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GreginDenver

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GreginDenver last won the day on December 25 2016

GreginDenver had the most liked content!

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About GreginDenver

  • Rank
    Club Racer
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Profile Information

  • Location
    Denver
  • In My Garage:
    '99 VFR800 49-state
  1. Cam reinstall - timing help needed

    You're exactly right about the head bearings, my winter efforts ended short of a complete end-to-end refurbishment. I ran out of time and that was the item that I decided to skip. I've got another (much smaller) maintenance session tentatively scheduled for this fall.
  2. Cam reinstall - timing help needed

    Actually I'm kinda new to VFR ownership. I always admired the VFRs, especially the models with the gear-driven cams, but I was busy with life and work and by the time I got around to buying one (just this past December) the bike was 18+ years old. So I didn't hold back on the effort when it came to refurbishing it. Now that I finally had a VFR I wanted to feel what the VFR800 felt like when it was new (what I missed out on back in 1999). What I'm saying is: there are a lot of rubber gaskets and O-rings and such that have never been replaced on a lot of these 5th Generation VFRs. And here we are, buying these 19 (going on 20) year old bikes and some of us want to act like they don't need a deeper level of care. Here's what I did to my 5th Gen after I purchased it this past Devember: http://vfrworld.com/threads/refurbishing-my-99-5th-gen.52488/
  3. Cam reinstall - timing help needed

    With your question about replacing rubber parts you've stumbled into one of the weirder areas of VFR800 myth and legend. You may have already noticed that VFR owners are quick to crow about the longevity/durability of the engine (and maybe even the whole motorcycle too). This "VFRs last forever" thing goes to different degrees with different people, some take it to extremes, like, "My VFR has 100,000 miles on it with nothing but gas, oil changes and air in the tires!" The unwillingness to replace even normal consumables like rubber gaskets becomes a point of pride.
  4. Cam reinstall - timing help needed

    I've wondered about this too... Just like your post above, my exhaust valves were perfectly within spec (and I mean perfect, like the bike had just left the Honda factory), but on the other hand, almost every one of the intake valves were out-of-spec toward the too tight side (just like your bike). And this was on a bike that only had 19,000 miles on it. If the tolerance change was due to carbon build-up (on the back side of the valves or on the faces of the valve seats in the cylinder head) wouldn't they go out-of-spec toward the too loose side as the gap at the top of the valve stem was made wider by the carbon build-up? So it has to be something that would induce a change that decreases the gap from the original factory-set specification. Are the intake valves changing shape? Are the valve stems stretching? Or are the intake valves becoming more deeply seated into the cylinder head, meaning: are the valve seats becoming slightly deeper, is the aluminum structure becoming compacted? Or are the valve faces beginning to "tulip" a bit? I know that exhaust valves are normally build a bit more robust than intake valves because they have to deal with higher temperatures. So maybe that explains the difference.
  5. Cam reinstall - timing help needed

    Like people have already said, it's no big deal to re-establish the timing after removing both the camshafts from both the front and rear heads. When you are careful and read the manual before-hand it is logical and straight forward... Step #1. Do as you have been told and download the manual. Step #2. Read through (carefully) the section that describes the procedure for re-establishing the timing. Read it as many times as necessary for it to make perfect sense. Step #3 As per the manual: re-establish the timing on the rear head. Step #4 As per the manual: re-establish the timing on the front head. Step #5 Pat yourself on the back for being such a good motorcycle mechanic.
  6. Coolant system flush and renewal

    I appreciate the amount of effort you're putting into cleaning out the inside of the bike's cooling system. But the proverbial "last mile" in heat rejection occurs where the aluminum of the radiators meets the free-flowing air around it. When I recently purchased my "new to me" '99 VFR800 I found that the radiators were covered in a layer of road goo and grime (especially on the inside, I guess the front tire throws up a lot of stuff) and there was a lot of tiny rocks and road debris stuck in between the individual fins of the radiators. To get them properly clean I ended up having to take the radiators off of the bike.
  7. Cam Service - was it done?

