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VFR800 rear hub


Skids

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Hi all

 

The chain adjustment on my 2015 VFR800X is getting quite stiff so I plan to dismantle the rear hub to see if needs cleaning up. I'm fairly happy with the dismantling but just want to check that it's ok to sand it down to clean it and does it require greasing before re-assembly? If so, what type of grease? I have some Castrol LM grease in the garage. I'll also check the brake torque arm for any deterioration.

 

Thanks.

 

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It's not a "moving part" in the normal sense, so I wouldn't use grease if the workshop manual doesn't call for grease.  You do want the pinch bolt to pinch, don't you?

 

Ciao,

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When I refurbished my 2 5th Gen VFRs I disassembled and thoroughly cleaned all of the surfaces of the rear hub and the area where it mates into the swing arm. 

 

Judging from what I found on both of my VFRs when I disassembled and removed the hub from the swing arm, the only area that seemed to need anything beyond just a good cleaning was where the brake torque link fit around and against the hub.  There was evidence of friction between the two, a bit of scrubbing between the two parts, maybe even a little bit of dissimilar-metals induced galling (different alloys?) where the two parts mate together. 

 

So on this area I applied copper based anti-seize compound during reassembly (to make their coexistence easier).

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I just checked my service manual and the assembly instructions don't say anything about greasing the mating surface between the bearing holder and the swing arm. That said, it also doesn't say to grease the axle and that just seems odd.

 

I greased both. My rule of thumb is a light coating of grease on any machined surface that meets another machined surface -- YMMV.

 

If you want to apply grease, yes, your Castrol LM is fine based on it saying it is suitable for "wheel bearings" and a quick Google says it's NLGI grade 2.

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Thanks for the replies guys, though I'm now not sure whether I should grease the hub or not. I will certainly clean the surfaces and take a look at the torque arm too, but to grease or not to grease.....that is the question?  :wacko:

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Well I just replaced the bearings in mine & fitted the hub back in the swing arm. Grease the shaft where it has contact with the bearings and splines that’s all, stops it attracting dirt. I use bearing grease on the bearing areas & copper ease on the splines & nut threaded area.

I cleaned up the swing arm hub clamp areas & treated them with some WD40, then popped the hub in. Added some copper ease to the hub where the brake torque arm rides.

 

Both left bearings were shot, the needle bearing was probably OK, but I replaced it anyway.

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Interesting question (not that I've ever managed to persuade the axle to come out of my bike), I looked in the 3/4G, 5G and 6G manuals that I have, all were silent on greasing the outside of the eccentric bearing carrier, all specified cleaning the inside of the swingarm. Sounds like  you got it right Mohawk.. 

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On a related matter. I got the needle roller bearing size info & baulked at the Honda price in the UK at £82 (gbp). So ordered an equivalent SKF bearing (50x62x25mm) only to discover when driving out the old bearing that it has a seal on the inside edge, so only has 19mm needle rollers. 

 

This is left me a small delema re the new bearing. I could not find a equivalent bearing, so decided to make my own inside seal. As per the pics, it’s a piece of thin leather cut to fit with a piece of stiff card glued to the back to reinforce it whilst it was glued in place & left for 24hrs to cure in place. Then I added a 50x57x3.5mm O-ring to ride in the hole between the bearing & the new outer seal. Drifted in the new bearing & outer seal & packed everything with grease. 

 

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CFE63BA8-D416-4A7C-977D-25F3D5A700DD.thumb.jpeg.f1e3b7382365a3d8cb7ada10b9fe3dd4.jpeg

 

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Everything else went back in as per stock. All feels good & no slop in the axle now, plus I have a greater needle bearing surface that is 23mm wide, compared to 19mm stock. 

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Mohawk, I love solutions that have been thought through like this - awesome, mate! 

 

A bit of clear thinking and the b@lls to try is all you need sometimes. On many forums the members are so scared to deviate from factory spec and shoot down anyone who tries. I’m glad this forum is different. 

 

Thanks - you’ve cheered me up! 

 

Stray 

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On 6/17/2018 at 8:45 AM, Skids said:

Thanks for the replies guys, though I'm now not sure whether I should grease the hub or not. I will certainly clean the surfaces and take a look at the torque arm too, but to grease or not to grease.....that is the question?  :wacko:

Skids, grease that sucker! 

 

All the Dicati guys grease their...uh, hubs, ahem.

 

Ducati SSSA manuals call for some unibtanium proprietary grease but I imagine anything would probably do. 

 

When mine comes ones out next month it will get some molly grease because that’s what I’ve got kicking about. It doesn’t spin at speed (like a bearing) so don’t worry too much about the type of grease. 

