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New 5th/6th/8th gen performance header now in production in USA


sfdownhill

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That's awesome! Did you just email Yaman and ask him when he was available? I have not messed with the software too much since initial install.  

 

Those baffles are my next priority! 

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5 hours ago, ShipFixer said:

That's awesome! Did you just email Yaman and ask him when he was available? I have not messed with the software too much since initial install.  

 

Those baffles are my next priority!

 

Before talking with Yaman, you'll need to get the MTB installed.   If you don't have switched power available for it, you'll need to rig that up - fortunately I already had it.  Also, the O2 sensor lead met up with the MTB lead right at the tank hinge.  That might work in other instances, but the plugs are large and I have wiring for HID headlights, a power outlet and 847 wiring through there, so I got an extension cable to move the plug away from that area.  Then you'll need to get the MTB plugged in to the RB module.  Before calling Yaman you'll need to download software called "Team Viewer" to your laptop and have that ready in addition to the RB software.  You'll get a code from Team Viewer and give that to him allowing him to remote in to your laptop and view your software and map.  You'll need the USB cable from the RB module (not MTB) to plug in to your laptop.  Be in the garage with all that ready when you call him.  I was not ready and he wasn't all that happy with me.  At any rate,  I caught him on a Saturday morning right at his opening time and he was available.  What he'll do is run through the setup routine that's found in MTB documentation.  You could do that yourself, but he's so adept at it - it could save a lot of time and frustration.  He'll make all the adjustments to the map, then have you start the bike and watch what it's doing to verify the install.  It might be good to read through the MTB software to see what he's going to do when he remotes in to your bike - have some idea of what he's doing. 

 

Before ordering on line, you might call him to see if he has a MTB available.  He's gone through a lot of them and the 2 times prior that I called he was sold out.  It will not tell you that on the website.  On this last attempt he had one - I told him my name and he said it was mine - I had the payment through in under 10 minutes - he shipped it the same day. 

 

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Well, fortunately I did get a switched power extension with the VFRNess I haven’t installed yet (put the R/R in and haven’t felt the urge to prioritize).  This is sounding like a bit more work than I was expecting though 🙃

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 So, an update on the MTB.  Set out at 7:00 for a 200 mile loop around Mt Hood. It's going to be 100 today so an early start when it was 65 felt great. With the RB Racing, the tune is very smooth, almost as buttery as my 4th gen was.  I had picked up a mpg or 2, I had consistently gotten 40 with the Power Commander and with RB Racing it was maybe 42. 

Now with MTB and tuned to a cruise AFR of 13.5, at 5,000 to 6,500 rpm I could sense just a very tiny bit of hesitancy when rolling in to the throttle.  I'm picking nits - it's subtle. No annoying bucking or jerking, but I could tell is was just a bit different - just a very slight hesitation.  Roll in to it assertively though,  and there's  plenty of smooth mid range mojo. I'm a perfectionist,  so if things are the slightest off, it gets to me. Anyway it's nothing I would fret over.  Here's the other side of the coin.  As I climbed the pass up to 5,000 feet at Govt Camp, i was about 65 miles from my fill up and still showing 7 bars on the gas gauge.  I recall thinking that was odd,  by 65 miles I'd normally have no more than 6 and maybe even 5 bars. I continued over the summit and then down Hwy 35 to Hood River  (what a beautiful run - just the fresh smell of the forest is itself worth the trip). Got gas at H.R. and continued home where I filled again.  Total mileage was 199, on 4.326 gal - 46 mpg. Ive never gotten that with this bike. So range is the benefit to me - 15% over the PC tune. I'd guess that riding the PC tune back to back vs this one would not reveal a noticeable difference, so I think a win. 

Next iteration may be to nudge the cruise  AFR down to 13.4, assess and repeat to find the best blend of smoothness vs mileage.  The 12 AFR for higher throttle settings seems just fine - she likes to run when you put the whip to it.  

And the O2 pigtail is still good - after 300 miles I'm going to close the case on that item. 

