Member Contributer kgsmotorcycles Posted March 12, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 12, 2012 do i remount my coils this week or wot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglasthecook Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 No, that is one of the differences between CDI (Capacitive Discharge Ignition) and TCI (Transistorised Coil Ignition). CDI uses a charged capacitor (charged by an inverter) that is being discharged over the primary coil. A 'CDI spark' lasts not as long as a "TCI spark' but is more powerful, and is more suitable for high rpm engines. A TCI coil is charged by charging it with a current. It takes some time to charge the primary coil due to impedance, this is called dwell time. It also takes longer to discharge: the spark lasts longer. This helps, thanks for the explanation!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglasthecook Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 After looking at the below thread, one of the guys installed these in his '94 CBR 900RR. I doubt those bikes have a TCI box, so we'll see if I get a response to the question that I posted up there... http://cbrforum.com/forum/cbr-600f3-17/coil-plug-conversion-110182/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEBSPEED Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 After looking at the below thread, one of the guys installed these in his '94 CBR 900RR. I doubt those bikes have a TCI box, so we'll see if I get a response to the question that I posted up there... http://cbrforum.com/forum/cbr-600f3-17/coil-plug-conversion-110182/ The 900 uses only 2 coils. Same problem as before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguyeddy Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 900rr is tci ignition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEBSPEED Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 900rr is tci ignition. I don't think so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEBSPEED Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 I found his thread, which sheds some light on the effects of lower impedance/higher current: http://www.rrzone.com/forums/showthread.php?1614-Accel-coils-and-wires-WHOOO-HOOO!!! And I fired off this email to Accel's tech help desk. Hello, I am interested in upgrading my bike's ignition system. I have previously installed your products on another of my Honda bikes. I am unsure if any of your products fit my 1996 VFR750F application. This bike has a 4 cylinder engine, and it uses 4 ignition coils which have a primary resistance of 3.2 ohms. Please tell me which of your coil products would fit my needs. Thank you, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer jeremy77 Posted March 21, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 21, 2012 Hello, I am interested in upgrading my bike's ignition system. I have previously installed your products on another of my Honda bikes. I am unsure if any of your products fit my 1996 VFR750F application. This bike has a 4 cylinder engine, and it uses 4 ignition coils which have a primary resistance of 3.2 ohms. Please tell me which of your coil products would fit my needs. Thank you, You asked someone who might know the answer?!?! What are we gonna speculate about if we get a definitive answer?? I kid, I kid... Good work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEBSPEED Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 I think if they reply with a definitive answer, it will be a miracle. Best case, they give me a part number which I'll have to research. Worst case, they say nothing's available or they don't respond at all. Good comment though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEBSPEED Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 I'll try Dynatek, Dynojet and Bazzaz next. They may have some/more ignition system insight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguyeddy Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 900rr is tci. All coils share a positive switched feed and ignition module grounds the coils. As does almost all honda street bikes (with the exception of the vtr1000 and the rvt1000, as stated earlier, which are cdi). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglasthecook Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Ok if the RC-51 and Superhawk (vtr1000 and the rvt1000) run CDI boxes, does that change anything for us, or is it different because we need two coils)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguyeddy Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 I dont think so. At the heart of the vtr1000 is an ignition module that looks JUST like ours, and grounds the converter box just like ours grounds coils. However, ive been looking for something to replace them as an option and i feel ive found it. The AEM twinfire 4 channel cdi. And is about the same price as new converter boxes, and you dont have to source pigtails. And they can be had used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglasthecook Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 The used part is good, as I'm failry sure they'd be rather spendy new. Why does it have to be so difficult to convert old stuff to new? I really thought that this would be a fairly simple mod, but it is proving to be more difficult than I originally thought, heck wiring in the CBR 1000RR gauges wasn't that difficult, just had to match wires, that's all. This is definitely more complex, at least for me anyway! