Member Contributer crazybrother Posted August 21, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted August 21, 2012 Hey guy's, I was wondering if it is possible to fool the ECU on the 1200, the same way you can the 2002-2009 800 (sixth gen) by turning the key on, to pressure up the FI then turn it off. Then turn it on again, and before the boot-up sequence is complete... (I.E. the engine light goes out) Try and start the engine, I know the sixth gen will default to a generic map, does anyone know if the VFR 1200 will do the same thing? If so, then maybe it will bypass the power restriction in 1st and 2nd gear. Any thoughts? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam2 Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Bazzaz. The Z-Bomb is what you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer crazybrother Posted August 21, 2012 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 21, 2012 Bazzaz. The Z-Bomb is what you need. I did read that thread, I actually like having the gear position indicator... So, I don't want to go that route. The way I understand it, is you loose that function. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam2 Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 You are correct. I actually feel the same way. I like the gear indicator....but the first ride with the Bazzaz unit made the 1&2 gear indication a VERY small issue. It makes that much difference. At least for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interceptorrider Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Uh, I wouldn't want to do it that way, but you can try it. The Z-Bomb works very well and you'll develop a mental way to know your gear in 1 - 3. It's truly not a big deal. This is the only bike I've owned (out of nearly 20 bikes) with a gear indicator. I can survive without it. Z-Bomb is well worth it. All that being said, I would like to get my bike to an ECUnleashed shop to totally reprogram the ECU. There are two in MI now. Ride Safe Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiN Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 I just did mine on the gps harness manually so its 5-n-6-3-4-5-6. Feels better to me than 3-n-3-3-4-5-6. The gps harness is only a 60 dollar part so if i have to replace it bfd. I dont see why bazazz didnt do it the same way. It wouldnt have cost them any more. Or you could get a bazazz harness and just fix it to not have 3 3rds in a row in a couple of minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer crazybrother Posted August 22, 2012 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 22, 2012 Uh, I wouldn't want to do it that way, but you can try it. The Z-Bomb works very well and you'll develop a mental way to know your gear in 1 - 3. It's truly not a big deal. This is the only bike I've owned (out of nearly 20 bikes) with a gear indicator. I can survive without it. Z-Bomb is well worth it. All that being said, I would like to get my bike to an ECUnleashed shop to totally reprogram the ECU. There are two in MI now. Ride Safe Mark Really, how do you find them? Are there any in California? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hvrnaut Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I just did mine on the gps harness manually so its 5-n-6-3-4-5-6. Feels better to me than 3-n-3-3-4-5-6. The gps harness is only a 60 dollar part so if i have to replace it bfd. I dont see why bazazz didnt do it the same way. It wouldnt have cost them any more. Or you could get a bazazz harness and just fix it to not have 3 3rds in a row in a couple of minutes. Tin, I have the z-bomb. How would I alter the harness to get the 5-n-6-3-4-5-6 indication you mention? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I just did mine on the gps harness manually so its 5-n-6-3-4-5-6. Feels better to me than 3-n-3-3-4-5-6. The gps harness is only a 60 dollar part so if i have to replace it bfd. I dont see why bazazz didnt do it the same way. It wouldnt have cost them any more. Or you could get a bazazz harness and just fix it to not have 3 3rds in a row in a couple of minutes. Tin, I have the z-bomb. How would I alter the harness to get the 5-n-6-3-4-5-6 indication you mention? I would be interested in this too. As the 3n33456 kept me on the fence with the z-bomb. I could live with 5-n-6-3-4-5-6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiN Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I dont know the colors of wires for the bazazz harness but they should be traceable from the gps and main harness colors. Seems like a lot of extra wire length on those bazazz modules for a jumper harness. I like the 5N63456 setup. In the first couple of days my mind was automatically registering 5 and 6 at under 30mph as 1 and 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubbersidedown Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Hey guy's, I was wondering if it is possible to fool the ECU on the 1200, the same way you can the 2002-2009 800 (sixth gen) by turning the key on, to pressure up the FI then turn it off. Then turn it on again, and before the boot-up sequence is complete... (I.E. the engine light goes out) Try and start the engine, I know the sixth gen will default to a generic map, does anyone know if the VFR 1200 will do the same thing? If so, then maybe it will bypass the power restriction in 1st and 2nd gear. Any thoughts? Thanks. So I tried this on my DCT for the commute home today and, although it may just be a placebo effect, it seemed to work. There seemed to be a lot more responsiveness in 1st and 2nd. I will have to try this a little more scientifically on the weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interceptorrider Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Uh, I wouldn't want to do it that way, but you can try it. The Z-Bomb works very well and you'll develop a mental way to know your gear in 1 - 3. It's truly not a big deal. This is the only bike I've owned (out of nearly 20 bikes) with a gear indicator. I can survive without it. Z-Bomb is well worth it. All that being said, I would like to get my bike to an ECUnleashed shop to totally reprogram the ECU. There are two in MI now. Ride Safe Mark Really, how do you find them? Are there any in California? Go to ECUnleashed website and search under the dealer tab for tuning centers. The "two" in Michigan is actually one dealer with two locations in West Michigan. I may look them up the next time I visit my folks. Good luck. Oh, I like the 5-N-6-3-4-5-6 set up. Good idea. Ride safe all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer crazybrother Posted August 24, 2012 Author Member Contributer Share Posted August 24, 2012 Uh, I wouldn't want to do it that way, but you can try it. The Z-Bomb works very well and you'll develop a mental way to know your gear in 1 - 3. It's truly not a big deal. This is the only bike I've owned (out of nearly 20 bikes) with a gear indicator. I can survive without it. Z-Bomb is well worth it. All that being said, I would like to get my bike to an ECUnleashed shop to totally reprogram the ECU. There are two in MI now. Ride Safe Mark Really, how do you find them? Are there any in California? Go to ECUnleashed website and search under the dealer tab for tuning centers. The "two" in Michigan is actually one dealer with two locations in West Michigan. I may look them up the next time I visit my folks. Good luck. Oh, I like the 5-N-6-3-4-5-6 set up. Good idea. Ride safe all. Mark, do you know if they have done any VFR1200's? I would be interested to know how they work and what actually changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interceptorrider Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I called the dealer in West MI today and they said they needed to give ECUnleashed a call for Honda's. Oddly enough, Honda makes it more difficult than other brands. Go figure. I will post up when I get some answers. In the meantime, if anyone else could give their "local" ECUnleashed tuning center a call, that would be good. If just one of us can get this done, they will have a master to work from and make it easier for all.........I think. Ride safe. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Solomoto Posted August 24, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted August 24, 2012 Here's an alternate perspective or theory on the power restriction in 1st and 2nd: The degree to which the actual throttle is restricted (and therefore HP output) below 5K rpm is a function of the rate at which the grip throttle is opened. I make the distinction between actual and grip throttle because of the VFR's throttle by wire. The tendency to spin up the rear wheel is partly a function of the time rate of change at which HP is delivered to the wheel, e.g. if a 30 HP change is delivered over a 1 second interval, the tire contact patch endures much greater acceleration forces than the same 30 HP change applied over say a 3 second interval. Obviously a lessor acceleration force will help prevent traction loss which is the assumed purpose of the flat spot. Most dyno runs are made with the grip throttle whacked open at low rpm's and held until redline is reached. Doing this in 1st or 2nd gear triggers the drop out in power. I would be very curious to know if the flat spot is reduced or eliminated outright if the grip throttle is rolled on gradually. My seat of the pants experience seems to confirm this. When I do a gradual roll-on instead of a ham fisted opening, the flat spot feels absent and acceleration is linear. But in the same situation with a ham fisted opening, the engine deliberately falls flat until the magic 5K rpm. I've found that managing the throttle in this manner almost makes the flat spot a non-issue for me. Try it and see if it works for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Yokel Posted August 25, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted August 25, 2012 Here's an alternate perspective or theory on the power restriction in 1st and 2nd: The degree to which the actual throttle is restricted (and therefore HP output) below 5K rpm is a function of the rate at which the grip throttle is opened. I make the distinction between actual and grip throttle because of the VFR's throttle by wire. The tendency to spin up the rear wheel is partly a function of the time rate of change at which HP is delivered to the wheel, e.g. if a 30 HP change is delivered over a 1 second interval, the tire contact patch endures much greater acceleration forces than the same 30 HP change applied over say a 3 second interval. Obviously a lessor acceleration force will help prevent traction loss which is the assumed purpose of the flat spot. Most dyno runs are made with the grip throttle whacked open at low rpm's and held until redline is reached. Doing this in 1st or 2nd gear triggers the drop out in power. I would be very curious to know if the flat spot is reduced or eliminated outright if the grip throttle is rolled on gradually. My seat of the pants experience seems to confirm this. When I do a gradual roll-on instead of a ham fisted opening, the flat spot feels absent and acceleration is linear. But in the same situation with a ham fisted opening, the engine deliberately falls flat until the magic 5K rpm. I've found that managing the throttle in this manner almost