 

The photo of Mt Hood was taken about 9:30 this a.m., maybe 6 miles south of Hood River, OR, on Hwy 35, looking southwest.  

20210626_085828.jpg

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Watching the MotoAmerica races and there's a view of Mt Ranier in the background-said it was gonna be over 100 degrees today and tomorrow.  Glad you got out early.  Beautiful view.

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So...I have a couple questions...

How much are/were these headers going for? I read thru a lot of posts, and it seems like they were going to run around the $800 mark. What did they come out to? Also, what makes these headers better than Delkevics or Lexteks? Seriously, I have no experience with any of these.

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4 hours ago, Ziffer said:

So...I have a couple questions...

How much are/were these headers going for? I read thru a lot of posts, and it seems like they were going to run around the $800 mark. What did they come out to? Also, what makes these headers better than Delkevics or Lexteks? Seriously, I have no experience with any of these.

US $8-900+ depending on if you wanted them passivated and crush gaskets and centre stand stop supplied.

 

These WiLD Headers are a performance part (proven on dyno) not a replacement, that is, the Internal Diameters of these headers are larger compared to the others.

 

Proper merges

Have a look at Delkevic's merge junction 🤮 

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13 hours ago, ducnut said:

VFRD header versus Black Widow header. 
 

84E69BEC-D438-4116-873B-9E455066EB10.png

 

I hate to say this, but for clarification FWIW that may be true but AFAIK is not verified . . . the photo is a comparison of the VFRD tube to the 6th gen OEM header.  If a B.W. is the same diameter then it would be true however that is not what's in the photo. To be fair the description was somewhat ambiguous in the original post.   The pic was originally was posted April 20 last year on page 29 of the thread, below. 

 

https://www.vfrdiscussion.com/index.php?/forums/topic/88463-new-5th6th8th-gen-performance-header-now-in-production-in-usa/page/29/&tab=comments#comment-1107058

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7 hours ago, Cogswell said:

 

I hate to say this, but for clarification FWIW that may be true but AFAIK is not verified . . . the photo is a comparison of the VFRD tube to the 6th gen OEM header.  If a B.W. is the same diameter then it would be true however that is not what's in the photo. To be fair the description was somewhat ambiguous in the original post.   The pic was originally was posted April 20 last year on page 29 of the thread, below. 

 

https://www.vfrdiscussion.com/index.php?/forums/topic/88463-new-5th6th8th-gen-performance-header-now-in-production-in-usa/page/29/&tab=comments#comment-1107058


I corrected it. It’s been so long and my memory was off. 

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On 7/14/2021 at 6:57 PM, Ziffer said:

So...I have a couple questions...

How much are/were these headers going for? I read thru a lot of posts, and it seems like they were going to run around the $800 mark. What did they come out to? Also, what makes these headers better than Delkevics or Lexteks? Seriously, I have no experience with any of these.

The difference is these actually make power 

7003ACA2-3B6B-430C-9CE1-E5F368499F7E.jpeg

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Minor update here.  Finally got the "quieter" baffles from Delkevic and was in town long enough to install them.  They "fit" at an angle and could have been designed better.  But...they're in.  The bike is a bit quieter and more liveable, but still loud.  Kinda wish  I'd tried the SS90's instead, as they're capped and another inch (thinking every bit counts).  Contemplating getting a couple 13" Delkevics of similar design since they will fit the collector and modding them into 10" sets.

 

Very happy with how the engine is running, just a lot louder than I am used to!

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On 7/14/2021 at 11:51 PM, boOZZIE said:

US $8-900+ depending on if you wanted them passivated and crush gaskets and centre stand stop supplied.

 

These WiLD Headers are a performance part (proven on dyno) not a replacement, that is, the Internal Diameters of these headers are larger compared to the others.

 

Proper merges

Have a look at Delkevic's merge junction 🤮 

 

On 7/16/2021 at 5:35 PM, ducnut said:

VFRD header versus 6th Gen header. 
 

