Minimum voltage to charge battery when riding?

[whiteknuckles]

Recently added a voltmeter to my '02. Without heated gear on, I'm getting 13.8 V when running at speed, which I know is pretty typical.  With vest and gloves on full blast, I get 12.7 to 12.9 volts.  Is that enough to still charge my battery? 

[VFROZ]

A good battery standing should have around 13v.

so in theory 12.8v is not putting back what you used to start the bike with. 

Is that the voltage you're getting at over 5000 revs?

Where are you reading voltage from?

[whiteknuckles]

2 hours ago, VFROZ said:

A good battery standing should have around 13v.

so in theory 12.8v is not putting back what you used to start the bike with. 

Is that the voltage you're getting at over 5000 revs?

Where are you reading voltage from?

I'm taking the reading from a distrubution block I installed that has my heated gear and tomtom GPS.  The power to the block is spliced from my tailight.  The ground from the block is good.

[Lee 2002]

 The power to the block is spliced from my tailight.  

So you're powering heated gear, and a GPS from a 28 gauge wire that is intended to run two 21 watt lamps?  

[whiteknuckles]

21 minutes ago, Lee 2002 said:

So you're powering heated gear, and a GPS from a 28 gauge wire that is intended to run two 21 watt lamps?  

Where would you recommend?  Did the same on my SV650.  Had it for 5 years w/o a problem.  No melted taillight wires.  But if there's a better spot, let me know.

[ZCD76]

26 minutes ago, whiteknuckles said:

Where would you recommend?  Did the same on my SV650.  Had it for 5 years w/o a problem.  No melted taillight wires.  But if there's a better spot, let me know.

Directly off the battery is where I would recommend. I have a distribution block wired directly to the battery with a 10 gauge wire. I see no less than 14.1 volts off of it. 

[whiteknuckles]

3 minutes ago, ZCD76 said:

Directly off the battery is where I would recommend. I have a distribution block wired directly to the battery with a 10 gauge wire. I see no less than 14.1 volts off of it. 

Does that mean the block is always "hot"? (ie never turns off)

[ZCD76]

Yes, but I don't have anything that constantly draws off the block. I installed it for USB-type devices - recharging/charging the phone, navigation, and such devices when I'm riding. 

[whiteknuckles]

1 minute ago, ZCD76 said:

Yes, but I don't have anything that constantly draws off the block. I installed it for USB-type devices - recharging/charging the phone, navigation, and such devices when I'm riding. 

Will wire it up that way and see what I get for voltage. Thanks.

 

[Lee 2002]

18 minutes ago, whiteknuckles said:

Does that mean the block is always "hot"? (ie never turns off)

I suspect the best advice here would be to take your motorcycle to a qualified mechanic.  But against my better judgement, I'm going to offer the advice to wire the distribution block off the load side of the main 30 amp fuse using 10 gauge wire to an automotive relay.  Power the relay from your tail lamp wire so that your distribution block cycles with key-on.

There are many turn-key devices out there that are pre-wired with relays and fused lugs.   As an example, just because it was the first one that popped up on my Google search:   http://www.fuzeblocks.com/

 

 

 

 

[Lee 2002]

47 minutes ago, ZCD76 said:

Directly off the battery is where I would recommend. I have a distribution block wired directly to the battery with a 10 gauge wire. I see no less than 14.1 volts off of it. 

Never wire anything directly to your battery without fusing that wire.   It is a much better idea to source from the load side of the 30 amp main fuse.  If you are reluctant to do that, use a properly sized inline fuse as close to the battery terminal as possible.

[ZCD76]

1 minute ago, Lee 2002 said:

Never wire anything directly to your battery without fusing that wire.   It is a much better idea to source from the load side of the 30 amp main fuse.  If you are reluctant to do that, use a properly sized inline fuse as close to the battery terminal as possible.

To assuage your fears, it is fused. I have an inline fuse a couple of inches off the battery with a 10 amp fuse in it...between the battery and the distribution block. Each lead off the distribution block is fused, as well, with a 5 amp mini ATM-type fuse. I have no major power consuming devices wired off of this setup.

[Lee 2002]

 

2 hours ago, ZCD76 said:

To assuage your fears, it is fused....

 I'm sure you'll understand that advice wasn't directed toward you.

[Lorne]

7 hours ago, whiteknuckles said:

Recently added a voltmeter to my '02. Without heated gear on, I'm getting 13.8 V when running at speed, which I know is pretty typical.  With vest and gloves on full blast, I get 12.7 to 12.9 volts.  Is that enough to still charge my battery? 