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguyeddy Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Yes this is definately more complex and difficult than the gauges! Well, really, wiring it up isnt all that bad, its finding the right parts and something that will work with our factory stuff. Eventually my vfr will be injected and this will be alot easier, but until then im going to be rocking jetted carbs and these cops if we can get it sorted out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer Mohawk Posted March 23, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 23, 2012 VFR750 crank: If we put a piston on each conrod, and then put those pistons into their respective bores, I believe we would have two pistons at TDC and two pistons at BDC, the angle of the V would have no bearing on this whatsoever. RC45 crank, for reference: he he he, are you forgetting that in a V engine the conrod big ends share a crank pin & thus when one is at TDC, the other can't be. On a VFR cyclinder #1 is the rear left & it shares a crank pin with Cyl#2, which is spaced 90degrees futher on,so can't possibly be at TDC at the same time. Plus remember that each piston requires 720degree between firings. The best you could do with a V4/180 crank engine is this, 1-2-3-4 all 90degrees apart, then have a 450degree freewheel cycle or a very rough running engine, or need a VERY big flywheel to carry it over that hump ! You could twin up a 360 crank, with 1+3 then 2+4 90 degrees later, followed by a 450 degree freewheel cycle, again a very rough engine with huge pulse power delivery, which would in theory require larger bearings & shafts to deal with the extra grunt. OK in a race engine maybe, but not a road bike, if you want to keep your teeth :) The screamer engine or as close as you can get with a V4 works by using some of the power stroke of one piston to power the compression stroke of another, this allows the crank webs (flywheel). The V4/360 big bang would have to rely on flywheel momentum to force two full & two half comp cylinders to TDC on compression with the second two only 90degrees behind the first, that would require a lot of weight in the flywheel to carry that through TDC's for both banks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguyeddy Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Heres the hayabusa short cop in a vfr750 head. Might not be short enough to miss the rad/fan on the front, but wont matter at the rear. An oring might be necessary to seal up the hole all the way or possibly trim the factory plug wire boot to fit the cop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veefer800Canuck Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Continue 4th gen COP mod discussion here. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer jeremy77 Posted March 26, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 26, 2012 Thanks, Canuck!!! As far as i can tell, between ALL the coils there are long ones (f4i) and short ones (suzuki, cbr600rr). 3rd/4th gen need short ones. So do we have a consensus on what we think will work best for the 4th Gen VFR? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguyeddy Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 The short ones from whatever bike u can buy them off of. Gixxer coils seem to be the cheapest with a nice big rubber seal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer jeremy77 Posted March 26, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 26, 2012 I just ordered these off of eBay for $24... Off an 03 GSXR with 12,000 miles. I guess I need to get some connectors next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguyeddy Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 You can pick up a sub harness from an f4i for them. Actually im pretty sure all those bikes have coil sub harnesses. Also there is a seller on evay selling plugs and crimp connectors for busas thatll work too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NakedViffer Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 I don't understand the drive behind getting 4g bikes to run COP.. I understand the space thing, and keeping a clean look, as I ride a naked bike. But other than that, why go to all the trouble? There isn't gonna be a noticeable performance increase.. Honda is notorious for having strong ignitions. I plan on making +/- 175whp on the stock individual 4g coils, all I plan on doing is upgrading the old wires on them and going a range colder on the plugs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguyeddy Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 (edited) im going to do it because removing a coil thats remote mounted on a 4th gen gives me that much more room to mount an ecu or ignition box or whatever else. what do you plan to do to obtain this 175 wheel horsepower? your effectively doubling the crank horsepower of this engine, and i doubt the stock coils would be up to the task of ignition a much higher compression ratio with way more fuel. Edited March 26, 2012 by flyguyeddy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Contributer YoshiHNS Posted March 26, 2012 Member Contributer Share Posted March 26, 2012 ...I plan on making +/- 175whp on the stock individual 4g coils... so...if that's your tolerance, it's easily achieved by pulling the plugs. Back to the point. It would be great for those of us who are doing serious modifications where having one less thing to worry about would be great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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