84E69BEC-D438-4116-873B-9E455066EB10.png

 

On 7/17/2021 at 6:55 AM, Cogswell said:

 

I hate to say this, but for clarification FWIW that may be true but AFAIK is not verified . . . the photo is a comparison of the VFRD tube to the 6th gen OEM header.  If a B.W. is the same diameter then it would be true however that is not what's in the photo. To be fair the description was somewhat ambiguous in the original post.   The pic was originally was posted April 20 last year on page 29 of the thread, below. 

 

https://www.vfrdiscussion.com/index.php?/forums/topic/88463-new-5th6th8th-gen-performance-header-now-in-production-in-usa/page/29/&tab=comments#comment-1107058

 

On 7/18/2021 at 5:11 AM, Gotama said:

The difference is these actually make power 

7003ACA2-3B6B-430C-9CE1-E5F368499F7E.jpeg

Thanks for the replies, guys.

 

Okay, so pipe diameter is a part of it. I notice Lextek and Black Widow pair the front pipes together, and the rears together. I have a 2000 5th gen. It seems this is NOT the optimal configuration for dispersing the pulses.

 

And it looks like Delkevic has a rather ugly 4 into 1 collector, and a lot of slip joints.

 

It's pretty awesome that you folks were able to get these pipes into production. Wish I had a set on my bike.

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They are the real deal and if they ever run another batch you should consider buying a set.  

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It looked like the last batch pretty much satisfied the demand out there.  But, you never know.  

 

I'm finally racking up some miles on mine.  I was hoping that the cat gone missing might allow more heat to exit vs build up in the headers, but the jury is out on that.  They seem to improve the midrange response around 7,000 rpm and they definitely sound better!    This afternoon I pulled in to a station to fill up.  There were two quad cab 4x4s with flatbed trailers that had quads, gas cans, all sorts of powersports gear and two couples each from the two pickups.  I finished my business, mounted up and thumbed the starter.  As I idled away from the pump all 8 heads turned in unison and one of the women said "what is THAT"??  I was laughing inside my helmet.   Well 'ol girl, you may be 13 years old now, but you've still got "it" and your V-4 is still something special.  Those VFRD headers put a double underscore on that.  

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Now that some miles are racking up on the headers they are mellowing in color. I thought that would be pricipally near the heads, but it seems to be the entire length,  just not as pronounced as at the heads. Not a big deal - just a bit more than I expected. 

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10 hours ago, Cogswell said:

Now that some miles are racking up on the headers they are mellowing in color. I thought that would be pricipally near the heads, but it seems to be the entire length,  just not as pronounced as at the heads. Not a big deal - just a bit more than I expected. 

Same here.   Just a little golden hue.  Did you have yours passivated?

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46 minutes ago, interceptor69 said:

Same here.   Just a little golden hue.  Did you have yours passivated?

Yes

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First run set install report. I made a small clearance cut in chin fairing and added heatshield including around right fairing boss just below that opening. The center stand just barely rubs in its upright position - works for me. I had it wedged on install but by the time it was all torqued it just touches. I bet I could clear it if I had another set of gaskets. Repacked the carbon pipe and used permatex copper on the two slip joints after expanding the mid pipe with an autozone tool and impact gun. Have the KN filter now and PC3 with the 302 map and will try the full erion map next.

 

Thanks everyone for the work getting this together and the tips in this thread to get it installed. Sounds incredible and much better low end driveability and mid range torque!

1352856110_vfr-Copy.jpg

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Throwing some more data points in.  I rode mine all the way around San Diego yesterday, including Sunrise Highway, over several hours, and included a stop at @sfdownhill's to show off how his creation is getting used on my bike 😄  So riding between sea level and 5,000 feet, mostly highway speed and 30-60 in twisty highway stuff.  It was 78-80 most of the time.  I haven't touched the Rapidbike since installing it before the headers and Delkevics, and my bike really needs some injector work plus starter valve sync, etc. just to give you an idea of how it is right now.  I'm also only using the stock narrowband sensors.  But I still managed 42mpg with saddlebags, which equals what the bike got when new (42 with, 46 without).  It hasn't seen quite that good mileage in a while!  It also managed to keep temps lower as it wasn't working as hard.  At steady speed it was pretty rock solid between 174-180.  

