the file: B16-005.02.ddat 134.02 kB · 0 downloads If anyone gets a chance to try this before we run it on our 2001 5 gen test bike, please post your procedure and results here as soon as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFROZ Posted February 9, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted February 9, 2020 Hmmm, this has been said before. I'm hoping it is true this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFR Capt.Bob Posted February 9, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted February 9, 2020 Running PCV on my 99 VFR with only 25,000 miles on it. It only starts with the choke (idle enrichner) significantly dialed up until it warms up then I have to adjust it back down. The idle does not sound very clean either. Previous 98 I rode only had these symptoms at around 130k miles. I attributed it to engine wear. Curious if this patch will work on the 99 model too. Will it theoretically not have I'll effects on the 99 if I use this patch? Bike does run strong overall. I have a Two Brothers full exhaust on it as well which may tie me into the performance header category. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer JZH Posted February 9, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted February 9, 2020 6 hours ago, sfdownhill said: Dynojet now provides a patch that enables Power Commander V [PCV] to work with 2000-2001 5th gen VFRs! It's true! At least Dynojet says it's true. Dynojet is the company that manufactures Power Commander and has provided the file along with instructions for downloading it to a PCV. We haven't put it to the test yet, but are eagerly looking forward to doing so. Thanks to VFRD member Rob916 for poking us with a stick about this topic and getting us to post this info. We also posted this information on the 'New Performance Header" thread, but thought it worth reposting here in the 5th gen forum in case it can be of use to anyone not watching the header thread. Some may recall that a number of owners of 2000-2001 5th gen VFRs have tried Power Commander V on their motorcycles and found that with PCV, their engines ran very poorly, exhibiting rough, erratic power output and misfires. 1998-1999 VFRs seem impervious and are able to use PCV with no problems. Now, in theory at least, there is a theoretical solution. Last week Jozef Tomasovich helped connect us with Dusty Schaller at Dynojet [Some might recall that Jozef is the dyno tech at Attack Performance where we did all the dyno testing/tuning of the new performance headers]. Dusty is the product manager of Power Commander and sent the attached file along with these instructions: "You need to update the PCV to this datafile [the file attached below]. The only way to do this currently is with Power Core software using Dyno control. Open Dyno control and go to Support – Send data file. To get Power core go here - https://www.dynojet.com/downloads/power-vision-3/ Scroll down to Software" Here is the file: B16-005.02.ddat 134.02 kB · 0 downloads If anyone gets a chance to try this before we run it on our 2001 5 gen test bike, please post your procedure and results here as soon as possible. It looks like you need to hook up the PCV to a DynoJet Dyno to install the patch? It would be nice if this is a true solution! Ciao, JZH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Duc2V4 Posted February 9, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted February 9, 2020 59 minutes ago, JZH said: It looks like you need to hook up the PCV to a DynoJet Dyno to install the patch? It would be nice if this is a true solution! Ciao, JZH From the email instructions that I read, it appears that there is a software you run on your PC to install the file. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer sfdownhill Posted February 9, 2020 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 9, 2020 1 hour ago, JZH said: It looks like you need to hook up the PCV to a DynoJet Dyno to install the patch? It would be nice if this is a true solution! Good question JZH and good observation Duc2V4. You guys prompted me to take Dusty's instructions out for a test spin. The software is indeed intended to act as interface between a technician and a Dynojet dyno, but the program was free to download and came in a 123.88mb zip file. Power Core version 2.1.1 loaded easily onto my PC and includes four applications for operating and using a dyno for tuning. The Dyno Control app within the Power Core suite opened and under the support tab, the app was indeed ready to 'send data file', but I don't have a Power Commander V here to test the procedure. So the software and process are available, free, and viable, but we'll need someone with a 2000-2001 5th gen that has a PCV installed to verify that the patch file actually saves the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer sfdownhill Posted February 9, 2020 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 9, 2020 2 hours ago, VFR Capt.Bob