Member Contributer badelman Posted November 10, 2014 Author Member Contributer Share Posted November 10, 2014 Hey - You are finding out the hard way on what happens with an undersized connection setup - melty, melty! You need a connector with serious balls.. My suggestion is to use the Metripac 630 good for 47 amps. source http://www.cycleterminal.com/metri-pack.html Unfortunately you will need a crimp tool. But once you have it, I'm sure there are future VFR wire fixes to be done that you can use it for too. Mello, I don't see a 4 pin connector so I'm sure it's alright to use 2, 2 pin connectors!! Those are awesome BTW. Those look bombproof!! BTW.. I'm still testing this hot red wire (color) coming from the ignition at the 4 pin connector that got burnt up (by the red wire).. here's some more results. All thoughts are welcome! Testing - All of the below makes me think I should cut off more red wire(s) and re-do the connection.. Want to know your thoughts though! a. I turned the key on and didn't start the motorcycle and the red wire got warm b. Key on - I turned the high beam on but didn't start the engine yet and the red wire got hot! c. I started the bike and the red wire stayed hot maybe slightly hotter but hard to tell.. pretty darn hot with just key on and brights with no engine running d. See pic. I cut back the rubber wrapping that covers all wires for the old 4 pin connector on the side of the ignition. I found this other melted crimp joining two red wires together an inch or two under the rubber wrap on the ignition side. e. Also good to note here that there is no heat or warmth that I can tell on the far side of the connection (I'm assuming this side goes to the battery? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer mello dude Posted November 11, 2014 Member Contributer Share Posted November 11, 2014 ^^^^ I'm kinda having difficulty seeing waht you got going on there..... Um, your messing with red wires, probly a good idea to disconnect the battery if you havent already.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Cogswell Posted November 11, 2014 Member Contributer Share Posted November 11, 2014 Heat means there's excessive resistance in the circuit. High beams = more current draw = more heat. If the wiring's too hot to touch there's still trouble. If the wire past the connector is cool, then the connector seems the likely cause. Is this . . . "I found this other melted crimp joining two red wires together an inch or two under the rubber wrap on the ignition side." a factory connection or some other connection that's been installed (I think originally you said no mods to the bike)? Hard to tell from the photo . . . a better one(s) would be helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TampaDave Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 If the battery is ok, it doesn't seem to me that a fried r/r could explain a no start like this. I'm assuming starter doesn't turn over. Does the dash power up? Like can you see your fuel level? I would consider a bad switch, consider ignition, cutoff, and kickstand switches as part of your troubleshooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer badelman Posted November 11, 2014 Author Member Contributer Share Posted November 11, 2014 Thanks Dave and others. The current status of the bike is that I'm driving it but I'm watching my workaround bullet connector for the red wire at the 4 pin connector begin to melt. I've cut the factory rubber wrapping back and I found another place where it might not be connected very well (last pic) and the red wire probably needs to be cut back a lot more than it is based on some of the whiteness from the burning/melt. It is the red wire coming directly from the ignition where you put the key in and the other side I'm assuming goes to the battery. I also spoke with Tightwad and we're talking about cutting out the bad wiring and checking it first but I won't rule out the other stuff either. I will send post some more pictures that are easier to see as soon as I can. Also, stator and rectifier/regulator and battery have been ruled out at this point. You can see some of the testing of that earlier in the post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFROr Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 It is the red wire coming directly from the ignition where you put the key in and the other side I'm assuming goes to the battery. Yes the red wire goes back to the battery via Main Fuse "A" in the starter relay. The red wire also splits off to the fuse box fuse "A" which goes to the dash clock, according to the wiring diagram. I just uploaded a partially colorized .BMP scan of the factory service manual wiring diagram in the VFRD downloads. It's a pretty big file that's easier to follow than the print pages, might be helpful in seeing where things hook up. http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/files/file/223-vfr-wiring-diagram/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer badelman Posted November 11, 2014 Author Member Contributer Share Posted November 11, 2014 Thanks Dave and others. The current status of the bike is that I'm driving it but I'm watching my workaround bullet connector for the red wire at the 4 pin connector begin to melt. I've cut the factory rubber wrapping back and I found another place where it might not be connected very well (last pic) and the red wire probably needs to be cut back a lot more than it is based on some of the whiteness from the burning/melt. It is the red wire coming directly from the ignition where you put the key in