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Swingarm Weight Comparison


EMC2

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So I am starting a VFR Project bike to keep me busy until the weather gets better so I can ride again. Though I do think I will still be working on this project even after it is riding season.

 

I have found that trying to find actual specs either hard to come by, wrong or people throw their opinion into a thread that might have real info in there but has so many inaccuate infomation that the facts have become untrustworthy.  One such fact was trying to find the weight of the VFR swingarm.  I couldnt find any true hard facts on the actual weight but I read  how heavy it is...some people even  said  it was twice the weight as a modern DSSA.  

 

Well I had the bike in pieces so why not find out...To be fair the VFR swingarm has stuff like the sprocket, cush drive, and brake disk attached to it so to get an actual comparison I weighed the complete swingarm, with wheel/tire, brake caliper and complete shock assembly.  I just happen to have my swingarm off my 2011 CBR600RR...so I am using that as a comparison. The VFR has a BT023 tire on and the CBR has a Pilot Power 2CT. Both are pretty worn so no real advantage of new tire vs old tire.  I know some will say I should have taken the tires off but in the real world you would have them on and I don't know about you but I do not go around with my scale and pick the lightest tire I can find when I get new ones.

 

What was the outcome...well the VFR swingarm assembly was heavier no surprise... but not by the amount I was expecting.

 

2004 VFR swingarm/tire/shock - 67lbs

2011 CBR600RR swingarm/tire/shock - 59lbs

 

That is 8 lbs!!! I was fully expecting over twice that...  To me I will take the 8 pound penalty and keep the SSSA for no other reason besides they are cool.  I figure I need to go on a diet anyway and can easily lose that much.

 

I hope  this helps people.

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Terblanche designed his 999 and 749 with a conventional swingarm because it was lighter than the SSA. Ducati went back to the SSA for the 1098. Because it is cool! Oh, and wheel changes are quicker.

 

But the SSA is cool!! That's the main thing.

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I was really hoping it was going to be an anchor and make me go to a DSSA since I put a 2013 GSXR600 BPF with a 30mm extension on the front finding wheels to match is proving to be fun.  plus I really wanted to get rid of the stock rear wheel since it looks like it should be a spare wheel for a civic.  I am now trying to figure out the best way to put some forged wheels off a ducati 1098s on this. 

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If you can machine a hub  - or pay someone to do it - a 1098 rear wheel is doable! Carrozzeria used to make a kit.

 

An F4 front wheel/rotors will bolt right on, so that's a snap!

 

Good luck!

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The one thing you missed is that the VFR SSA is actually NO heavier than the CBR units, because the VFR has that massive 3 piston caliper & the massaive disk to go with it, 270x5mm compared to the CBR's 220x4mm. These components alone make that 8lb difference.

 

But the CBR600RR is a fully triangulated braced swingarm, which is much stiffer for the same weight. But that only matters when flat out on a race track, as the VFR arm is stiffer than many give it credit for. the CBR can carry a passenger, but the VFR was engineered TO carry a passenger & luggage plus the arm was originally designed for the RC45 so its pretty stiff.  I'd love to see a fluid dynamics cad stress model of the various arms out there.

 

SSA = super cool look, plus easy wheel changes :)  Gets my vote.

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I've got a 1098s rear wheel and an 848 front wheel on my 5th gen. 

1098 hub/eccentric/disc/sprocket etc etc fits in the vfr arm. A shim and spacer so it all lines up and done. 

 

And the 1098s wheel is very, very light, and my 5th gen fighter is down to 185kgs or so wet.

keep the ssa and use a 1098 rear wheel. Not 848, that is much harder.

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I've been looking at this Keef, after the amazing difference to the front suspension after taking 1.5kg of unsprung weight with the delink, I'm working on the rear including getting rid of the overweight VFR rear caliper.

Do you have a parts list needed for this rear swap?

I think you are near me in the hills district, if so and you don't mind PM me your number and I can pick your brain.

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My plan is to buy an 8th gen this year and optimize the suspension performance so I am following this thread for more info. I know there are significant changes like re designed SSA, wheels, delinked brakes to begin with. Look forward to seeing what you come up with.