said: Curious if this patch will work on the 99 model too. Will it theoretically not have I'll effects on the 99 if I use this patch? That's a good question, Captain. I don't think I'd mess with a working PCV system like yours unless there is a guaranteed way to restore the PCV's firmware/software to its original version without the patch. If the patch screwed up your VFR's operation and your PCV couldn't be restored, you be stuck with a Dynojet brick equipped with a fuel injection harness. Regarding the 'not very clean' idle, have you tried synching the starter valves? I have not yet done this on my 2001, and I don't know for sure whether the starter valves are related to idle - just throwing it out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFR Capt.Bob Posted February 9, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted February 9, 2020 I will definitely go the major tune and service route first. Then maybe try some different maps. May even throw down for a dyno tune custom map. This just caught my attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEBSPEED Posted February 11, 2020 Share Posted February 11, 2020 I believe this patch was pioneered as a result of a customer of mine having his 99 tuned at a dyno shop in Seattle. We had installed an older model PC with ignition control so the header I built could be tuned properly. The shop he took it to insisted that they could not work with the older model PC2 and sold him a PC5. The bike didn't run properly with that one(as we suspected) and the shop worked with Dynojet to get it working properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer sfdownhill Posted February 13, 2020 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 13, 2020 On 2/11/2020 at 9:46 AM, SEBSPEED said: I believe this patch was pioneered as a result of a customer of mine having his 99 tuned at a dyno shop in Seattle. We had installed an older model PC with ignition control so the header I built could be tuned properly. The shop he took it to insisted that they could not work with the older model PC2 and sold him a PC5. The bike didn't run properly with that one(as we suspected) and the shop worked with Dynojet to get it working properly. That's very cool, Seb. PM sent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer JZH Posted February 15, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted February 15, 2020 On 2/9/2020 at 4:20 PM, sfdownhill said: Good question JZH and good observation Duc2V4. You guys prompted me to take Dusty's instructions out for a test spin. The software is indeed intended to act as interface between a technician and a Dynojet dyno, but the program was free to download and came in a 123.88mb zip file. Power Core version 2.1.1 loaded easily onto my PC and includes four applications for operating and using a dyno for tuning. The Dyno Control app within the Power Core suite opened and under the support tab, the app was indeed ready to 'send data file', but I don't have a Power Commander V here to test the procedure. So the software and process are available, free, and viable, but we'll need someone with a 2000-2001 5th gen that has a PCV installed to verify that the patch file actually saves the day. I have the Power Core software running on my computer, but my PCV unit is not recognised by the Dyno Control app. The C3 Tuning app (part of the Power Core suite) does recognise it, so I believe the problem is that the Dyno Control app only looks for Dyno modules, not PCVs. So, unless I'm doing something wrong, I think we still need to work with a friendly DynoJet dyno operator and a PCV owner, to see if the patch actually works. Ciao, JZH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer sfdownhill Posted February 15, 2020 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 15, 2020 1 hour ago, JZH said: So, unless I'm doing something wrong, I think we still need to work with a friendly DynoJet dyno operator and a PCV owner, to see if the patch actually works. Sounds about right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Tirso Posted February 21, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted February 21, 2020 The patch worked on my '99*. installation is easy and can be done with Windows computer. I called Dynojet and worked with Danny Boardman Powersports Technician You'll need: 1) PC5 to update connected to computer, motorbike off 2) The file (B16-005.02.ddat) downloaded on the computer you will use to update the PC5 3) Dynojet Power Core installed on the computer you will use to update the PC5 4) After install, start Dynojet Power Core 5) At "Power Core Application-Launcher" Select "WinPEP 8 Dyno Control" 6) At "WinPEP 8 Dyno Control" window, select the "Support" tab then "Send Data File" button 7) A pop up window will appear asking for location of "B16-005.02.ddat" '8) Select the .ddat file, press the "Open" button and start update 9) After the update, close all Power Core applications, important as you can not