Trace

An overall suggestion: Unless you're already a Honda or VFR guy and are aware of Honda's assorted chronic electrical ( or other) gremlins, you might want to carefully review some of the threads in the electrical (or other) sections and eliminate those problems while the bike is in a zilion pieces. That subframe weldment photo of yours that shows the big white 3-wire stator/RR connector got me to thinking about this. You DO know about the big white 3-wire connector meltdown problems, don't you? :pissed: Maybe some folks will chime in with other common problems for this generation VFR. Anyway, good luck with your clever project. :cool:

That's a good enough reason for me! Onwards! :fing02:

Okay, okay, okay JES.... how about a truce? If you and your loyal supporters leave behind the leftist, apocolyptic, conspiracy-piracy-theory-MIB-Matrix spoutings of this TECHNICAL DISCUSSION about the merits or lack thereof of HHO, I'll butt-out with my criticism and chain-yanking from the sidelines. It is because of my pro-capitalist, anti-global warming, anti-New World Order, anti-Michael Moore, anti-Al Gore stance that I simply can't let unfounded opinions about the future of oil and energy policy go unchallenged on this forum. When myths go unchallenged for too long, they begin to eclipse the truth. Thus I had to go on the offensive to put some records straight or at least question the liberal politics that have invaded your "Cooking With Hydrogen" thread. So.....why don't we ALL leave politics out of this, as it serves no purpose. We can agree to disagree about the future of the planet and where HHO fits into it. Hell, I'll even stop picking on HHO as being junk science and sit back to see your eventual results! Let us allow the technical chips to fall where they may. Sound reasonable? As for the future of electrical power generation for the Rest Of All Time Of Earth....learn what you can about Traveling Wave Reactors. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traveling_wave_reactor Lots and lots of science involved there!

That is absolute bullshit statement and you should be ashamed of yourself. THAT is why I resurrected this thread....to expose this crazy political nonsense that blindly supports "capitalist oil conspiracy theory"....yet attacks anyone who points out the decades of scientific work that has totally debunked the Brown's Gas Conspiracy is infuriating and baffling. Slavery? Oil addiction? Those are big words and have no place here, especially after I [me, Trace] got pounded for bringing this nutbag topic back for inspection by the membership and wondering about your (lack of) progress. I asked for an update, and we got more political spin instead of results. How DARE you shill for your own Pepsi project, asking your fellow VFRD members to vote for you regardless of the merits of your project. Ahhhh...I see. If MONEY goes toward your cause it's okay. If it goes to Exxon....it's evil. Slave oil? No. HHO snake oil? Yes. Welcome to the Matrix, but I'll stick to the Blue Pill, thanks. :lurk:

JES, Thanks for the update, and appreciate your willingness to step back into this controversial subject. Just an FYI, my 2000 gets a consistent and carefully calculated 44 mpg with a 45 tooth sprocket. By "carefully calculated", I mean that my speedo is exactly correct using a speedohealer, and that my odo is exactly 11 percent low as a result of that correction. Thus, I crank 11% into my odo miles when gassing up. Plus, I use traveling mate's mileage at gas stops as a comparision/validation of miles traveled. Anyway, it always comes out to 44 mpg over the last 5 years during fairly hard highway running. And my gas-pig RC51 gets 31 mpg doing the very same runs from Florida to Franklin NC and back! :pissed:

Hahaha! Yeah, or dare ask about "oil" or "tires" or "helmets" or "which color is best", etc. :laughing6-hehe:

