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3rd/4th gen brembo upgrade


750

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Finally got around to doing this. Well worth it, lots of feel, tonnes of braking power. It looks a bit ghetto, but I just wanted to get it all bolted up.

Currently using a GSXR1000 14mm MC, bit of lever travel but it's fine for now. I'll likely swap out for a 16mm or 5/8. I have one from my SV1000 after doing the GSXR1000 front end upgrade. It's a coffin reservoir, rather than the remote reservoir on the GSXR unit.

 

Here's some pics. I'm going to get the calipers painted and powder coat the brackets. 

 

36648293874_f507c6c831_b.jpg

 

36648293724_dbd626c6fc_b.jpg

 

37101461410_f0d27fd845_b.jpg

 

For those wondering. The brackets are available from webike: https://www.webike.co.uk/products/1113303.html

 

You require Brembo goldlines with 40mm spacing on the mounting points (later ones have 65mm) - bikes with these are Moto Guzzi California (single pin fixing) and Ducati's such as the early Monsters and S sports. A 14 or 16mm Axial master cylinder will do the job, the former giving more lever travel with less hand effort required, the latter giving firmer lever with a more on/off type action.

 

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9 minutes ago, YoshiHNS said:

Interesting mod. Thanks for sharing

My pleasure, I know a lot complain about the braking abilities of the RC36, this is a definite fix.

 

I'd highly recommend people use floating discs with the calipers as two fixed points isn't good. VFR/RVF400 front wheels are the same and seemingly easier to come by.

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This is a fantastic solution. I am struggling to source VTR fork legs at a decent price so I really like this solution. I note that the page does not reference VFR 750 but list Honda CBR600F 95-98 which is I believe the F3 and it has (at least to my knowledge) the same fork legs as the 3rd gen.

Thank you really much for the details ;-)

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No problem, and yeah... Same fork legs (that's both 3rd and 4th gen for those wondering!) 

Will cost similar to the vtr package when you factor in the calipers etc... But... You know... Brembos! 

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16 hours ago, 750 said:

 

Read the post matey

 

Okay reread the post. You said gsxr1000 master cylinder, now and maybe an sv1000 master later. Then you said something about brembo goldlines, i don't know what these are, are those the calipers? So you are using Moto Guzzi California or Ducati Monster / S sport calipers?

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My 5th gen came with complete  Brembo full floating disc. Braking and especially hard braking is much easier to manage. The adapter plates looks are a small price to pay for premium braking. I locked up and crashed my first VFR800 under hard braking. The slick center of road sludge helped. Only difference is the nose dives a bit now with out linked brakes.

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5 hours ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

 

Okay reread the post. You said gsxr1000 master cylinder, now and maybe an sv1000 master later. Then you said something about brembo goldlines, i don't know what these are, are those the calipers? So you are using Moto Guzzi California or Ducati Monster / S sport calipers?

 

Ah OK - sorry, just realised that came across as snotty, that wasn't the intention. So...it's as follows

 

Brembo goldlines are just a make and model of caliper - they were used universally across multiple bikes and came in two flavours:

 

single pin fixing: pads are retained by a single pin and the mounting holes are 40mm apart (these are what are on my bike)

double pin fixing: pads are retained by two pins, the mounting points are 65mm apart. 

 

My calipers in particular came off a moto guzzi california (97-00, 2001 onwards went with the bigger spacing):

 

d29d5188ab5e8de5c2c13474b7e5a7ae.jpg

 

They also come off early Ducati Monsters (1993 til 1996 - in 1997 they went to the bigger 65mm spacing mounting):

 

bikepics-756453-full.jpg

 

Ducati 900SS (1990 which has the black calipers through to 1997, in 1998 they went with the bigger 65mm spacing):

 

ducati-900-ss-super-sport-1990-6.jpg

 

The calipers you want, look like this. Note the small spacing between the mounting points and the bleed and banjo mounting points are in line with each other:

 

5467933_orig.jpg

 

The later ones (the ones you DON'T want) look like this. Note the much larger mounting spacing and the banjo/bleed mounting points are right next to each other:

 

orig_img-2628-jpg-03.jpg

 

I'm assuming you know what a master cylinder is, but just in case (really not trying to be patronising, just wanna save you the effort of finding out!) - it's basically what the brake lever attaches to. Smaller sizes = more brake lever travel but much less effort to get hard braking. Larger sizes = less brake lever travel but more effort required to brake hard - it's more of an on/off feeling. Bigger is NOT better, regardless of what a plethora of clueless types will tell you :) There's a calculation that can be done to work out the ratio between the master cylinder and the slave cylinder (i.e. the calipers pistons) and with an axial master cylinder...you want about 17:1 to get a nice amount of lever travel and braking feel.