 

Performance wise...wow.  There is little to no resistance climbing past 6,000 RPM.  It's pretty crazy how it wants to run, regardless of gear.  There is quite a bit more torque across the rev range, and I'm wondering just how much, along with how it'll go once I've got everything fixed and tuned.  This is more due to RapidBike, but there's still no return of the dreaded closed-loop taper/surge behavior.  Even though I haven't gone in to reset it or anything, it's adapted to the Delkevics pretty quickly.  

 

The "quieter baffle" in the Delkevics also brings down the sound level to just within tolerance for riding.  At speed (above 55 or so) the sound disappears behind you so long as you are at cruising RPM.  Sitting at idle or low speed it's still pretty loud but doesn't wear me out.  What's really interesting is how cars react.  They all know I'm there for sure now, and on Sunrise Highway they all either stayed pretty far back or used the next available turnout to let me pass :lol:  I still coast in a bit to my driveway and try to get away from home as quickly as possible, but my neighbors tell me they have yet to hear the bike inside their houses.  

 

Bike still has some behavior that's attributable to old and dirty fueling, including difficulty starting/restarting sometimes.  On my RapidBike auto map there are also a lot more maxed out values than in the other kids.  So there are clearly more gains to go here, but the headers are crazy good so far.

 

 

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On 7/19/2021 at 1:37 PM, interceptor69 said:

They are the real deal and if they ever run another batch you should consider buying a set.  


It looks like I missed out; but I’m totally committed for the next batch for my 6th gen!
 

I messaged MrSqiggle a few weeks ago about buying the uninstalled set he has for sale on these forums (even though shipping from Oz would likely be expensive) but it seems he hasn’t logged in for over a month. 😩

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On 7/25/2021 at 4:41 PM, ShipFixer said:

But I still managed 42mpg with saddlebags, which equals what the bike got when new (42 with, 46 without). 

 

My '98 just got around 28 mpg in similar conditions, but I managed to get it down to 23.8 one tank where we picked up the pace. I don't think I ever saw above 35 even before the headers and pc3. Are other people getting similar numbers on their 5th gens or should i get a new fuel pressure regulator?

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1 hour ago, Funkotron said:

 

 

My '98 just got around 28 mpg in similar conditions, but I managed to get it down to 23.8 one tank where we picked up the pace. I don't think I ever saw above 35 even before the headers and pc3. Are other people getting similar numbers on their 5th gens or should i get a new fuel pressure regulator?

Don't know about the FPR question - but those are very low numbers.   You should be getting close to ShipFixer's numbers.   Easy places to start looking are air filter, vacuum leaks, and if you have a temp gun, check to see that the headers near the heads are all equal temperatures.  Coolant should be in the 180 degree range +/-.  If too low you may have a cylinder not firing.  Check the plugs - they should all be a light tan and all the same and if not check the leads from the coils to plugs per the FSM. Also, do you have a tuning module installed?  If so, you might disconnect it and see what you get.  Early 5th gens rarely benefit from those - they run quite well as stock and really don't need any tuning modifications.   There are more diagnostics in the manual but those are easy / no cost things you can check to get started. 

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42 minutes ago, Cogswell said:

Don't know about the FPR question - but those are very low numbers.  

heads are all equal temperatures. 

Coolant should be in the 180 degree range +/-. 

Also, do you have a tuning module installed?

 

well i wouldn't say i was taking it easy out there, but i should probably start a new thread about it. it's always run hot so i put a fan override, a 1.6 bar cap, and distilled water with water wetter in it to avoid barrelling past 220F coolant temp in slow stuff. it averaged 175F but dropped down to 165F up in the mountains in the rain which i wasn't thrilled with, however I finally managed to not hit runaway conditions in the twisties and keep it under 200F!

 

thanks for the reply!

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