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10 hours ago, keef said:

I've got a 1098s rear wheel and an 848 front wheel on my 5th gen. 

1098 hub/eccentric/disc/sprocket etc etc fits in the vfr arm. A shim and spacer so it all lines up and done. 

 

And the 1098s wheel is very, very light, and my 5th gen fighter is down to 185kgs or so wet.

keep the ssa and use a 1098 rear wheel. Not 848, that is much harder.

Funny,  I just picked up a complete 1098S swingarm/hub for $100 to look at this option.  I figured I could sell it and not lose any money if it didn't work.  Do you happen to have the specs for the shim and spacer needed to make this work? It would save me a bunch of time and beer!  Thanks

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12 hours ago, keef said:

I've got a 1098s rear wheel and an 848 front wheel on my 5th gen. 

1098 hub/eccentric/disc/sprocket etc etc fits in the vfr arm. A shim and spacer so it all lines up and done. 

 

And the 1098s wheel is very, very light, and my 5th gen fighter is down to 185kgs or so wet.

keep the ssa and use a 1098 rear wheel. Not 848, that is much harder.

 

keef, what does putting on an 848 front wheel/rotors entail? Easy? 

 

 

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Wow I thought the VFR Swingarm would be way heavier than that, makes me glad I decided to keep it and just do a rear wheel swap and single nut conversion to loose a bit of weight off the back.

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8 hours ago, Alaskan said:

 

keef, what does putting on an 848 front wheel/rotors entail? Easy? 

 

 

my 848 front wheel is in a set of 04/05 gsxr 600 forks/yokes, with  02 gsxr 1000 rotors and 03 gsxr 1000 calipers,

Essentially, spacers of various sizes, possibly a bearing change, i can't remember.

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11 hours ago, EMC2 said:

Funny,  I just picked up a complete 1098S swingarm/hub for $100 to look at this option.  I figured I could sell it and not lose any money if it didn't work.  Do you happen to have the specs for the shim and spacer needed to make this work? It would save me a bunch of time and beer!  Thanks

$100 is a absolute bargain.

I bought a driven quick change rear sprocket centre/hub, and had extreme creations custom make a 45T 530 rear sprocket for me. I had a fairly new chain and front sprocket at the time. I'll drop down to a 520 when it come time to replace them.

 

I dropped the wheel to ex creations to make an adapter set up like carro used to make, but as he had a spare vfr arm lying around, he figured out that the 1098 guts would be easier to transplant.

 

Spacer & shim.jpg

Spacer.jpg

Hub fitted.jpg

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Thanks Keef!!  This is much less work than I thought it was going to be.  After looking at what needed to be done I went ahead and bought wheels.  One last question..that torque arm bracket...is that custom or is that a part you bought.  I looks like it has a logo on it.

 

Again thanks for you time and info.

 

 

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Yeah, in Aus. Maybe an hours drive from me. Everything's for sale, just depends if you want to pay for it. But they don't keep a stockpile on the shelf- the market for 1098 rear wheel conversions on 17 year old vfrs is quite small. 

Some  things he may still has the program saved for his cnc machine, some things would have been done on the fly, like the spacer. And the bracket for my CBR side stand, recently. 

I have a vfr8 streetfighter thread. 

 

 

 

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23 hours ago, keef said:

Yeah, in Aus. Maybe an hours drive from me. Everything's for sale, just depends if you want to pay for it. But they don't keep a stockpile on the shelf- the market for 1098 rear wheel conversions on 17 year old vfrs is quite small. 

Some  things he may still has the program saved for his cnc machine, some things would have been done on the fly, like the spacer. And the bracket for my CBR side stand, recently. 

I have a vfr8 streetfighter thread. 

 

 

 

 

I bet if Extreme creation made a one stop package for the 1098 rear conversion, they would sell a bunch. I know I would jump on it if the price was right.

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1 hour ago, keef said:

I'll let Ben know.

he just made a plenum for a h2 that's going to have a go at a land speed record. 

 

Saw that, gee that's a nice looking piece of kit! Too bad it'll be hidden under the tank!

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