 

Knuckles,

Have you verified that voltmeter against a known good test meter? It is probably accurate enough but worth double checking.

 

If it checks out then the charging system is not up to the additional load. It may be that your gear exceeds the VFR's nominal capacity. Or the stator has deteriorated and is unable to output 100%.

 

You said the tail light circuit is powering your accessories. Does the distribution block use a relays or fuses?

[VFROZ]

Only use the tailight wiring to power a relay. Key on, power on, key off, no power.

Your meter should be only reading directly from the battery, through the switched part of the relay.

I have a high current power block with thick gauge wires directly from the battery, three terminals for positive, and three for ground.

All my added gear is connected to the block by srew terminals through it's own fuse. I can fit up to 2 devices per terminal.

I think you will find the voltage is fine, you just have too many devices coming from one wire that can't handle the load.

And your meter is reading what power is left after all your devices and tailight bulbs have sucked it dry.

 

[whiteknuckles]

I was incorrect that the distribution block receives its power from the tail light.  The tail light only powers a relay.  This is my current set-up :

I will check the gauge of the wire from my battery to the relay, but I'm pretty sure its 12 gauge, which is rated to 25W I believe. I don't believe I'm in danger of frying any wires, as my Tour Master Vest pulls 4.3W, my gloves pull 2W.  I can't find a definitive number for my GPS, but I'd be surprised if it pulls more than 12W (1 amp @ 12V).  The voltmeter I have installed is +/- 0.1 Volt from my Fluke multi-meter. 

[Lorne]

3 hours ago, whiteknuckles said:

I will check the gauge of the wire from my battery to the relay, but I'm pretty sure its 12 gauge, which is rated to 25W I believe. I don't believe I'm in danger of frying any wires, as my Tour Master Vest pulls 4.3W, my gloves pull 2W.  I can't find a definitive number for my GPS, but I'd be surprised if it pulls more than 12W (1 amp @ 12V).  The voltmeter I have installed is +/- 0.1 Volt from my Fluke multi-meter. 

 

Looks like the distribution block is properly wired to the bike so no worries about on that front. Still worth checking the connections linking the stator/rectifier-regulator/starter relay/battery for any signs of corrosion or heat stress.

I think you meant to say that the vest consumes 4.3 Amps/51 watts and 2 amps/25 watts for the gloves.

[whiteknuckles]

21 minutes ago, Lorne said:

 

Looks like the distribution block is properly wired to the bike so no worries about on that front. Still worth checking the connections linking the stator/rectifier-regulator/starter relay/battery for any signs of corrosion or heat stress.

I think you meant to say that the vest consumes 4.3 Amps/51 watts and 2 amps/25 watts for the gloves.

You are correct about the wattage draw error.  I also screwed up the max wattage for 12 gauge wire at 12V.  Looks like it' 408 watts, so I'm well within the safe zone.  I'll check those connections.

[bykemike]

recheck the wattage calcs, I believe 12 gauge wire is ok for 20 amps, so amp x volts = watts...240 watts.  I am certain you can figure 12gauge for 25 amps but that would be pushing the possible heat gain in the wire.

 

Link to ampacity table below

 

https://www.bing.com/search?q=ampacity+table+for+wire&form=EDGTCT&qs=SC&cvid=3794e751e2bd448a85dca364d9938cde&refig=f1e56a4ff882495cf41e9222bc4b74c1&cc=US&setlang=en-US&elv=AXK1c4IvZoNqPoPnS!QRLOMDDUgKjy8Rd71vvKtwhIXiBiM8BGbcKgyBt9GO14J89UbfcvKG67a1xaeKfQANbeWTGU!pKqzqMaejRQWIe58p&PC=HCTS

[whiteknuckles]

1 hour ago, bykemike said:

recheck the wattage calcs, I believe 12 gauge wire is ok for 20 amps, so amp x volts = watts...240 watts.  I am certain you can figure 12gauge for 25 amps but that would be pushing the possible heat gain in the wire.

 

Link to ampacity table below

 

https://www.bing.com/search?q=ampacity+table+for+wire&form=EDGTCT&qs=SC&cvid=3794e751e2bd448a85dca364d9938cde&refig=f1e56a4ff882495cf41e9222bc4b74c1&cc=US&setlang=en-US&elv=AXK1c4IvZoNqPoPnS!QRLOMDDUgKjy8Rd71vvKtwhIXiBiM8BGbcKgyBt9GO14J89UbfcvKG67a1xaeKfQANbeWTGU!pKqzqMaejRQWIe58p&PC=HCTS

Thanks for the correction.  Looks like I'm well below the danger zone for the power draw on a 12 gauge wire.