 

Even anti-seize (copper ease?) might be ok but some more knowledgeable folk may want to straighten that out for you. 

 

Stray

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3 minutes ago, Stray said:

Skids, grease that sucker! 

 

All the Dicati guys grease their...uh, hubs, ahem.

 

Ducati SSSA manuals call for some unibtanium proprietary grease but I imagine anything would probably do. 

 

When mine comes ones out next month it will get some molly grease because that’s what I’ve got kicking about. It doesn’t spin at speed (like a bearing) so don’t worry too much about the type of grease. 

 

Even anti-seize (copper ease?) might be ok but some more knowledgeable folk may want to straighten that out for you. 

 

Stray

 

A good friend of mine "in the know" has said to grease it too and I trust him more than anyone else I know.

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1 hour ago, Stray said:

A bit of clear thinking and the b@lls to try is all you need sometimes. On many forums the members are so scared to deviate from factory spec and shoot down anyone who tries. I’m glad this forum is different. 

 

It's not a fear of deviation from the Honda line (which has a few engineers on staff, I reckon), but a question of why do something different if you don't have a good reason for doing it?  What is the purpose of applying lubricant to a clamping surface?  It is near impossible to actually seize the bearing carrier in the swing arm, so what is it you're trying to do?  

 

Ciao,

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16 minutes ago, JZH said:

 

It's not a fear of deviation from the Honda line (which has a few engineers on staff, I reckon), but a question of why do something different if you don't have a good reason for doing it?  What is the purpose of applying lubricant to a clamping surface?  It is near impossible to actually seize the bearing carrier in the swing arm, so what is it you're trying to do?  

 

Ciao,

 

For me, it's to free up the chain adjustment....it's very difficult to move it and I'm having to resort to using a hammer so cleaning the surfaces and applying a little lubricant seems to make sense.

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30 minutes ago, JZH said:

 

It's not a fear of deviation from the Honda line (which has a few engineers on staff, I reckon), but a question of why do something different if you don't have a good reason for doing it?  What is the purpose of applying lubricant to a clamping surface?  It is near impossible to actually seize the bearing carrier in the swing arm, so what is it you're trying to do?  

 

Ciao,

 

11 minutes ago, Skids said:

 

For me, it's to free up the chain adjustment....it's very difficult to move it and I'm having to resort to using a hammer so cleaning the surfaces and applying a little lubricant seems to make sense.

 I'm personally on the fence about it. On one hand grease captures grit, on the other it keeps moisture out and aids in chain adjustment. I've never had any issue with it being tough to adjust, though, at least with the tool kit spanner and extension. Also, it's aluminum on aluminum so no issues with dissimilar metals. Pretty sure I left mine dry when I last had it apart. I'd make sure it's clean and let it ride...

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If the hub won’t adjust & the pinch bolt is definitely free, then it’s likely to have corrroded on the mating surfaces. Easy win, is a flat blade screw driver, used as a wedge beside the pinch bolt, push it in by hand just enough to expand the joint then the hub should move freely. Work the hub back & forth to clean the corrosion. If it’s still stiff, you will have to remove the hub & clean out the swing arm, as grit gets in there& can lock the hub !

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Because there are plenty of holes in the swing arm to let it in, grit is the more likely cause of a stuck bearing carrier than corrosion (unless the bike's been under seawater), and grease is only going to attract more grit!  And because you can easily expand the joint with a screwdriver like Mo says, there is no real issue with an actual seizure of the hub--it just cannot happen.  I say, if it's stuck, it's time to clean out the grit...

 

Ciao,

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Thanks guys. I shall take a look.

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On 6/18/2018 at 8:32 PM, JZH said:

 

It's not a fear of deviation from the Honda line (which has a few engineers on staff, I reckon), but a question of why do something different if you don't have a good reason for doing it?  What is the purpose of applying lubricant to a clamping surface?  It is near impossible to actually seize the bearing carrier in the swing arm, so what is it you're trying to do?  

 

Ciao,

JZH, I was referring to Mohawk’s clever solution to a wider bearing and his custom home-made seal. That was genius. Both an improvement on factory (wider bearing) and an impressive way of tackling it. 

 

You may be right about greasing the hub. I’m not sure but instinct says to grease. Clearly there is room for arguments on both sides. Ducati say grease it and Honda don’t. 

 

I’m going to apply a smear of extreme pressure molly grease (my do-it-all grease) because I think it will do more good than harm. And I ride in salt.

 

Hopefull it won’t turn into sandpaper. 

 

Stray

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