makes the flat spot a non-issue for me. Try it and see if it works for you. I've done the hot-wire fix and have a reasonably accurate sphincter dynomometer... My thoughts were always that the ECU FI map for the engine was actually different in 1st and 2nd. Part of my assumption is based on the fact in 1st and 2nd as stock, the flappy valve in the muffler won't open until 6k RPM IIRC... in 3rd (3rd gear indicated, though this is now 1st gear in reality on my machine) the flappy valve pops at 4k RPM therefore giving higher flow at a lower RPM limit. In my automotive experience at least a throttle-by-wire system just is effectively a reostadt to a solenoid with several failsafes set in to prevent un-intentional "pinning" of the fuel. I don't think it's based on speed of throttle opening... but I wouldn't be totally surprised if it was. Take with a grain of a salt as I'm not a Honda engineer, but my intuition and butt think this is the case. -Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamworth Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 snip Part of my assumption is based on the fact in 1st and 2nd as stock, the flappy valve in the muffler won't open until 6k RPM IIRC... in 3rd (3rd gear indicated, though this is now 1st gear in reality on my machine) the flappy valve pops at 4k RPM therefore giving higher flow at a lower RPM limit. snip I'm not so sure that's fact. My muffler flapper opens around 3600 rpm in every gear consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Yokel Posted August 25, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted August 25, 2012 snip Part of my assumption is based on the fact in 1st and 2nd as stock, the flappy valve in the muffler won't open until 6k RPM IIRC... in 3rd (3rd gear indicated, though this is now 1st gear in reality on my machine) the flappy valve pops at 4k RPM therefore giving higher flow at a lower RPM limit. snip I'm not so sure that's fact. My muffler flapper opens around 3600 rpm in every gear consistently. I should say my bike is a 1200F manual shift... I could swear it was 6k in 1st and 2nd it opened... I haven't had a flapper since I got the new slip-on, but I think I remember having to strangle it for the open sounds down low. Maybe my memory is going. It wouldn't be the first time I've been mistaken! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam2 Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Mine opens pretty consistently at 4k rpm pre- and post-bazzaz. FWIW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headhunter Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 Bazzaz. The Z-Bomb is what you need. I did read that thread, I actually like having the gear position indicator... So, I don't want to go that route. The way I understand it, is you loose that function. Dude, the 1200 is a bike that can totally be ridden by feel in the first three gears where the Z-Bomb reflects 3 instead of 1,2, Most of us started riding bikes when we didn't even know what the hell a gear position indicator was anyway. Buy the Z-Bomb and wring yor VFR out to your hearts content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer crazybrother Posted September 7, 2012 Author Member Contributer Share Posted September 7, 2012 Hey guy's I talked to ECUunleashed and they said at the current time, they don't have anything for the VFR1200. I was able to confirm the the power restriction in 1st and 2nd gear is related to how fast you open the throttle. If you slowly roll on the throttle there is no loss of power however when the throttle is quickly opened there is a noticeable reduction in power. FWIW I to have removed the cable on the flapper exhaust valve. I have also been testing my theory on the bootup sequence during startup and it does seem to help, but not completely removing the power restrictions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 21, 2012 Share Posted September 21, 2012 Here's how I make do without the gear indicator in 1st, 2nd and 3rd. In 2nd gear the revs match the mph almost exactly and in 3rd and 1st gear that don't. If you confuse 1st and 3rd then you really do have a problem :) The bikes only got 2 gears anyway, the correct one and the wrong one :) Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deancol1 Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 On 8/22/2012 at 10:54 AM, TiN said: I dont know the colors of wires for the bazazz harness but they should be traceable from the gps and main harness colors. Seems like a lot of extra wire length on those bazazz modules for a jumper harness. I like the 5N63456 setup. In the first couple of days my mind was automatically registering 5 and 6 at under 30mph as 1 and 2.  Thanks for posting the 5N63456 setup , great idea! I'm going to do this and may even consider wiring in a toggle switch to go back and forth between stock setup and derestricted setup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridem32 Posted November 15, 2017 Share Posted November 15, 2017 Send ECU to Guhl motors for $375 he will make your bike fly and gear indicator works the right way. He does not drill the ECU so it’s sealed up. Takes the rev limiter up 500rpms and takes the speed limiter out. Can get timing better and fuel ratio perfect. Check out his website and check YouTube   Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regatillo Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 I thought about Bazzaaz but the idea of having a crash and the insurance company denying responsibility because of this modification was not appealing. Notice that Bazzaaz clearly says that this is not for open road use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.