    I'm very thorough when I work on a motorcycle or car, here's what my 5th Gen looked like when I did the valves. So access to the cylinder heads wasn't a problem. The "special tools" I used? I used both of my torque wrenches (a normal one and a smaller one for tighter spaces), I used a black "Sharpie" marker pen to put marks on the cam gears to I'd know if they were reassembled/aligned properly after changing the shims, I used a electronic micrometer purchased at Harbor Freight (machinists always insist on hand-measuring things like valve shims, what they mean is that even if a valve shim has a size marked on it you should confirm the actual gnat's-ass measurement of the shim), I also used a camera to carefully take pictures of the cylinder head parts before I disassembled them, so I would have a reference to look at during reassembly. I replaced all of the rubber bits, didn't re-use any of the 18 year old O-rings or seals. Here's my results: All of my Exhaust Valves where perfectly within factory specification. All of the Intake Valves required adjustment, 3 were "out of tolerance", 4 were very close to "out of tolerance", and 1 was okay-ish but I still adjusted it. I used shims purchased at the parts counter of my local Honda Dealership. To be honest I don't know if they're actual Honda parts or Honda-certified or even Honda-approved. When I used the digital electronic Micrometer to check the sized of the shims I found that they aren't exactly the measurement that's printed on them (although they are consistent, i.e. all of the "182" size shims measured out the same on the Micrometer, as did all of the other size shims regardless of whether they were original to the bike or the ones I purchased here in Denver. Just as an example the "182" shims all measured out to exactly 1827 on the Micrometer, so they are really more of a "183" shim than a "182" shim).
  8. Interested in buying a fifth gen

    Also, VFRWorld.com is up and running. Here's my thread "Refurbishing my '99 5th Gen: http://vfrworld.com/threads/refurbishing-my-99-5th-gen.52488/ This is what I felt was necessary to bring an 18 year old bike back up to a high standard.
  9. Interested in buying a fifth gen

    You should get a copy of the VFR800 service manual, it contains an amazingly detailed description of the Honda PGM-FI system (Chapter 21, titled "Technical Features"). Just the fact that this chapter even exists is pretty amazing, most manufacturers prefer to keep as much of this information hidden as they can. I guess that when the 5th Gen came out Honda was concerned about getting people who were comfortable with carbs to buy a fuel injected motorcycle, so they "pulled back the curtain" in an effort to inform people as thoroughly as they could. This chapter of the VFR800 service manual (Ch. 21, "Technical Features") is a great read.
  10. Interested in buying a fifth gen

    There are no designed-in deficiencies to the 5th gen fuel injection system, I think it's a very good product. It's all solid-state sensors feeding information into a solid-state ECU, there's not a lot that can go wrong, but if the ECU loses contact with one of the sensors it (the ECU) will tell you by flashing a code on the "FI" light (you just look up the code in the owner's manual or service manual and simply remove and replace whichever sensor is causing the problem. But this is rare, the sensors are very durable). There's more plumbing running around the bike with an FI system than with carbs but that's okay. When I got my '99 I removed and cleaned the throttle body assembly and changed the fuel filter (located inside the fuel tank with the fuel pump). The 5th Generation of the VFR is divided into two sub-generations: The '98-'99 doesn't have a catalytic converter, while the '00-'01 has a catalytic converter. This makes the '00-'01 FI system just bit more complex to deal with.
  11. Interested in buying a fifth gen

    I don't remember the dash being a 5th gen issue, I thought the dash issue was a 6th gen problem (caused by a wiring harness grounding problem, factory recalled and corrected by replacing the big blue colored multi-connector to the dash). Beyond the Regulator/Rectifier issue (once again it's really not an R/R issue but yet another Honda connector/wiring issue) I can't think of anything that is a show-stopping factory-built-in deficiency in the 5th gen. What you're going to run into with a 5th gen is the simple fact that they are now in the 18 to 20 year-old range which means you're quite likely to end up with a bike that needs somewhere between a moderate amount and a hell of a lot of maintenance and refurbishment to bring it up to a high standard. Right now the VFRWorld.com forum is down for maintenance, but I have a pretty detailed thread of my recent refurbishment of my '99 VFR, bought it in December of '16 and went through it thoroughly. Lots of pictures and discussion on my "Refurbishing my '99 VFR" thread, I wish I could link you to it right now.
  12. Cam Service - was it done?

    If you want to borrow it that would be fine (just noticed you're located up in Longmont).
  13. Cam Service - was it done?

    I use the Morgan Carbtune. The unit itself has "Carbtune Pro" printed on the plastic case.
  14. Cam Service - was it done?

    I bought a '99 this past December. It was in really good condition but the original owner never did any of the more difficult bits of ongoing maintenance, to include things like checking/adjusting the valve shims. The bike had just short of 20k miles and just like yours it was a bit hard to start. Checking the valve clearances showed it needed a lot of new shim sizes. After correcting all the shims to get the gaps in specification (actually a fun job in my opinion) and synchronizing the starter valves it starts up right on the first press of the button.
  15. Engine Question

    Are we talking about lines leaking or are we talking about leaking where the lines connect? If someone has over torqued and stripped out the connectors you might have a more delicate situation on your hands, not impossible to correct with careful application of Helicoils or Timeserts.