Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted February 13, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted February 13, 2019 G’day I am hoping the brains trust might be able to assist. I am currently experiencing a hesitation / slight loss of power after I sit at a constant speed on the highway. I don’t experience it during excelleration or town riding, just when cruising at the same constant speed. It is almost as if someone has twisted the throttle back by a few degrees and you can feel the engine drop off. Once you twist the throttle it picks up again and won’t show an issue again for another period of being at a constant speed. 2002 non abs 60,000 km injectors ultrasonic cleaned 4 months ago new stator and rectifier fitted 12 months ago no loss of instrument panel during the fault volt meter reads 14.4 volts at cruising speed power commander USB using the cosi map I am thinking one of the following components maybe playing up. fuel pump not delivering sufficient fuel - unlikely as it accelerates from the issue with no problem fuel pressure regulator - no external leaks or vacuum leaks - probably requires a new one to be fitted to confirm as it is a sealed unit and cannot be adjusted throttle position sensor - might have dirty tracks on the sensor, again probably a swap with a new one as it is a sealed unit thoughts or suggestions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Grum Posted February 13, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted February 13, 2019 Just wondering if starter valve synch could be an issue here, you are probably not at very wide open throttle state whilst cruising. Would also consider the state of the FPR. Both of the above wouldn't force an EFI fault code which I assume you are not getting any Fi light codes. A little outside the square, wonder if the ECM is seeing correct engine temp from the ECT. Good luck. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFROZ Posted February 13, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted February 13, 2019 When sitting at a constant throttle opening the EFI goes into closed loop and O2 sensors come into play, readings from these are used to lean out the fuel mixture to conserve fuel. When the throttle is opened again O2 sensors are ignored (open loop) and system again uses stored maps for the fueling. Its why I got a PCIII and got rid of the O2 sensors on my 5G, it used to drive me nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted February 13, 2019 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 13, 2019 Grum, I have done the starter valve synch and realistically this only controls the idle to initial throttle butterflies opening. At the cruising speed, 100kmh, the valves would be open past the synch period. I have no FI codes. FPR is one of the items I am thinking as stated in original post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted February 13, 2019 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 13, 2019 VFROZ I have got the O2 sensors removed with resistor plug ins. My Power Commander 3 USB is running a cosi map downloaded from here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer FJ12Ryder Posted February 13, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted February 13, 2019 Does it still do it with the PC removed? That's the first thing I'd check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted February 14, 2019 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 14, 2019 FJ12Ryder I will disconnect the power commander this weekend and try running at a constant speed again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer VFROZ Posted February 14, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted February 14, 2019 A quick question, have you synchronised or zeroed the throttle position to the PCIII? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted February 14, 2019 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 14, 2019 I did when I uploaded the map but that must be 12 months ago. I will test the bike with the PC unplugged first and if that doesn’t work I will reconnect and reset the throttle on the computer. I have checked the parts fiche and note that Honda don’t sell the TPS as a part only. I have seen these go bad on vehicles, the tracks pit over time and give high resistance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted April 21, 2019 Author Member Contributer Share Posted April 21, 2019 Hi Well I thought I would give you an update to my issue. So I tested the fuel pressure of the fuel pump and that was in spec. I replaced the fuel regulator but got no improvement to the issue. I was then going to go and get the bike dyno tested to see if there was an issue with map or even a fault with my PC 3 USB as it is subject to vibration under the seat but decided to first replace the fuel filter in the tank. On replacing this item my woes have gone including an annoying vibration that used to come in around 4500 rpm. After coming back off the ride with a big smile on my face I decided to get the filter out of the bin and rip it open to look at the filter. Now you have to understand that my VFR is a 2002 model with only 61,000 km (38,125 miles) on it and I have put the last 6,000 km (3,750 miles) on it since I purchased it in 2016 meaning on average the bike has annually only covered 3,500 km (2,187 miles) a year. I don’t think this filter has ever been changed in 17 years. On ripping the filter can open I didn’t find any debris but once I opened up the pleated paper I could see the issue. The filter paper, dirty side, was covered in brown lacquer. The clean side had no lacquer build up at all. I actually got an airline to blow through from the clean side to the dirty side and it Hardly made any difference. Dirty side of filter. You see the area I used an airline on to try and see how dirty it was clean side Close up of area where I tried to clean with the airline. If anyone conducts this filter change don’t bother buying the pre filter as it is just an aluminium scouring pad that I could have bought from Woolworths for $0.99 cents. Not Honda’s cost of $15.00!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremysell11 Posted May 7, 2019 Share Posted May 7, 2019 Maroon Cobra, The hesitation you were feeling in your VFR - was it almost like a lurching or intermittent pulling? Kinda like the bike wanted to move forward but was having trouble giving you a 100% effort? I'm asking because I recently purchased my VFR and this weekend began having trouble I believe is similar to yours. First step is to change our spark plugs and air filter. Curious if next step will be changing the fuel filter like you mentioned above. Let me know your thoughts. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Grum Posted May 7, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted May 7, 2019 Good find MaroonCobra. Glad it's all sorted. Surprised you didn't have any issues when accelerating, rather than just when coasting at a cruise speed. Must remember that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Zarquon Posted May 7, 2019 Member Contributer Share Posted May 7, 2019 Sounds like I need to add a job to the list on my gen5. I take it your in Aus. Was wondering who did your injector clean and what it cost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreginDenver Posted May 8, 2019 Share Posted May 8, 2019 On 4/20/2019 at 6:30 PM, Marooncobra said: If anyone conducts this filter change don’t bother buying the pre filter as it is just an aluminium scouring pad that I could have bought from Woolworths for $0.99 cents. Not Honda’s cost of $15.00!!!!! I'm a bit confused about this statement. Are you talking about the wad of stainless steel that sits directly beneath the return fuel line for the pressure regulator bypassed fuel? As far as I know this wad of coarse stainless steel wool is in place to prevent the pressure-bypassed return fuel flow from spraying/splashing all over the place when the fuel level in the tank is low. This wad of stainless steel wool has the effect of helping the returned fuel (bypassed at the fuel pressure regulator on the throttle body) to arrive in the vicinity of the fuel pump pickup point with very low turbulence and splash occurring. (Fuel injection systems are always set up with a fuel pump that puts out more pressure and volume than the system needs, this is what allows the fuel pressure regulator to control the system's operating PSI. This specified surplus of pressure and volume allows for the gradual reduction over time (in years) of fuel pump output that occurs due to normal wear-and-tear on the clearances of the fuel pump internal parts.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastodonrider Posted May 11, 2019 Share Posted May 11, 2019 Thanks Marooncobra! I just recently picked up a lightly used '04 model that is doing the same thing. Just ordered a new filter and rubber gasket today. Will report back soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted May 12, 2019 Author Member Contributer Share Posted May 12, 2019 On 5/8/2019 at 1:18 AM, Jeremysell11 said: Maroon Cobra, The hesitation you were feeling in your VFR - was it almost like a lurching or intermittent pulling? Kinda like the bike wanted to move forward but was having trouble giving you a 100% effort? I'm asking because I recently purchased my VFR and this weekend began having trouble I believe is similar to yours. First step is to change our spark plugs and air filter. Curious if next step will be changing the fuel filter like you mentioned above. Let me know your thoughts. Thanks! Hi sorry been away and only just seen your message. It sounds like the same issue I had. You get to a cruising speed and after a few seconds it’s as if the throttle has wound off by a few degrees so you feel a dump in power. You then turn the throttle to increase speed and you get hesitation and then suddenly it comes back. If you do change the filter rip it open and check the paper element. I used a vice and a junior hacksaw to cut through the filter can. I look forward to hearing if this sorts you out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted May 12, 2019 Author Member Contributer Share Posted May 12, 2019 On 5/8/2019 at 9:51 AM, Zarquon said: Sounds like I need to add a job to the list on my gen5. I take it your in Aus. Was wondering who did your injector clean and what it cost? Hi I sent them to a company called EFI Hardware who are based in Victoria. Their web page is at www.efihardware.com I had them back in a week and it cost $40 an injector + p&p. They also provided new filter baskets that fit inside the injector but couldn’t supply one of the small o rings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Marooncobra Posted May 12, 2019 Author Member Contributer Share Posted May 12, 2019 On 5/9/2019 at 2:58 AM, GreginDenver said: I'm a bit confused about this statement. Are you talking about the wad of stainless steel that sits directly beneath the return fuel line for the pressure regulator bypassed fuel? As far as I know this wad of coarse stainless steel wool is in place to prevent the pressure-bypassed return fuel flow from spraying/splashing all over the place when the fuel level in the tank is low. This wad of stainless steel wool has the effect of helping the returned fuel (bypassed at the fuel pressure regulator on the throttle body) to arrive in the vicinity of the fuel pump pickup point with very low turbulence and splash occurring. (Fuel injection systems are always set up with a fuel pump that puts out more pressure and volume than the system needs, this is what allows the fuel pressure regulator to control the system's operating PSI. This specified surplus of pressure and volume allows for the gradual reduction over time (in years) of fuel pump output that occurs due to normal wear-and-tear on the clearances of the fuel pump internal parts.) Hi Yes I was talking about the the wad of metal wool at the fuel pick up/ fuel return area. I noticed that the fuel return from the Fuel pressure regulator is directed onto this wad but didn’t realise it would be to prevent splashing/spraying/turbulence as being a flooded system I assumed it would just be a flow of constant bypassed fuel. The injection pump did have a small micron pre filter that had some small debris collected. My comment was that the metal wool that I replaced for $15.00 from Honda could have been replaced with a kitchen metal scouring pad for 0.99 cents. The metal wad filter I replaced was definitely not stainless steel but aluminium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreginDenver Posted May 12, 2019 Share Posted May 12, 2019 18 hours ago, Marooncobra said: I noticed that the fuel return from the Fuel pressure regulator is directed onto this wad but didn’t realize it would be to prevent splashing/spraying/turbulence as being a flooded system I assumed it would just be a flow of constant bypassed fuel. I think the wad of spiral metal is only there the help out when the fuel quantity gets low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastodonrider Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 I never used the new fuel filter that I picked up. I tried a bit of Liquid Performance fuel system cleaner for 200 miles (single tank of gas) then put on another 1000 miles with no treatment on regular 93 octane pump gas (standard 'Murrican petrol) and that's cleared up the issue it seems. The last 200-300 miles have been smooth sailing. Time will tell if that's cleared it up for good or if I'll have to use that new fuel filter later on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.