and the other side I'm assuming goes to the battery. I also spoke with Tightwad and we're talking about cutting out the bad wiring and checking it first but I won't rule out the other stuff either. I will send post some more pictures that are easier to see as soon as I can. Also, stator and rectifier/regulator and battery have been ruled out at this point. You can see some of the testing of that earlier in the post. VFROr, your link is not working for me somehow.. Please check it as I'm sure it will be useful. As a quick update.. The help from tightwad was the nail in the coffin (in a good way).. although I had redone the connector I found some worse wire upstream from the initial connector melt down. I have now cut back the bad wire, used an extra bullet connector to put it together and have fantastic test results testing to see if it will heat up and melt again which it has not! Barring something crazy additional occurring I believe this issue is resolved. I am ordering a new connector with some add in wire and will do a complete repair once I receive it from Tightwad. What did I learn from this? This forum rocks and there are some super knowledgeable people on it You can learn how to fix your own bike from good people who care How to use a multi-meter to troubleshoot and check fuses, battery, stator and Regulator/Rectifiers Go for easy stuff first.. In the future I'll for sure extract and replace bad wiring/connectors and check up/down stream for worse wire to make sure I have a complete repair before anything else Some additional very detailed info on my Viffer Some additional things I can take with me on a long trip to be on the safe side Thanks everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer badelman Posted December 7, 2014 Author Member Contributer Share Posted December 7, 2014 The first red and small connector look good. The second(melted) connector is most likely causing your starter relay to melt also.(R/R and/or Stator are most likely the actual cause) The third one looks good. The fourth one is hard to tell. Is the dark spot melted plastic or just dirt? The next step is to replace the connector and burnt wiring. The choice you'll have to make is whether to replace the connector or just splice in new wire. You'll want to strip the wire back until you see clean copper. (I would just replace the connector with wire soldered in place) If it were mine I'd replace the starter relay. Once you've done all this the bike should run and will then allow you to test the stator and R/R. You are getting there! Dutch, I received a new 4 pin connector from Tightwad the other day and finally got rid of the temporary bullet connectors so the permanent fix is in place. Do you still suggest replacing the main starter relay? Also, do you suggest I should go ahead and replace the red cap that covers the relay as well?? It just has the one slight melty spot (pics show from earlier). If you check out my previous posts above this whole issue appears (APPEARS) to be a bad 4 pin connector and bad upstream wiring connection. After both were replaced the red wire wasn't hot any longer and the temporary connectors weren't cooking! The only other thing I'm a little worried about is how hot the Stator wires get but so far not melted and from all testing it tested good... so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer dutchinterceptor Posted December 8, 2014 Member Contributer Share Posted December 8, 2014 The first red and small connector look good. The second(melted) connector is most likely causing your starter relay to melt also.(R/R and/or Stator are most likely the actual cause) The third one looks good. The fourth one is hard to tell. Is the dark spot melted plastic or just dirt? The next step is to replace the connector and burnt wiring. The choice you'll have to make is whether to replace the connector or just splice in new wire. You'll want to strip the wire back until you see clean copper. (I would just replace the connector with wire soldered in place) If it were mine I'd replace the starter relay. Once you've done all this the bike should run and will then allow you to test the stator and R/R. You are getting there! Dutch, I received a new 4 pin connector from Tightwad the other day and finally got rid of the temporary bullet connectors so the permanent fix is in place. Do you still suggest replacing the main starter relay? Also, do you suggest I should go ahead and replace the red cap that covers the relay as well?? It just has the one slight melty spot (pics show from earlier). If you check out my previous posts above this whole issue appears (APPEARS) to be a bad 4 pin connector and bad upstream wiring connection. After both were replaced the red wire wasn't hot any longer and the temporary connectors weren't cooking! The only other thing I'm a little worried about is how hot the Stator wires get but so far not melted and from all testing it tested good... so far. If everything is working then you could probably hold off replacing the starter relay and red cap. Now that you have a good idea what to keep an eye on, I'd suggest you take advantage of our TX weather and go ride!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer badelman Posted January 23, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted January 23, 2015 As a quick follow up... here's a pic of the newest connector after being installed and a shot of my new "Head's Up" voltage monitor. The voltage monitor is connected to Tightwad's fuseblock which is connected directly to the battery. I may add one of Tightwad's monitors as well but need this one as it is in my face! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puig510 Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Badelman, glad you got the bike back and running. wow thank you all for this very informative thread. I have a 07 and now getting VERY paranoid. don't have problems yet. thought honda fixed it but........ I have 2 questions for all. 1. by installing the vfrness will this prevent this problem from happening or do I also need to replace the R/R ? 2. Any tips when installing the vfrness ? I got the instructions off the wiremybike but I heard the 06 on is a little different? I'm pretty mechanically inclined but once it gets to electrical i'm nervous. also planning a 300 mile trip up to the sierras and dont want to get stranded. once again thank you all (Badelman) for posting up end results. alot of thread I searched (not this forum), the original poster don't follow thru and post end results. cheers everyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer badelman Posted January 30, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted January 30, 2015 Badelman, glad you got the bike back and running. wow thank you all for this very informative thread. I have a 07 and now getting VERY paranoid. don't have problems yet. thought honda fixed it but........ I have 2 questions for all. 1. by installing the vfrness will this prevent this problem from happening or do I also need to replace the R/R ? 2. Any tips when installing the vfrness ? I got the instructions off the wiremybike but I heard the 06 on is a little different? I'm pretty mechanically inclined but once it gets to electrical i'm nervous. also planning a 300 mile trip up to the sierras and dont want to get stranded. once again thank you all (Badelman) for posting up end results. alot of thread I searched (not this forum), the original poster don't follow thru and post end results. cheers everyone Thank you for the kind words Puig510. The VFRNess will definitely help prevent problems down the road and make the VFR more electrically bullet proof. I personally wouldn't think about replacing the R/R or Stator unless you've done "the drill" and found issues. I would however order yourself some Oxguard, open up each connector carefully and put some on the connector pins. This stuff reduces resistance and helps make a better connection. Dielectric grease does not. Also while doing this it would also enable you to look at each connector as you go along the wiring in order to see potential issues ahead. Doing this has prompted me to replace Main fuse B which is discolored on my bike. Tightwad did a great job as the VFRNess is pretty much plug and play. If there's a difference in the 06 I'm sure he knows just let Tightwad know what year bike you have in the comments when you order and I'm, sure he will accommodate. As far as tips on the VFR installing VFRNess: A) The instructions are awesome just follow them step by step as you go but read through first B) There will be a large bulge on the right side of the bike at the frame where most of the connections are made. I ended up lessening the bulge by arranging (how you connect and position) all connections from left to right. Pushing things together and shoving them back didn't help much. C) Go ahead and order the fusebox if you intend on installing anything in the neat future as everyone seems to run into issues just tapping in or not knowing what wire to use for a switched (meaning comes on when VFR is turned on) connection D) Dont worry so much about how ominous the job may appear to be. Everything gets easier after you pull off the fairings and get to work. Once you start you should have several aha moments. And of course.. you always have us! Other road trip tips when worried about possible electrical stuff. A) Get a volt meter. I got a Head Up so I can see it right away but also plan to get one of Tightwad LED's to actually see the real volts. B) Carry extra 20,25 and 30 amp fuses C) Carry some auto grade bullet connectors for fixing connections (just in case) And seriously.... Just have fun. My wife and I have ridden all over without issue. The issue in this post was something I smelled for 2-3 weeks like something burning and then the Viffer wouldn't start in the garage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puig510 Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Thanks Badelman Just received a shipment notice from Joshua that vfrness shipped usps ( 2 days priority ) :) Can't wait to install it and have a piece of mind. I will keep you guys posted with pix on the install. Need to ride the Vfr more spending a lot of time on the s1000rr. Thanks again. I must say to everyone this is by far the best forum... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puig510 Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 just finished the vfrness. betweeen this thread and few questions to tightwad. it took 20min from start to finish. oaxgard all connections I can see. now it starts up stronger, maybe it me. glad I got it done and ease my mind cheers everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer badelman Posted February 5, 2015 Author Member Contributer Share Posted February 5, 2015 just finished the vfrness. betweeen this thread and few questions to tightwad. it took 20min from start to finish. oaxgard all connections I can see. now it starts up stronger, maybe it me. glad I got it done and ease my mind cheers everyone. Cheers to you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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