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Universal switchgear


Katie

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2 hours ago, Katie said:

 

 

Don't you just love those custom jobs? :unsure:

 

Thanks Woodie but I grabbed one off Ebay. Seems to be in good nick so hopeful it will work (even if the mod doesn't!). Hang on to yours - if this works it will be worth a fortune!

 

I'm hoping to fettle it back on the road just waiting for the inevitable delay as the Insurance company tries to wiggle out of their obligation to cough up.

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Well, that was fun. Got the fairing off with the usual compliment of allen key, metal poking thing (for some of the fairing pins), philips screwdriver for the other type and flat head screwdriver (for wedging off the clips once the screw/pokey thing was removed), socket set and torque wrench (for the crash bung) and knife for dealing with failure when clips won't co-operate.

 

Traced the wires, double-checked against the workshop manual and wiring diagram and realised that:

 

a) all plugs completely different size and shape and

 

b) all the wires are different colours

 

Put the fairing back on and gave the bike a clean. The job may be possible but I reckon it would take an experienced mechanic, skilled at wiring, a good day to sort out so will just have to accept the inevitable and put up with never being able to hoot (on time) at someone when they're pulling out on me :sad:

 

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I have swapped switch pods several times, including US/UK swaps (headlight switch, passing switch) and some other mods, so I'm sure I could do it.  Unfortunately, I lack (a) a 6th gen switch pod, (b) a 2014 VFR victim to work on and (c) time...  Actually, I probably do have something equivalent to a 6th gen switch pod, as the ones from that era were very similar.  The LHS connector is different (looks like a Sumitomo HD 0.090" (but 10-way) unsealed connector.)  (Also see eBay 282124262548.)  However, I've never worked with this type of connector, so I don't know how tricky it is to work with the terminals, etc.  

 

As for "getting used to it", it probably depends on whether any other bikes you ride are the same or different.  I probably drive my wife's Golf R32 more often than my Asian-spec Toyota Hiace van, but the two vehicles have the turn indicator and lighting control stalks reversed--and it drives me bloody nuts!  Bizarrely, UK-spec Toyotas have the stalks the same way around as the Golf (and Japan and the UK both drive on the left side of the road), so it's a real wtfer...

 

Ciao,

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If the wiring requirements for both switchpods are the same (as in same inputs/outputs) but the plug body is different and the wires located differently, it should be possible to release the retaining tangs on each wire in the incorrect connector and slip it out, then slide it into the correct connector in the right location. That is provided the pins themselves are compatible.

 

 

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No such luck, I'm afraid.  The normal Honda connectors (MTW, sometimes called "Hitachi") use 0.110" terminals, which are larger and designed differently than the 0.090" terminals on the Sumitomo connectors Honda has now begun to use in certain applications (the RHS connectors on the same bike are still the old style).  Eastern Beaver sells the terminals separately, and that eBay seller I referred to sells the connectors complete with terminals.  

 

There shouldn't be any electronics located inside the switch pods, so it should be just a matter of re-wiring.  If this were my bike I'd opt for the spare male connector from eBay, chop off the existing plug(s) on the RC46 switch pod and wire on the new connector.  But, as mentioned before, I'd also want to consult the new and old wiring diagrams before doing anything.

 

Ciao,

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  • 3 weeks later...
No such luck, I'm afraid.  The normal Honda connectors (MTW, sometimes called "Hitachi") use 0.110" terminals, which are larger and designed differently than the 0.090" terminals on the Sumitomo connectors Honda has now begun to use in certain applications (the RHS connectors on the same bike are still the old style).  Eastern Beaver sells the terminals separately, and that eBay seller I referred to sells the connectors complete with terminals.  
 
There shouldn't be any electronics located inside the switch pods, so it should be just a matter of re-wiring.  If this were my bike I'd opt for the spare male connector from eBay, chop off the existing plug(s) on the RC46 switch pod and wire on the new connector.  But, as mentioned before, I'd also want to consult the new and old wiring diagrams before doing anything.
 
Ciao,
Exackery
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  • 1 month later...

Ok, update for anyone considering this. Finally got everything in place, had to buy a used 2006 switchgear and a used 2015 one as could not get anyone to tell me which was the right connector to order!