continue to next step if any Power Core applications are open 10) Open "Power Commander V Software" and load your PC5 with a zero map or any map of your choice 11) Go for a ride I suggest checking starter valves. I set mine a few weeks ago after "Wade Header" install and once home after update, I found 3 and 4 were significantly off while 1 and 2 were spot on. Idle increased from 1,200 rpm to 1,300 rpm * My '99 was originally a Calif bike with California ECU 38770-MBG-771 and California cams. In Oct '19 with 11.8k miles, converted to EU ECU 38770-MBG-003 and 49 state cams. I ran the '99 in this configuration with stock header and Staintune without issue. In Jan '20 I replaced the stock header with the "Wade Header", again no issue. In Feb '20 I installed PC5 (SKU 16-005) and had issues similar to SFDownhill's when he had his '01 initially Dyno'd with prototype headers at Attack. (see below) After the update, I loaded the PC5 with a zero map and went for a ride. A few hard pulls by the Richmond Shipyards convinced me all was well. I changed the zero map to the Attack map provided by sfdownhill and my VFR was transformed. New 5th/6th/8th gen performance header now in production in USA New 5th/6th/8th gen performance header now in production in USA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EX-XX Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 3:46 AM, SEBSPEED said: I believe this patch was pioneered as a result of a customer of mine having his 99 tuned at a dyno shop in Seattle. We had installed an older model PC with ignition control so the header I built could be tuned properly. The shop he took it to insisted that they could not work with the older model PC2 and sold him a PC5. The bike didn't run properly with that one(as we suspected) and the shop worked with Dynojet to get it working properly. You do have to wonder why they say this ("planned obsolescence, perhaps?) I have a PC2 on my bike, and will be installing the Group buy headers later this year (along with the "20 year refurb" stuff - thermostat, hoses etc.) I've already spoken to a local dealer here about having the PC2 tuned. He's at least willing to give it a try. I know for a fact that I can run up the old PC software on a Win10 tablet, and connect to the PC2 via USB-serial cable. It will monitor the PC2, displaying revs etc. in real time and so on. And all the other crap is accessible from the interface (ignition/fuel maps etc.) Worst case, he straps it to a dyno with exhaust gas analyser, and uses the tablet to make "some" changes to the ignition/fuel mapping...Or is that not the case? I always suspect that Dynojet dealers/tuners have been "warned off" providing support for the old PC2s, and wonder why that is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer ChrisBezz Posted March 14, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted March 14, 2020 Hi, I’m finding this discussion very interesting. I purchased my yellow VFR new in 1999 in the UK and still have her..... I also bought a PC2 around 2001 on eBay but didn’t fit it due to my Insurance company’s restrictions on perceived and undeclared “Performance improvements” and grossly increased premiums.... It has sat on a garage shelf ever since! Chris B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer JZH Posted March 15, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted March 15, 2020 The yellow in the ROW was a '99 colour, so manufactured before the Y2k changes, which have been problematic for those of us with "final edition" 5th gen VFRs. I've found that declared mods that are not expected to significantly increase performance (I don't think most things would do that--certainly not a re-mapping device, alone) do not affect my premiums at all. However, I am not a 20-something single lad with a job as a market trader... Ciao, JZH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFROZ Posted March 20, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted March 20, 2020 In Oz, modifications to exhaust, suspension, brakes or fuelling (including modules like Dynojet) do not affect your insurance. I actually checked this with my own insurer. Obviously other countries differ. And something I found surprising, when I transferred my insurance to my new 1050 ST it was actually cheaper. The VFR was insured for AU$5200 + AU$2000 of riding gear and it cost me AU$320 yearly. The new Sprint 1050ST is insured for AU$6500 + AU$2000 of riding gear and costs me AU$290 yearly. Who would have guessed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jk0311 Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 Is there some recourse to return a PCV that fails to function properly with the 5th Gens? Seems to open up Dynojet to some hefty criticism if they are advertising and selling a product that potentially won’t work. If I knew I could return the PCV I’d buy one now and be the tester... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer JZH Posted April 22, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted April 22, 2020 Credit cards usually offer some sort of buyer protection, but the specifics differ from card to card and country to country--you would have to check the fine print in your card agreement to be sure. Beware of exclusions, e.g., electronic devices? In the past I have utilised the "buyer protection" offered by the American Express Gold Card. The last time I did a successful credit card chargeback against a retailer who I thought was treating me unfairly was a few years ago (take a bow, Waytek Wire)... Ciao, JZH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jk0311 Posted April 23, 2020 Share Posted April 23, 2020 Well I just bit the bullet and bought a PCV. I guess we will see how well this patch works... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer mello dude Posted April 23, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted April 23, 2020 On 2/21/2020 at 12:15 AM, Tirso said: The patch worked on my '99*. installation is easy and can be done with Windows computer. I called Dynojet and worked with Danny Boardman Powersports Technician You'll need: 1) PC5 to update connected to computer, motorbike off 2) The file (B16-005.02.ddat) downloaded on the computer you will use to update the PC5 3) Dynojet Power Core installed on the computer you will use to update the PC5 4) After install, start Dynojet Power Core 5) At "Power Core Application-Launcher" Select "WinPEP 8 Dyno Control" 6) At "WinPEP 8 Dyno Control" window, select the "Support" tab then "Send Data File" button 7) A pop up window will appear asking for location of "B16-005.02.ddat" '8) Select the .ddat file, press the "Open" button and start update 9) After the update, close all Power Core applications, important as you can not continue to next step if any Power Core applications are open 10) Open "Power Commander V Software" and load your PC5 with a zero map or any map of your choice 11) Go for a ride I suggest checking starter valves. I set mine a few weeks ago after "Wade Header" install and once home after update, I found 3 and 4 were significantly off while 1 and 2 were spot on. Idle increased from 1,200 rpm to 1,300 rpm * My '99 was originally a Calif bike with California ECU 38770-MBG-771 and California cams. In Oct '19 with 11.8k miles, converted to EU ECU 38770-MBG-003 and 49 state cams. I ran the '99 in this configuration with stock header and Staintune without issue. In Jan '20 I replaced the stock header with the "Wade Header", again no issue. In Feb '20 I installed PC5 (SKU 16-005) and had issues similar to SFDownhill's when he had his '01 initially Dyno'd with prototype headers at Attack. (see below) After the update, I loaded the PC5 with a zero map and went for a ride. A few hard pulls by the Richmond Shipyards convinced me all was well. I changed the zero map to the Attack map provided by sfdownhill and my VFR was transformed. New 5th/6th/8th gen performance header now in production in USA New 5th/6th/8th gen performance header now in production in USA I'm late to the party on this post, but a big THANKS for posting up your work on it. I have a '98 California bike. My time is crazy scarce and I have other projects going on, but its great to see someone with the same bike I have get it all together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daimster Posted May 10, 2020 Share Posted May 10, 2020 Hi all,Does anyone has a proper map for a 99. KN filter, flapper and pair mod, black widow collectors and a Bos silencer with no baffle.I have the one from the site on page 4, the last map: 98/99 KN filter and full erion exhaust. The one closest to my set up but the cells are so different from a map for 98/99 with KN filter and slip on erion.Maybe someone knows..Thnx in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Mohawk Posted May 10, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted May 10, 2020 Your setup is the same as the K&N with slip on. The full Erion system passes much more air than your BW headers. Any map for a stock headers (98/99 no cat) K&N plus free flowing slip on should be close enough. Ideally you want a dyno tune. When I was running a similar setup, a dyno map for my bike added 4hp & it was smoother everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daimster Posted May 10, 2020 Share Posted May 10, 2020 How many runs did you do before satisfied? I will go to for dynorun to smooth out. Thnx for quick reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Mohawk Posted May 10, 2020 Member Contributer Share Posted May 10, 2020 It’s not about power runs. They rig up the PCV to the dynos computer & do progressive pulls whilst the O2 probe feeds data. The dyno adjusts the PC to correct AFR, then they finish with a power pull. They do an initial power pull so you see the difference between how it arrived & how it is post dyno tune. Have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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