 

Hope this helps!

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On 9/30/2017 at 5:21 AM, 750 said:

No problem, it'll help others I'm sure :)

 

Did you put the axial blue/gold spots on? I have the radials on my SV1000 with GSXR1000 front end

 

36218046905_52f07336f8_h.jpg

 

Gold would have been nice, but oh well, just plain aluminum/silver...

5.jpg

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Same as mine then. I've struggled to find the correct pad retaining bracket. Can you do me a favour and check if the part where the retaining pin goes through the pads is flat? The pads I have in mine have a rounded top, so the replacement retaining brackets I bought from a Yammy dealer don't fit.

 

Oh and what master cylinder are you using? I went with a Bandit 1250 (14mm) which works OK, but can't decide if the pads, discs or MC are letting it down...they're nowhere near as powerful as the Brembos on the VFR...which is worrying considering the SV is much lighter.

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Well for checking the retaining pin, I will have to do that when I get home.

 

For the master cylinder, I am using the stock 04-06 R1 Brembo radial master.

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With 40 mm spacing with bit more money it´s possible buy discacciati , beringer , isr , ap racing caliper (even with 6 pistons)

also available spacer for 65 mm brembo ( standard and triple bridge ) or even adapter for use 4 pot radial unit

 

 Btw ...

Nice mod. , extr. clean bike! :wink:

 

 

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4 hours ago, CandyRedRC46 said:

Well for checking the retaining pin, I will have to do that when I get home.

 

For the master cylinder, I am using the stock 04-06 R1 Brembo radial master.

 this kind of master are not radial but half radial  

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16 hours ago, Ghostrider1127 said:

 this kind of master are not radial but half radial  

 

Yeah... you're going to have to explain that one to me, because as far as I can see, on my 04-06 R1 Brembo radial master cylinder, the force applied to the lever is parallel to the force applied to the plunger.

NONRADIAL.png

RADIAL.png

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You are welcome: look which angle got the cylinder axis of your master , it sit just NOt radial 

That´s why it´s called "half radial" a mix between axial and radial

Actually  in brembo we call it  "pompa semi radiale" let you translate it :wink:

20140715_Brake-Diagram-Axial-Radial-Leve

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I am welcome for what?

You just posted two generic pictures showing what I already just said and drew, for the two exact master cylinders in question.

You didn't counter/disprove anything or add any new thoughts...

Nothing changed, the 04-06 R1 master cylinder' "cylinder axis" and "lever pull" are still parallel.

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ok ,   if you feel better go on thinking  your master cylinder it´s a full radial  :wink:

Was just trying , as professional , to explain and gave the right name to a component

still a " pompa semi-radiale " not more not less 

 

Have a nice week-end 

 

p.s. also this native ducati 999 master cylinder was used by yamaha on r1 models till 2014 and r6 till 2016 

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Semi-radial, it looks to me...  Interestingly, the later NISSIN non-radial masters (such as those found on early CBR600RRs) are also semi-radial, but they're much closer to axial than radial (whereas the Yamaha '04-'06 R1 Brembo master is much closer to radial than axial).  I've never seen a truly "half-radial", but it wouldn't surprise me if they exist.

 

Ciao,

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TBF Candy, he's right. A true radial is completely parallel. The Yammy efforts are between radial and axial. I'd still argue it's radial though!

 

But either way, how're you finding the stopping power? I'm using an axial Bandit 1250 unit (14mm) and it's arguably not grabbing as hard as I'd expect from supersport calipers. I realise pads have an effect but even when hot, they just don't stop anywhere near as frantically as the Brembo's on the VFR. I'm contemplating getting a Brembo RCS19, but it's a big outlay if there's nothing in it between the RCS and the Yammy efforts.

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On 10/5/2017 at 10:03 PM, Ghostrider1127 said:

With 40 mm spacing with bit more money it´s possible buy discacciati , beringer , isr , ap racing caliper (even with 6 pistons)

also available spacer for 65 mm brembo ( standard and triple bridge ) or even adapter for use 4 pot radial unit

 

 Btw ...

Nice mod. , extr. clean bike! :wink:

 

 

 

BIG money for those discacciati calipers, though. These Brembo's are waaaaaaaaay more than enough to stop the VFR as though it's hitting a brick wall. It's a night and day difference over the clunky, lazy VFR stock items

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