 

Thanks to Fink for the colour matching, I chopped off the 2006 and 2015 connectors and connected the wires as per the attached chart. I had already disabled the self-cancelling indicators so just terminated that wire (if you are keeping the function, you may need to play some more). I then tried it while the original stuff was still in place and it works, yay!
 

I think you could use a generic switchgear with all the same functions, if you were prepared to chop off your existing connector and use that. Alternatively, good luck finding the matching connector!

 

This was, after all the delays, a relatively straightforward job but it is fiddly so a few things noted.

 

  • Due to the fixing screw positioning on the 2014+, you will need to remove the clutch lever assembly to get the switchgear off.

 

  • You will need to remove the left upper fairing and inside panel to access everything

 

  • The traction control cable is routed into the switchgear and down through the cable sheath, although it is not wired into the same connector (there is a separate 2 pin connector for this). If you use a Gen 6 switchgear, there is not room to route the TC wires into the switchgear housing so you will need to re-sheath this and run it parallel to the main cable.

 

  • The locator lug in the switchgear is different between models and does not align. I just chopped mine out. This may cause some movement but if so, will just put some tape on the bar to prevent slippage.

 

  • The round end-piece of the Gen 6 switchgear cannot be slipped on to the bar unless you are prepared to remove the grip first. That really wasn't gonna happen so I cut it in half with a fine hacksaw and fitted around the bar. This is pretty much hidden from view but it does close off the switchgear from the elements.

 

  • If you are doing a 'cut and join' job on the wires, make sure you chop them at different lengths otherwise you will end up with a big wadge of joined wires to pass through some fairly tight spaces (not that I would do anything as daft as that :blush: )

 

  • Be aware that the original assembly conditions would have had a helluva lot more space to work in than you are going to!

 

Extra info - The 6th Gen cable is shorter than the 8th Gen so, if you are chopping and splicing, make sure you offer them up first!

 

So that's it. In reality, once the parts had been sourced, the hardest part was routing the cables back through and trying to get the R&G Aero bung to go back in line while I was tightening it up (note to self, buy round bungs next time...)

 

Switchgear wiring colours - both.pdf

WP_20171024_16_23_24_Pro.jpg

WP_20171024_16_24_25_Pro.jpg

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Great Job Katie (and Fink) !!!  :)

 

Couple of questions please:

 

1.  I'm looking on Ebay and see a few listings for the left switch assembly for 6th gen VFRs - some picture two square connectors (one black, one red) and some picture only one black square connector?  Does it matter which one?

2.  There is a "trigger" switch on my 8th gen, front side of the switch housing, that is used to flash the high beams momentarily, activated by my left index finger (as opposed to moving the large rocker switch back and forth with my thumb) - do you still have that on your new set up with the 6th gen switch assembly?

3.  For disabling the self-canceling turn signals, was it as simple as cutting a wire or two, and if so which wire(s)?

 

Thanks!

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59 minutes ago, Samuelx said:

Great Job Katie (and Fink) !!!  :)

 

Couple of questions please:

 

1.  I'm looking on Ebay and see a few listings for the left switch assembly for 6th gen VFRs - some picture two square connectors (one black, one red) and some picture only one black square connector?  Does it matter which one?

2.  There is a "trigger" switch on my 8th gen, front side of the switch housing, that is used to flash the high beams momentarily, activated by my left index finger (as opposed to moving the large rocker switch back and forth with my thumb) - do you still have that on your new set up with the 6th gen switch assembly?

3.  For disabling the self-canceling turn signals, was it as simple as cutting a wire or two, and if so which wire(s)?

 

Thanks!

 

 

Hi Samuel

 

For the 6th Gen switchgear there should be the black and red connectors as you will need the wires from both. The red one emerges from the main cable nearer to connection end so it just may not show up in Ebay pics. You won't need the connectors though so it it won't matter if they have been lost.

 

The trigger is still there (called the passing switch on the diagram in my last post - check out the pdf above the pics)

 

Disabling the self-cancel function was simple, thanks to the collective wisdom of other VFR owners! Have attached the guide I used, happily plagiarised from others hard work! Obviously it's on the other side of the bike so it will be a full side panels off job...

 

 

Self-cancelling indicator disabling.pdf

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Hi Katie,

 

I just received a left switch assembly from ebay - there is no trigger switch but it looks like there is a rectangular cap where a trigger switch might fit - did you move your trigger switch from one assembly to the other?

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4 hours ago, Samuelx said:

Hi Katie,

 

I just received a left switch assembly from ebay - there is no trigger switch but it looks like there is a rectangular cap where a trigger switch might fit - did you move your trigger switch from one assembly to the other?

 

 

Oh dear. No, the trigger is part of the switchgear on both models. Did the US ever have a version without a passing switch? Worse case scenario, if you can't find a decent alternative, is to use the rocker switch and blank off the passing switch wires but I admit that's not great.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi All, jfyi, I emailed Joe at CycleTerminal.com and he was kind enough to provide the following info on the pictures Katie provided (Thanks again Katie!):

 

"That is in the Sumitomo HE 090 series, I have no idea where to get that one part number 6098-4662"   (Thanks again Joe!)

 

I found this:

 

http://prd.sws.co.jp/components/en/detail.php?number_s=60984662   W 39.4 x H 17.7 x D 38.4 mm

 

I emailed or messaged a few websites and then came across this one:  http://www.just-connectors.com/rfq/sumitomo/6098-4662/

 

Spoke with Eddie over the phone and he was supposed to check price/availability for me but never called or emailed me back. 

 

While browsing the Sumitomo website I also found this one http://prd.sws.co.jp/components/en/detail.php?number_s=60984660   looks identical but has different dimensions.  W 43.4 x H 19.65 x D 38.4 mm    I will probably double check the measurements the next time I pull the fairings off.

 

 

 

I mentioned somewhere (this thread or a different one) that the 6th gen left switch assembly I bought off ebay didn't have a "flash to pass high beam trigger switch" (my effed up terminology) - looking at some (not all!) of the parts diagrams from 2002-2009, it appears that the 2006-2009 6th gens had a trigger switch and the 2002-2005 didn't. 

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2x-Universal-7-8-Motorcycle-Handlebar-Horn-Turn-Signal-Light-Control-Switch/262952024345?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649     has a trigger switch but is China aftermarket, not OEM Honda...    Now I'm wondering if I can just take the trigger switch and install it into the OEM Honda...

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Good job on the connector research!

 

Regarding the aftemarket switch, why not just use that? I went for a Honda OEM but, having done the job, there's no reason why that's necessary. The retaining blob may be in a different place (I just chopped off the one on the 2006 version) but apart from that, there shouldn't be much difference? If I did it again, I'd use a brand new aftermarket switch!

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I'm not a fan of Chinese pattern plastic parts, which I have no personal experience with but imagine will look great--but only from a distance.  My experience with pattern mirrors has not been good.  Used OEM switchgear is plentiful and affordable--and is very robust.  

 

I've installed passing switches on a couple of my US-spec bikes, and at the worst (it depends on which circuits are present in the pod already), you will need to run two wires from the switch to the high beam relay.  All the passing switch does is momentarily trigger that relay.  You might be able to just fit the Chinese switch to your OEM switch pod, but that's asking a lot of the "pattern" to use exactly the same mounting points as the OEM.

 

The connector looks to me like the 6098-4050, rather than the other one, which appears to be offset rather than symmetrical.  (Joe's website & store is great, btw.  Jim in Japan is also very knowledgeable.)  Good luck.  Keep trying Just Connectors, but that might end up being very expensive, unless you can score a "sample".

 

Ciao,

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Thanks Katie and JZH.  Yeah, I have some deciding to do - the used OEM switch needs to be taken apart and cleaned up.  The switches on the new Chinese assembly definitely feel more "crisp" right now but I dunno how long the whole thing will last.  May or may not Frankenstein them together.  I have some momentary round push button switches that I could possibly add to the OEM as well but they won't be as nice as a "trigger" shape. 
According to http://prd.sws.co.jp/components/en/detail.php?number_s=60984050  the 4050 mates with the 4662 so I think we're both in the same ball park.  I'm definitely going to measure mine before ordering - just hope, like you said, to be able to find a source that will sell just 1 unit for reasonable $... 

 

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