You are completely off base with your take on this discussion. Let me boil it down for you for your re-consideration: 1. A good and respected member (JES) posted about his HHO project, which I think we ALL applauded as admirable for giving it a shot. 2. But many of us with technical backgrounds found it to be extremely questionable, because we know you don't get something for nothing. 3, This skepticism was bolstered by the long, long history of "Brown's Gas" hokum. Us doubters didn't invent the skepticism...it's well documented by most of the scientific community. 3. The greenie folks here accepted the premise that HHO is viable, and then attacked us skeptics as "capitalistic tools". 4. We all retreated to our respective corners for the past six months. Waiting. 5. And now....me....who is the proud owner of a long memory.....have asked the original poster of the status of his HHO project. So I ask you.....if a member had converted his chain-drive to a belt-drive six months ago and then became a fanatic proponent of his own self-generated controversy, would it not be proper to ask that member how that belt system is doing after half a year of use? After all, on this excellent forum we are always sharing info, helping each other, challenging assorted ideas, and letting the marketplace decide. Did you want us all to accept HHO as the Next Great Thing without question? I'm questioning. And as of yet, I have no answers.

Totally true, but it's about the only weight you can get out of our heavy pigs for free, so I wanted to "enjoy" that massive improvement, too! :biggrin:

Yeah, that 6thGen HowTo is good 'nuff for 5thGen work. Once you start "following hoses", you'll see how simple the PAIR removal actually is. As for the flapper valve stuff that was also mentioned in that post, most of us have disconnected the hose that goes to the diaphram and plugged it. But last weekend I had the airbox off and removed EVERYTHING that has to do with that useless system (Bypass Solenoid Valve, One Way Valve, small Vacuum Canister, associated small vacuum hoses, etc), and plugged the single small vacuum hose from the intake manifold that makes it all work. I DID keep the Bypass Solenoid Valve in place on the airbox and kept the electrical connection to it (which just gives the valve 12V on/off to open or close the flapper) to prevent any codes due to being disconnected, but that solenoid valve now does NOTHING except sit there. Obviously, since it's not hooked to anything there is no reason whatsoever to plug the various nipples coming off of it. So, while you're doing the PAIR thing you might as well do the total flapper crap removal, too. With all of this work you'll be removing a whopping 10-12 ounces of useless do-dads! :biggrin:

Echoing what Mad said, you can toss everything in that picture with no ill-effects. Get rid of that crap! I didn't use block-off plates....I simply cut and plugged hoses coming off the cylinder heads with short 3/8s inch bolts. Blocking the airbox hole is really simple....pretty much anything that you can put over the airbox fitting or jam securly in it (which is what I did, but I forgot what it was...a small rubber cork perhaps?) It's not a critical pressure or vacuum situation there. What you DON'T want to do is jam something into the hole from the inside of the airbox. If were to ever pop out (inwards!), it would definitely end up down the intake stacks and jam your throttle blades open. Oooops! Removing the airbox to do this makes it easy and foolproof. Isn't there a How To on this? I thought HS did one years ago.

Dimitry, I can't quite follow the relevance of your point regarding payment, but I'll use your concept of "pay" to make my point. Using VFRD, JES started a thread where he preached the viability of HHO and haughtily boasted about 80mpg; and one of his supporters actually said "The Laws of Thermodynamics are dated", as if there's a statute of limitations on physics; and others accused Big Business/Big Oil of suppressing "green" research for various nefarious reasons. And last May we got daily updates of his installation and progress, but now.....nothing. So, back to payments. Instead of VFRD having to PAY JES for the results of his experiment....I believe he OWES this community (both the supporters and the naysayers) a few minutes of his heavily prioritized time to give us an update. In fact, I'm betting that JES is just finishing up a big report on the results of his research and he'll be sending us the weblink to it any day now! :fing02: Even Galileo and Columbus were told to "put up or shut up" when it came to their radical ideas, and those two guys eventually justified their beliefs. And on May 12th, you yourself said "Can't wait for the results!". So...how much time is enough time for him to give us some results?

Yes, exactly right. I don't think anyone said he should stop, but six months have passed and there was a lot of interest and discussion by both supporters and naysayers, along with an ongoing heated argument that ventured into politics and big business and conspiracy theories. So, what I'm thinkin' is that after tossing this experiment smack-dab into the middle of VFRD-land, it's about time "for letting us know about your efforts". Isn't that fair? Just sayin'....

Hey....alcohol works! HHO doesn't.... :laughing6-hehe: